To think you can want to have kids on a basic level, but not want to *raise* kids?

[bdbd1996]

I'm in my mid-20s. Partner and I initially said we wanted kids, our relationship is moving forward steadily and recently we decided that we most likely won't have kids.

This actually came about quite randomly. I think I want kids on a "that would be cute" level and I always imagined I'd have kids. I didn't think I'd meet a man who wouldn't want kids, I just assumed it would be a passage I'd go down.

However, I have no desire to raise kids. This particular concept was literally the pinnacle of my decision.

Whilst I like the idea of having a child as an abstract concept, I have to be honest with myself that the sacrifices that come with having a child are not things that would make me happy. My desire to retain certain aspects of my lifestyle, the realities of actually raising a child and my personal circumstances outweigh everything.

First, I'm bipolar and I hate feeling trapped. I know I can fluctuate, I move around a lot with my partner, we have no plans to stay settled in one country and I know this kind of lifestyle wouldn't fit in with the average child. On a more everyday level, I am also a very spontaneous person. I don't necessarily think this is because I am bipolar when it comes to an everyday level, but I love last minute things and plans and when I feel trapped or don't have this spontaneity, my mental health suffers. I can't even stand being in jobs that are not flexible or don't give me the ability to manage my own time.

Second, my chosen career is a tough one, and I haven't even qualified yet. I don't want to be too outing, but whilst it comes with good compensation and a high level of prestige, it's incredibly stressful, hard to plan and one of those careers were last minute things always seem to pop up. Some nights I can be there until ten. I know woman can "have it all," however I don't realistically see how I can maintain my dream career to the level I do now whilst also raising children. It would be hellish.

I recharge alone. I'm an extrovert, but I need time alone to refresh. I get frustrated and impatient if I can't be alone for at least part of the day and I know if I had children, I would never have the same level of alone time that I have now. My weekend lie-ins are a large part of my mental health routine- stupid as that sounds- and I use the weekends to recharge from my job. I can't imagine having to get up early Saturday and do various activities such as clubs or sports for children. That would severely impact me mentally and I'm already bipolar, which is hard enough.

Lastly, the cost. Even with a potential well-paying career, childcare is so extortionate. Plus the bigger house. And everything that comes with that. I live in central London right now, which is obviously expensive. If I move, it will be to another large, non-UK city.

Essentially, the idea of raising children and the reality of that is not something I want. Giving up my disposable income, flexibility and free-time is something I know will make me unhappy and is just completely at odds with my personality, my lifestyle, my mental health needs and even how I am happiest. However, despite this, I feel an almost type of milder grief that I won't have children. I suppose I'm being realistic myself and what is best for me, but as much as I feel sad that I've come to this decision and a weird kind of sentiment for the path I've chosen not to go down, I feel a very resolute, final sense of relief.

AIBU to think you can want to have kids, or like the idea of having kids on a more abstract level, without actually wanting to raise children or definitely have kids? Or just want kids but realise the reality doesn't fit in with your lifestyle or the reality isn't something you'd realistically enjoy?

Also, FWIW, my partner and I's original plan was to have kids in our mid-30s. We got onto this conversation as we both kept making comments about how we'd "have to stop X then" and then we had the conversation(s) that lead to this decision.

And further, if anyone wants to know why I'm on Mumsnet, I used to be a nanny and would follow threads here for advice. I love children and I loved the children I cared for, I certainly don't dislike children, I'm just not sure I want them permanently in my life!

Plenty of people in their mid 20s have no desire to raise kids - that's not unusual.

For many, that changes at some point in the next 20 years. For some, it doesn't 🤷🏻‍♀️

I can really relate to much of what the OP has said except I certainly don’t have a high flying career.

On one level I’m a bit sad about not being a parent because I know have maternal instincts and would love any child I had. Having said that I’m not really parent material. I barely manage to look after myself and my dog and am somewhat quirky with poor social skills and few friends (possibly ASD but not diagnosed). Not sure I could help a child navigate friends and relationships when my own skills are so poor.

I just think back to being an awkward, lonely teen and would hate a child to go through the same thing,

I think if you recharge through time alone, you are an introvert.

My sister’s mental health depends strongly on alone time, she’s a highly sociable introvert. She decided early on not to have kids, and having seen how all-encompassing it has been for me, I think she made the right decision. It’s relentless, you have to be willing to put your own hopes / dreams / desires to the side for a while and there isn’t a lot of alone time (typing this while in bed with my poor DS2 who broke his arm yesterday - he going to need a lot of company for the next few weeks).

