Wrong dog

[Fasthorses23]

I know, he's not a 'wrong dog' in fact he's an absolutely lovely wee boy but he's the wrong dog for his owners. He's a border collie and he's 2 , going on 3 so was bought in lockdown as a pup when said owners were at home all day. They live in a 2 bed semi with a small garden and are now back working full time. They probably want the majority of the dogs care to fall to me now. He's a lovely natured boy but has a lot of issues. He's very nervous, scared of loud noises, has IBS? So limited diet, no recall on walks, pulls when walking on the lead. At my home he pees in the bathrooms so we have to be vigilant about closing doors. He humps cushions and he's absolutely petrified of my grandchild who's 4 so cowers away in a corner ( I'm always in and out looking after and reassuring him) I absolutely 100% know that this is not the dogs fault but everyone keeps saying they shouldn't have bought a dog in lockdown blah blah. He's here now though so what should I do?

What should I do then?

No I never ever leave them together. The pup has his own safe spaces in our house and the grandchild is never allowed in unless I'm there

Oof! This sounds really hard, poor you and poor dog but I agree your GC is your no 1 responsibility while you have him with you.

I have a nervy lockdown border collie (only just turned two) and she doesn’t like little children. I think I made a mistake in many ways as she is hard work but I love her. I would never leave her alone with little children but she is fully house trained, walks well on a lead and has decent recall after lots of training (novice dog owner). Am also working through the KC obedience levels, she is on fluoxetine and we are looking into agility.

I think if your son won’t give this dog up and you are willing to look into some ideas then what I have found most helpful is

• classes, it’s not just pups, there are a lot of older and rescue dogs learning and reinforcing their training

• one to one training sessions to work on specific issues like recall or lead walking

• tricks - collies are very clever and like to learn new stuff, some helpful books etc

• toys, my girl loves tuggy toys and outside loves a ball, we can’t let her have one in the house as she is obsessed! Ball outside can help with recall.

• medication like fluoxetine (you need the vet for this I think) can reduce anxiety. There are over the counter meds too like adaptil but it sounds like this boy is quite nervy and might need vet meds.

good luck, this shouldn’t be your problem but it sounds like it has become it!!! Xx

My grandchild comes first

@Fasthorses23
please tell them do NOT have an anxious male dog neutered without a professional behavioural assessment first!

removing his testosterone will almost certainly worsen his anxiety which is likely to lead to an increase in destructive and aggressive behaviours
they really need an ASAB accredited behaviourist to assess him

Thank you. I'm so thankful for your support. Xx

@Fasthorses23 please tell them not to neuter him without a behavioural assessment.

removing his testosterone will reduce his confidence and increase his anxiety - it will likely make his destructive, fearful or aggressive behaviours worse or start to emerge.

they must see an ASAB approved behaviourist or they are likely to ruin this dog’s life

this Is ridiculously simple. Just tell them the dog is no longer allowed at your house.

im guessing the parents of the young child are in no rush to host the untrained dog or to visit the errant dog owners with their child so that will keep the child and the dog separated. It will also keep the dog from damaging your home and from becoming your responsibility in any way. Let them solve their own problem.

Well you'de be wrong then

I'm appalled.
How can people be so utterly DENSE and do no research.

A Border Collie is absolutely the worst dog to have as a ''Pet'' if one isn't into training and doing lots of work to keep the Collie happy and active.

Someone I know of bought a BC in lockdown , and the poor dog suffers.

We advised her a BC was absolutely the wrong type of dog, pleaded with her not to get the puppy, but she wouldn't be deterred.

Deeply selfish and the dog suffers.

BC's are hair trigger reactive, this one @Fasthorses23 sounds extremely fearful, and you owe it to that poor dog to re~home to a reputable rescue, but it sounds like the crucial early socialisation was never done {Afraid of everything} and not even house trained?
Jeez.

It's so utterly depressing that people buy and ruin dogs by not socialising them.
The Greeder should never have sold such a dog to an irresponsible home like this.

Poor dog.

Why? Why is the dog at your house in the first place? This thread makes no sense.

Agree 100%.
Castration can make anxiety and fear become much worse.

Poor dog.

He needs re~homing via a BC breed rescue ASAP.

If you’ve got the dog regularly you can probably teach it recall and not pulling. You can also provide lots of puzzles/toys for enrichment and long walks. If the grandchild can give treats that might enable positive association.

