To expect that a hospital should be able to meet my dietary needs?

[Balloonsandroses]

Pretty sure I’m not being unreasonable! Been in hospital 24 hours now and just been to eat a meal for the first time (my choice). There is nothing gluten free. I have coeliac disease which they’ve known since admission. Gluten makes me vomit. So I can literally eat pepper, cucumber and lettuce. To add insult to injury this is a psych ward and I was admitted under section (still furious about this) so I can’t even leave and go and buy some food.

When I was in hospital they actually managed to give me a gf diet but I can imagine how stressful it must be. As an aside I don't think ctual marmite is gf either, altough some own brand are. It can also be hard to eat vegetarian g/f as often substitutes are bulked out with wheat.

I hope they sort out some food soon and you are feeling better.

Yes, it actually happens. It’s been happening for years and it’s been happening under both parties.

Everyone in hospital is a tiny minority, because everyone in hospital is there for a different reason. Food is not considered as part of the treatment plan, even when patients come in with pre-existing conditions that are treated by a special diet.

So hospitals outsource their catering to the cheapest bidder and patients are expected to eat food that will make them ill.

As a T1 myself, this actually is really flipping scary!

I was refrain from posting on here.. but oh well.

To anyone saying YABU you have no clue.
Providing food that meets medical requirements is part of a treatment protocol, just like taking medicines.

There is no medicine to treat Coeliac disease and there’s nothing you can do about it other than avoid it.
There’s also different levels of symptoms, some have extreme reactions and some are more mild.

and to jump on the band wagon of special diets like diabetics. It is ridiculous to call the diabetic menu as such because it’s still of sugar! Full on simple carbs and foods that are high in the glycemic index scale. (For those fortunate enough to not even know what that is or what it means, it’s an index used to derive of how quickly and by how much a specific food raises blood sugar. So anything on the high end of the scale, like Bananas, candy, sugar, juices, white bread, white pasta, rice, pizza, pastries and baked goods, potatoes, etc is a no go unless in very tiny portions like spoon sized - unless you want to feel sick).

in regards to diets like Veganism, vegetarianism, Halal and kosher.

First of all, while the first is a choice and the rest are a religious practice (the second could be either), they could all be taken down with one stone. Offer decent vegan meals.
a Muslim, a Jew, a vegetarian AND a vegan can eat vegan food.

a Muslim, a Jew and a vegetarian can eat vegetarian food.

Lastly, some people do choose veganism for some health reasons and it does work for them. I’d say that if for a short 1-3 days stay they could adapt to vegetarian food at least or be given the choice to make alternatives arrangements, same is for other choices like Pescatarian, Keto etc.
As you wouldn’t have severe health consequences unlike say a coeliac or vegetarian.

As a Muslim is happily eat anything vegetarian or vegan.

Coming back to the diabetic meals I’ve never bothered with them and just ate the normal meals as they had basically the same amount of sugar or very negligible differences.

Several times I’ve had my self management taken away from me and in the past I’ve inadvertently sneaked in my own supplies (just had them in a bag as usual) and haven’t told them I did.
Several times I was thankful I had my own insulin, because no, I can take it half an hour after I’ve eaten! If anything I need it half an hour before I even smell food! and don’t get me started in testing blood sugar!

Once they asked to take my insulin pump away and I had to sternly refuse and use the magic “I do not consent”.

I am very sorry OP and I hope it gets better for you.
I have never used PALS, but I would if you can and if you cannot I would raise a complaint and make it own you will escalate it.

I believe that what the NHS probably needs is a long list of court cases.
because I would personally argue that not providing food for a coeliac is medically negligent as is providing food that you cannot actually eat due to coeliac disease.

So the expectation to not starve or have constant diarrhoea, vomiting, malnutrition, risk of ungoing problems from not being able to absorb any nutrients whilst being a coeliac on a ward that you cannot leave is too high? Good grief.

I am so sorry about what you’ve gone through.
This is one of the most terrifying things I’ve heard.
Honestly, I care about the NHS, but an overhaul is needed.

i would hope to sue the F out of them and the doctors and people who entered your home illegally. I said in a previous post that unless and until the NHS is flooded with lawsuits for inexcusable stuff like this, it won’t change.