I remember really, really wanting children in my twenties - and I'm so relieved now that it never happened, despite trying to with a couple of long-term partners.

I don't have a high-flying career but I do run my own business and absolutely love what I do. I also have an expensive hobby that I'd need to knock on the head if I had children as I wouldn't be able to justify the cost anymore.

DH has a hobby that is weather dependent so it's not something you can plan to do in advance - it's very much a case of "the weather is perfect this afternoon so I'm going out for a few hours" - he couldn't do that if we had young children.

I find these threads tend to be quite split though - you get a majority of posters saying "Good for you for thinking it through" and a small minority who seem to get personally offended at the very thought of other people not wanting children!

@InTheFutilityRoomEatingBiscuits ’s post is a good one. There is no ‘one correct way’ to raise a child. We were planning to remain childfree till we decided to ttc when I was a few months under 40. DS is now almost 11. Our careers are still consumingly important to us both (in fact, having a child and associated time constraints has made me more productive), we’ve lived in three countries since his birth, I still need a lot of time alone, we both travel for work, and DS mucks in. Disrupted sleep is a short, temporary thing. Only having one child was deliberate. I adore DS, but my life hasn’t changed exponentially. We live in a big old house we’re renovating in a city centre, and our lives certainly don’t revolve around taking DS to sports clubs at the crack of dawn at weekends. I haven’t had a personality transplant. Don’t imagine your lifestyle if you had children would necessarily follow that of the families you nannied for. There’s no compulsory pattern.

Having said that, I’m pretty sure we’d be just as happy had we not had DS, only differently.

Sounds perfectly reasonable OP. I’m not sure it required such a long post though.

However, I would say most people in their mid 20s have no desire to raise kids. They’re too busy enjoying their freedom and working on their careers. Things can change significantly when you reach your 30s.

I was the opposite, with my high school boyfriend and couldn't wait to have kids. Then I discovered there was more to life, broke up with him, travelled etc, was confused in my 30s wondering what to do, then decided to go for it when I was about 37. But of course everyone is different

I have a few friends who feel like you do. They're amazing with children and my son adores them but they have zero interest in having their own.

I'm actually quite envious of them! I feel the same but ended up having a child and I regret it. He's great but I should have been more honest with myself.

I felt exactly the same in my mid-20's.......
I felt exactly the same in my mid-30's.......

Had DS at 39 and DD at 42. Best decision I've ever made, I love them more than I ever thought possible. Don't feel like I sacrificed anything as I did everything I wanted for myself for 20+ years.

You may or may not change your mind but just enjoy your life in the moment, you don't have to make the decision right now.

I think it’s very reasonable to realise that you don’t want to raise children. I wish more people realised the difference between “let’s have a baby” and “ let’s devote our lives to another person for the next 16 years, ensuring that their well-being is at front and centre of all our life choices”.

Good call op.
You do what us best for you.

Sounds like you've thought it through and made the right decision. Just be open to possibly feeling different in the future.

You sound very sensible.

So many people think about having ‘a baby’ at say, 35. Yet forget to think whether they want to be parenting a 15-year-old at 50. We forget to think of our lives in linear terms sometimes.

We have one. For many reasons mostly out of our hands. I am often glad we never managed two, as parenting is hard. I am an introvert and the early years nearly finished me off as no alone time.

You know yourself and what your needs are.

It's the exact right way to look at it and I think a lot more people should think through the reality more - some people don't even consider the obvious things like sleepless nights and impact to earning potential and long term security before having a child, never mind the relentlessness of toddler parenthood or the fresh hell that parenting a teenager can be! Lots of people either go 'ooh I like babies' or 'oh I fancy having a little kid to take to the park and have cuddles on the sofa with' when it's a huge responsibility, to shape a mind, a life.

You know yourself and your circumstances the most intricately of all. Nobody can argue with that and your decisions and reasoning are completely valid, of course.

From personal experience, once I'd completed my life goals (found partner, house, travelled, all the promotions I'd gone for and wanted) that I'd set for myself, the urge for 'more' hit me out of nowhere and all I could think about was having a family. Not to say you will but just be open minded that you might feel differently in 10 years time and instinct to procreate in some cases is a loud and persistent voice.

Enjoy your age and stage as it is now-you sound like a really switched on and tuned in individual.

IME, it is perfectly possible to "want" children, because that is an emotional (biological?) response.
However, as soon as you start thinking about it logically you can "know" that NOT having children is absolutely the right decision. Just "wanting" something is absolutely no reason to go ahead, especially for such an important thing.

