To wonder why is Mumsnet so anti-car?

[Ticketsto]

There is at least one thread a week on here demonizing cars! What is with all the hate? I know they cause pollution and can kill people however they’ve revolutionized the way we live! Not all of us are fortunate enough to live somewhere with good public transport.

Yes, it will never work for everyone but that's not an excuse not to start trying to make it work for most people.

I've not been to a single place in Europe where public roads aren't paved.
That's nuts. My road for a start isn't and it's by far the minority in my area.
Betraying your own townie roots there I am afraid.

Fact is cars offer freedom to people and particularly women that can't be replicated unless we have a massive change in society.
Until I can guarantee I am safe walking home from a night out or night shift at one o clock in the morning, or not being raped in a taxi I think I will stick with a car thank you very much.

I've not been to a single place in Europe where public roads aren't paved.

Plenty of public roads in England are unpaved @DdraigGoch .

They offer freedom to those that can drive and can afford a car.

They actively restrict others.

So public transport should be better.
It's not an either or situation is it. You can advocate for better public transport for all without trying to restrict others who have perfectly valid reasons for using cars.
I find it quite frankly disgusting that disability, vulnerability etc is just dismissed as a footnote on all these threads because most can make do.

No one is saying that at all.. there can be balance!

Vast majority of car trips are under 5miles (71%) amazingly, 25% are under 1 mile.

Are you really saying we couldn't use our cars a little less?

I drive an itty bitty SUV that works in town and drives happily over fields and through floods. It’s economical in fuel and I don’t have to pay congestion charges and it laughs in the face of potholes. It suits my lifestyle and where I live.

You can find a balance if you want you. Most people however wouldn’t choose my car as it doesn’t have an appealing look.

Too much traffic on the road makes cycling, walking and even public transport more difficult and sometimes impossible.

That is why they're gradually facing more and more restrictions in urban areas.

And as someone else pointed out, disabled people are less likely to have a driving licence or access to a car. We don't want to sit around waiting for lifts because the outside is too dangerous without a car, f*ck that for a life!

They would have died at an average age that is much lower than now without ever leaving their villages.

it was infant mortality that reduced the average age of death, if you lived passed 5 years old then you were very likely to reach the same old age as we do now. With infant mortality falling, average ages at deaths have increased. Thats not to say hat old age hasn't increased, it has but the numbers are skewed by the under 5 year olds

Vast majority of car trips are under 5miles (71%) amazingly, 25% are under 1 mile.

if you took 60% of cars of the road, then congestion would disappear in the main, Im unsure why that snot something people want, especially people who drive for a living, bus drivers, ambulance drivers, people who reply on cars to get about

Bollocks. I live in a village (you can even smell the local dairy farm when the wind blows in the right direction), I travel along many country lanes, I've worked in the National Park, my relatives are farmers from Somerset, I've been walking in the Scottish Highlands and Islands. I've never ever come across a public road that was unpaved.

@whataboutsecondbreakfast so come on then you two. Please provide some Google Streetview links for these many public roads (here defined as one which has been adopted by the local authority) which have never been threatened with tarmac.

Or perhaps England is a third-world country compared with Wales...

*Vast majority of car trips are under 5miles (71%) amazingly, 25% are under 1 mile.

But those statistics are pretty meaningless in the grand scheme of things - you need to ask why people are driving those kinds of distances to begin with.

A five mile drive from here would take you to our nearest village - but the road certainly isn't walkable (NSL road with no lights or pavements) and there's no short-cut that doesn't involve going over the fells and through muddy fields full of cattle. There's no bus or train service so people have to drive.

Some of those one mile journeys may well be out of laziness - I'm not doubting that for a second - but many others will be out of necessity - dropping DC off at school before driving 30 miles to work, for example, or tradespeople who need to carry loads of heavy equipment about with them all day. Carers and dog walkers are other people who often have to do lots of short car journeys.

I've been dropping Streetview pins in random places and all I've found are a few gravel trails in the Scottish national parks. Nothing you'd "need" an SUV for, I'd happily go down them in a hatchback.

Here's one @DdraigGoch

@whataboutsecondbreakfast There is a vast array of "roads" or byways in the UK that are not paved i.e where vehicles are allowed.... BUT these are not roads adopted by councils, they are on private land but have public access, many going back to ancient times.

Anyone using them would not be in a Chelsea tractor either.

I know that.

The road I linked to is a public road. It's listed on numerous council websites and even has it's own council-maintained weathercam.

Are you really saying we couldn't use our cars a little less?

I'm sure you could use your car less. Many townies could.

Where I live is pretty inaccessible unless you have a car or are willing to risk your life walking along a road for miles with no pavement.

Perhaps townies need to practice what they preach rather than trying to prove that places where cars are a necessity don't exist.

Or trying to enforce their lifestyle on everyone else. I don't want walking, which is not aerobic, to be my only source of exercise. I do an elite sport, which I can only get to because I drive. Take that away and yes I suppose I could sanctimoniously preach, but I'm not going to be better off, healthier or happier.

The whole exercise as a combat to obesity is bollocks btw. The biggest contributer to obesity is diet.

It's just an excuse for people whose lifestyles are quite frankly, not remarkable, to be judgemental. You are really not special because you are well monied townies.

dropping DC off at school before driving 30 miles to work,

what percentage of people are dropping children at school and deriving 30 miles to work?

55% of people live 5 miles from work, 20% live 10 miles from work

71% of journeys are 5 miles or under

Have you a grid reference? Only despite Googling I can't find out whether that's actually a public road.

And no, I wouldn't drive a Chelsea tractor up that, their tyres would spin and the immaculate white paint would be white no more. If you want to go up muddy tracks you buy a proper off-road car.

Where I live is pretty inaccessible unless you have a car or are willing to risk your life walking along a road for miles with no pavement.

17% of the population in UK live rurally

leaving 83% as townies

Bully for you.

How are you defining rural?
All these places have regular bus services and pavement then?

@Whewillmylifebegin

Whats with the You Townies? i live 7 miles from the nearest town and 2 miles from a corner co-op which is also a petrol station & when its pissing down, i take the car.... when its not, i take a bicycle, i can avoid what we call the main road by taking a lane...

When i walk down to the pub i walk... yes walk, its under a mile but many neighbours do not, they DD.... ones with kids drive to the school, drop children off and drive home....

You re really not getting this reasoned debate stuff are you?

Most people where I live commute 30-40 miles to work every single day. It's incredibly common in rural areas. I used to drive a 20 mile commute - the alternative by public transport would have taken six hours.

You can keep quoting the same stats until you're blue in the face, but they're still relatively meaningless without any explanation behind them.

Do those people who drive five miles to work have mobility issues?
Do they work in trades and therefore have to carry lots of heavy equipment around with them?
Do they have other responsibilities before/after work which means they need to drive?
Do they live in areas where it's unsafe to walk, especially on dark mornings or dark nights?

Nothing reasoned about trying to inflict your lifestyle on others or pretending there are no reasons people need to drive other than laziness.

Lucky you that it's safe enough to walk to the pub. Many women don't feel safe doing that for good reason. Playgroups, woods, beaches all these places are mainly accessible by car.

Anyway, I can't be bothered to keep repeating the same points to people too lazy to engage. Yeah sure you can ride to the shops on your single leisurely trip to the local shops, but God you are lazy at seeing nuance.

Honest to god, so sanctimonious and self righteous.