I reiterate, not catering for a medical necessity = gross medical negligence given diet is the ONLY treatment of Coeliac disease.

It's a basic part of patient care to provide a filling meal.

There should be at least one vegan/vegetarian option, a gluten free option and lactose free option. It doesn't need to be anything fancy or even particularly tasty, but filling and safe to eat.

There should be toast/basic sandwiches on offer too for anyone that isn't upto a full meal, or has been admitted after meal orders have been submitted.

If someone is unwell enough to be admitted to hospital for a long enough period of time that they need to eat meals there then there should be something for everyone.

Imagine being gluten free due to coeliac disease and having no access to food, being unable to leave your hospital bed, and not having anybody that can bring in food for you.

It's piss poor, just like most nhs services at the moment.

Please get in touch with pals for your hospital . I’m guessing you have a phone available you can look up the details there . Things are different on psyc wards but they still have a duty of care . If no reply ask your husband to do it for you . Also big hugs I’ve been on your position

I’m not surprised you’re anxious about the hospital food, I would be too. Not many medical people realise how serious coeliac disease is and how seriously it should be taken.
Hopefully your husband can bring you in food you know is fine and is tastier than hospital food. Can he bring a bag of fruit that you can eat as that needs no preparation or special storage?
Hope you’re better soon.

A banana would have me writhing around on the floor in pain. Last time i ate one was 2009 Co codamol does the same thing.

How is a hospital run without 24/7 pharmacy? I don’t doubt it’s done, but it’s very impracticable.

But that’s not true though. Any diet based in processed foods is shit. Most meat eaters I know fill their faces with unhealthy cancer causing, heart attack inducing processed junk. Most meat eaters I know are obese and lacking in essential vitamins because they don’t eat enough fruit snd veg.

You can get everything you need from a plant based diet. Most vegans I know are much more nutritionally aware than meat eaters, thinner and generally look after their bodies more.

Wish I knew how to link, I've just seen another thread where old people aren't even having their teeth cleaned and they're lucky to be showered. This really is a disgrace 😔

When my mum (68, full mental capacity) was in hospital with a broken hip the nurses kept putting incontinence pads on her and telling her to wee on the pads and they’ll change her later. Because they couldn’t be bothered to take her to the toilet. She said it was degrading and humiliating. People aren’t being looked after in hospital, in lots of different ways. Food is only one aspect of the problem.

Why don’t you want the NHS to treat certain medical conditions? The treatment for coeliacs disease is a gluten free diet. I have two life threatening allergies, the treatment for my condition is to not touch or consume those food stuffs.

Its a bit strange that you want the NHS to purposely make people unwell so they need more medical care which costs the NHS more, requires more stafffing and means that person is taking up a bed for longer.

I was given my allergens at chelsea and westminster, St Thomas’ and Addenbrookes. St Thomas’ had taken my epi-pen off me on admission (I became unconscious in A&E, so couldn’t hide my pen). I’d had emergency surgery and could barely move, I had to get myself out of bed and crawl for help, this caused complications which led to my wound opening and I was then due to be in for 6-8 weeks for it to heal rather than 4-5 days. If I hadn’t been able to crawl out of bed I would have died. I had to discharge myself early as they were either going to kill me by feeding me things or by denying me my epi-pen and insulin.

A hospital doesn’t need to cater to dietary choices, even deeply held choices.

Celiac is not a choice. It is a medical requirement. not providing a safe menu for a patient with an allergy or intolerance is negligent.

This. ^^

Vegan should always be available simply because no one's religion or culture bans it.

Years ago Gordon Ramsey set up a catering course in a prison. In one episode he asks if this group of prisoners can cook the prison food for one lunch. The prison staff agreed but he couldn't do his original idea because of the options offered for cultural and other needs, I think there were about 5 options including vegan.

If a prison can do it then a hospital should.

This is why management should spend some time working on wards and doing it at weekends / nights etc.

@walkinthewoodstoday

WTF? Why did you @ me and tell me off?

I'm on the OP's side. I bloody defended her to the twits calling her needs a fad diet.

I hope this thread has educated people about coeliac disease, it isn't a fad or a fashionable choice. It's bloody horrible to be honest.