I can totally relate to this. In fact I belive if men were expected to be SAH parents they'd be less children.
You have decided against having children because you believe they would take over your life snd would need 100% commitment.....forever.
It's not like dating where you can see how it goes, it's like signing up for marriage on a first date. The idea is that you remain committed to that child forever.
I think in a few generations child rearing (like marriage and heterosexuality) will not be viewed as default settings. Maybe folk will ask 'what made you choose to have children' rather than why you didn't. There's still an element of maybe you couldn't....and sadly I've heard people single out the woman and say SHE didn't want kids. If you're in a relationship ensure your partner takes equal responsibility for any decisions, not say 'I didn't mind either way'

I'm currently thinking through whether I want kids or not, too. I love the idea of having kids, particularly older kids, but don't think I could cope with the pre-school phase.. and obviously it wouldn't be fair to have them when I feel like this.

I'm too selfish, I love my 'me-time' too much.

You've nailed it. Very sensible thinking. Remember your reasons when tempted and enjoy the freedom childlessness gives to the extreme!

"AIBU to think you can want to have kids, or like the idea of having kids on a more abstract level, without actually wanting to raise children or definitely have kids? Or just want kids but realise the reality doesn't fit in with your lifestyle or the reality isn't something you'd realistically enjoy?"

That's the reality for a lot of men. They want children, but they want the Mother to do the donkey work and make the sacrifices.

My DD'S friend is saying that she wants a baby, but doesn't like the idea of having to do the school run and other aspects of turning a child into a healthy, functioning adult. Her DH absolutely doesn't want one yet. It's great that couples are able to be more honest.

Very few women are truly willing to make the sacrifices needed to raise children especially when there are now much better options for them in terms of careers and earning potential, this is why why the population will decline sharply with subsequent generations.
Of course lots of women plan to wait until they are older, and who can blame them but it's harder to conceive and the quality of sperm and egg declines as we age meaning that children born to older parents are likely to be less healthy.
The best time to have a child in terms of the health of the mother and the baby is in your early 20s but from every other point of view this is not a good time for most.

That's the reality for a lot of men. They want children, but they want the Mother to do the donkey work and make the sacrifices.

I agree men want children because it makes them look good, it makes them look like stable capable family men, it's a way of proving to other men that they have the ability to dominate and subdue a woman, to make her work for them and bear children for them.
However increasingly women are refusing to be dominated and subdued by men, in response to this men, realising that they are now expected to do do a fair share of the work and sacrifice required to raise the child are either doing everything they possibly can to avoid said work and sacrifice, or deciding they don't want to be parents after all

I have one child (deliberately) because I thankfully recognised that I just couldn't cope with another as I found it so hard. I almost got suckered into having another because of lack of sibling guilt. Thank FUCK I saw sense.

It's difficult to summarise just how difficult the 0-5 period is, or at least they were for me! And sadly the early years drag on for, well, YEARS!

The hardest bits about parenthood for me so far:

The noise - crying/screaming baby, followed by a tantrumming toddler and then argumentative preschooler.

Lack of sleep - resulted in the development of my severe anxiety.

Lack of family help - this is a big one imo.

Loss of spontaneity - I have struggled with this a lot

Lack of 'me time' - I have more now that he is older but for years I had practically none. This undoubtedly contributed to my poor mental health during this period

Trying to coordinate and organise the million things that he needs to do for school, plus clubs, seeing his friends. I work full time too so I'm very busy during the week and then I still can't switch off at the weekend.

They are at the forefront of EVERYTHING you do. Yes things are easier now, he is 8 years old and mostly a delight. But, the enormity and responsibility still plays on my mind a lot.

I think you need to be very careful given your mental health condition too. Having a child can massively worsen symptoms for all of the aforementioned reasons.

I think if you recharge through time alone, you are an introvert.

Yes I agree with this. I'm the same, I love socialising but I need time alone or I'd go crazy.

Anyway, I think it's good that you are thinking deeply about having kids before doing it mindlessly like a lot of people seem to do. You're young so maybe you'll change your mind or maybe you won't but you don't really need to decide now.

I think that your reasons for not wanting children at the moment, or ever are valid. I’m 27 and pregnant with my first child. When I met my partner (31) he had similar reasons to you for not wanting children and was adamant through most of his 20’s that he would never have children. Obviously he did end up changing his mind. We travelled a lot and had a lot of fun, it felt like the right time for both of us.

I also know there are people that know from their teens that they do not really want to raise children and are happy with their decision for their own valid reasons.

You might change your mind, you might not. Whatever you choose you shouldn’t let anyone judge you for!