Thank you for for your post I've just found it in amongst all the crap about border collies and it's really cheered me up. I'm not giving up on him

You don't have to have this dog in your home. And if I were you, I wouldn't.

There isn't any reason that two adults who are capable of working full time can't understand the needs of a dog, or what you're saying to them. They clearly just aren't overly interested because they don't want to spend any time or expense on it and at the moment they've got it set up so they can take advantage of you and let it all fall to you and have no interest in switching that around or taking responsibility.

I'd not treat a parent (or a dog!) like this and I don't think most people would expect someone else to look after the dog they chose to get on a full time workweek basis, whilst not actively looking after it anyway.

Poor dog sounds lovely and is the one that's going to suffer here, and is, but it's owners are letting it down regardless of whether they are your relatives and that's hard to swallow.

They need to at the very least find a dog trainer to start asap in their own time to work on these issues, and a dog walker to provide decent structured walks to appropriately meet the needs of the breed and socialise it. I don't think it's unreasonable to ask them to do this (or indeed ask them to pay a dog sitter a few days a week) and if they say no or don't want to I would tell them I just can't look after it if they won't. It's their responsibility for goodness sake.

Excuse me?

Bit harsh when the poster is asking a genuine question.

You haven’t said why the dog stays with you? Is this during the weekends, every day during the week etc? Is your son dropping the dog at yours so he can go to work? Your situation isn’t really clear.

Anyway what’s the point of him owning a dog but wanting to train it and put the effort it that’s needed? It seems like he’s leaving all the hard work up to you…

Just be careful about the grandchild giving treats - it can unwittingly put the dog in a conflicted state (they want the treat but don't want to be near the child; they want to both approach and retreat) which can escalate to aggression.

@Fasthorses23 what are you actually wanting here? If you actually want to keep the dog and are confident that can manage to always keep it separate from the child, then people can give you ideas on how to move forward, but I think we're all just really concerned about this dog around your grandchild. If you are wanting to keep the dog then employing a reputable behaviourist (not trainer) would be crucial for a start.

If you do want to keep the dog, could you rehome it from your son so the dog doesn't have to deal with two different houses with two different sets of expectations?

This is a horrible situation your son has put you in, but now that you’re in it and he isn’t listening to your concerns, then I think you have a couple of options.
You could tell them you can’t watch their dog for them while they’re at work, and don’t…
Or, you can assume ownership of the dog while he’s in your care. By that I mean, arrange a trainer or classes and take him yourself, speak to the vet about some anti anxiety medication, possibly fluoxetine as a precious poster said, get some toys and things you can use at home to get his brain going and stop him being bored.
You could view this as a best of both worlds scenario where you get to hand him back in the evening, don’t have to pay for food etc for him, don’t need to arrange kennels when you’re going on holiday, but do get the companionship and fun that having a dog gives you.
Obviously you don’t have to do any of that, and your son is being massively unfair to have put you in this position, but if you wanted to make the best of it then that’s what I’d do in your shoes.

It’s fine that your grandchild comes first. “Stop having your grandson round when you have dog.” Just means not having the dog around whenever the GC is there. It doesn’t mean telling your GC they can’t come.

You talk about the dog having a safe space in your home but go on to say that the grandchild is allowed in there when you’re there. That’s not a safe space for the dog. Stop having them in the house together until you’ve got the dog to a place where he’s not so nervous. Tell your DS that you can’t have the dog when your GC is there.

When you do have the dog, do the training, affection giving and exercise that your DS should be giving it.

If you get it well trained, well exercised and trusting you, you may be able to introduce your GC and have them together (though never in the same room without you and make sure the dog has a safe space that actually is safe).

As a new puppy owner I've been watching lots of dog trainers on tiktok and youtube recently to start my pup off on the right paw.. One trainer in particular has named collies as one of the worst dogs to have as a pet owner with children, not because theyre 'bad dogs' per se but due to the input required, herding instincts they are not ideal especially if they arent given the appropriate input and exercise. . This man knows his stuff... Will Atherton. Take heed re your grandchild.

Sorry, but you sound as bad as them. You came here asking for advice, got some excellent adviser, and have dismissed most of it and even resorted to personal attacks on people you don't agree with. This dog deserves better than all of you. You want a quick fix so that you can enable your entirely irresponsible son, but nobody is putting the dog or its needs first. There are a number of highly reputable rehoming organisations for the breed. They need to give the dog up to one so that it stands a chance of a decent life with someone who cares about it.