I’m my experience it’s always cottage pie

The NHS has introduced a Patient Safety strategy. There is a patient safety learning curriculum that EVERYONE has to do. I waded through it on Friday. It's mind numbing.
But I would encourage OP @Balloonsandroses and anyone else wishing to complain to take a look and use their risk management statements to point out how their dietary management systems are a systems failure which put them at risk of harm.
Send the complaint to the Trust CEO and ward manager and patent safety manager.

www.england.nhs.uk/patient-safety/the-nhs-patient-safety-strategy/

Note the fFramework for involving patients in patient safety which can be referred to, eg when insulin and epicene are removed from patients.

Complaining to CEO, Chief Nurse and ward manager got results pretty quickly when I had to complain after finding my 92 year old, frail mother who had been admitted following a fall and serious fracture around the pin put in following a previous fall had not been placed on an air mattress. For various reasons it was three days after her admission when I was first able to visit, her risk assessment included putting her on an air mattress and one had been ordered and was on the ward but no one could be bothered to set it up, dismantle her traction and transfer her on to it. I quoted from the hospital statements on pressure area care and prevention of pressure ulcers in my complaint.

That's how to get them running.

It's not about 'just managing'. Coeliacs can't 'just manage'. It's akin to giving someone who has severe peanut allergy and gets anaphylactic shock a diet with nuts in and going 'oh they just have to manage' albeit with a slower death cycle. It gives them an immediate effect which is damaging to their health and will prevent them from a normal recovery for whatever illnesses they are in hospital for.

You make it sound like this is optional for hospitals by saying 'is it even possible?' Of course it's possible. It's a health and safety protocol which hospitals are technically legally bound to adhere to. Restaurants are legally bound and in recent years have had to up their game over this due to prosecutions over negligence. Hospitals have to prove the right medication - they can't give the wrong patient the wrong drugs and the wrong dosage without major implications. The same should be true for food.

The fact that we even have to have the conversation given this is a) a medical condition b) the recent publicity over tragic cases of people with food intolerances and allergies is astounding and the ignorance shown on this thread about nutrition generally is appalling.

The OP is in a mental health wing under section. She should be safeguarded. This is a very basis safeguarding fail. The trust should be prosecutable for it.

As for the vegan v not vegan stuff - again it comes down to medical need. The reason that there are a lot of vegans who lack certain vitamins/protein etc in their diet is down to poor diet management. Just like we have lots of meat eaters who have poor diet management. Being vegan alone doesn't automatically mean you are healthier. However a nutritionist should be able to construct a diet for vegans which covered those gaps. And as such should be able to construct a meal plan for hospitals which would be balanced for certain categories of patients. Should being the appropriate word.

I believe there have been studies into how well people are whilst in hospital and recovery success / times. Patients who ate better and we're given better quality food recovered better and more quickly. It freed up beds more efficiently. Think about it. It's not really remotely surprising. In a race to the bottom over the level of food available, how does serving inedible slop that patients don't want to eat and which I have no doubt leads to more food waste, help the NHS with it's problems. It's yet another of these false economies.

Patients should get the appropriate food for their needs. Not gourmet food. But food that they will eat in line with their dietary requirements. That does include lifestyle choices for me, because many people will prefer to go hungry otherwise and that's counterproductive for the NHS's needs not just the patient concerned. It should be within reason and sensible in meeting basic levels which it clearly doesn't. No one should ever fear that their health with be endangered by what they are offered to eat in hospital and it's clear from this thread there is a massive issue with that which is nothing short of a scandal.

If the NHS can't be bothered to feed coeliacs the right food whilst in their care for other illnesses and cause them physical harm as a result, it means the cost of treating their coeliac symptoms and damage increases as they have more extensive conditions. This is not rocket science. Any old idiot should be able to work this out. And yet we have the NHS failing to do this and lots of the public still failing to grasp that it's not something you can just 'manage' with the wrong food.

There are some posts on this thread which are utterly bewildering and self centered.

In the hospital.I worked in the pharmacy was only open Monday to Friday ,9-5and a couple of hours in a Saturday and Sunday ,there was an out of,hours cupboare ,but that was a ballache to access having to bleep the on call pharmacist who was at home and wait until they got in etc,,if a ward ran out of something they would more likely phone other wards to see if they had it in stock.