Annual leave first come first served - NHS

[MakeMineALarge1]

How can first come first served be fair when the calender is open and you are off for 2 weeks and end up missing out on one of the half terms and had planned to go away

I used to go in on NY day, when leave came available to book and do it then. And make no plans till it's signed off. These days I log in from home 1 minute passed midnight NYD and bag what I want.

Any date chosen will disadvantage someone. Any time of day will do likewise.

What I think would be better than wholly first come first served would be for a few times a year where there is likely to be oversubscribed to have some form of preference. Such as if you worked last Christmas, preference over those who did not.

I was informed it was first come first served but not when the calendar was open - the manager just said he would open it - but I was out of the country

Do you have an app/website version of the place you use at work the do this (my trust uses allocate/employee online, which you can access from home either via an app or directly as a website that you login to) that you can access on your computer/phone so that you don't have to be in work to request leave?

@MoonlightMemories no, its a very small team so its all done via email

If it was by email couldn’t you have logged on and sent your email request?

I think you just need to accept that you missed out this time, and at least you know for next time.

Ask your manager next time when the annual leave calendar will open, so you won't miss out.

Tell manager it isn't fair that the calendar "opened' while you were off do you missed out. My manager normally asks us to email our preferences for school holidays a few months in advance. You shouldn't book a holiday before securing the leave though just in case

It's not fair. I changed this in my little corner of the NHS to exclude school holidays (ie. the most popular A/L time for our team). Everyone logs what they'd like in those periods and the management team try to make it as fair as possible so that everyone gets something. It's tough going for the manager's to administer it, but it's better for the team.

I doubt the Trust's policy/guidance states that it's 'first come, first served'. It'll more likely be a general 'manager discretion'.

Of course putting this arrangement in place is effectively 'manager discretion' but it's lazy management and poor practice. It should be managed fairly.

Keep in mind though that if you're used to being the one who jumps in and books straight away and this was a one-off, if it changes to not be first come first served then obviously you're still not always going to get the time off.

The other option, as it was where I worked, was seniority then length of service. Either way it was never a good idea to book anything until your holiday request was authorised

Busy periods like school holidays we do requests, rest of year is first come first served. That system doesn’t sound fair at all

I really think it’s unfair being first come first served, as there’s always some selfish gits who book out all of Xmas and school half terms. Emailing preferences to manager before the calendar opens and them making sure everyone gets a fair allocation is much better (albeit more work for manager). First come first serve for any weeks left over is fine

First come first served is unfair for peak holiday times, it should be shared out so if you got what you wanted this year, someone else gets priority next year.

I know that is more work, but what happened to you really isn't fair.

For term time, I think it is fine as that tends to be more evenly spread anyway.

What?!

So the most senior people get first choice, followed by the people who had been there the longest?

Followed by everyone else? So someone who had only been there a few months would have to take what was left?

That's the most unfair way I've ever seen. Thankfully I've never come across this.

When you say you missed out on one of the half terms, do you mean you got leave for some or all of the others?

That sounds pretty good going to me.

It was formal guidance when i joined the Civil Service many years ago that if there were competing requests the senior ( as in longer serving) member of staff got priority.

It did change over time to a fairer system ( just as I got into the category of being ‘longer’ serving, lol).

The leave charts opened on a certain day and closed a few weeks later. Most leave requests went through - and there was a Bun Fight for peak times.

That’s rubbish that you aren’t using EOL as you can put in requests for future leave years (I’ve put mine in for 2024!)

if by email then I’d be tempted to email across my requests for the next year even before the ‘window’ opens so that you have a record anyway as any formal ‘windows’ would have set dates for opening etc and this doesn’t seem the case here

When I was in the NHS as team member and manager, this was an ongoing issue. One of my bosses ended up saying in July and August people could only take 2 weeks, unless really extenuating circumstances.
Same for half terms - people could have 1 or possibly 2 . People with partners who are teachers etc got the same access to school holiday as parents.

It ended up as a bit draconian, but it was the only way to share things out fairly, otherwise some peole got first pick and others got nothing. In all the departments I worked, requests were collated at the end of January, and leave allocated. People could swap beteen themselves but the department had to be covered with the right people at the right grade..
I applied similar to smaller departments. Sometimes, the manager was unpopular, but at least people realised that we were trying to be fair.

We always try to share out school holidays too. We have several parents in our team and nobody gets all the half terms, it’s not fair on others. I have October this year, but not May. Seems perfectly fair to me.

We used to do first come first serve. Wed broadcast the date it was due weeks in advance. And you were guaranteed one spring, one winter and 2 summer week. But it was more priority first come first serve I suppose. Because if someone had 3 summer weeks they wouldn't get them.

First come, first served is what l have always seen in the NHS. Manager really should have given everyone a heads up about when requests can begin. It’s unrealistic to expect to get all the school holidays, by the sounds of it you got the majority. School holidays will always be popular especially the summer one. Plus people without children may well want to be off as well due to the weather, weddings, festivals, teacher friends etc

We discuss amongst ourselves what we want and work out between us. Never had any problems that way.
Don’t agree with first come first served. Just because some arse is quick off the mark they get everything.

I use to run an NHS team. Rules fornschiol holidays for all were requests only 2 weeks only in summer unless you were getting married or had other exceptional reason and 2 of 3 half terms . This applied to all staff not just those with ids or teacher partners. Christmas also included. People knew if they asked for May they probably wouldn't get October. One member staff always wanted February to ski so never got easter. It worked and stopped arguments

Me and the other person both have school children - she has got all of her first choices, I have got everything else I need apart from October - I can probably take either side but that means taking him out of school. So yes I am more than happy to accept missing out on it, it just the principle of first come first served when its not clear when the calender opens from and it isn't formally announced yet someone who has been there longer does know this and gets priority