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AIBU?

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Original poster

To think we could make housing estates like Center Parcs re cars

809 replies

QuertyGirl · 10/01/2023 12:38

The USP of Centre Parcs is for many, the fact that they are mostly car free. Kids can play out and ride their bikes like I did when I was kid.

Can't do that now due to the amount of cars, speed and size of cars and, attitude of some car drivers.

People (including myself) pay a small fortune to holiday at CP.

Why can't we make housing estates more like that?

Communal car parks in walking distance, deliveries by small electric vehicles from a hub (like old fashioned milk floats), exemptions for blue badge holders and funding for electric mobility scooters for those that need them.

Yet, if the council suggests a couple of cycle lane and all hell breaks loose.

OP posts:
jannier · 10/01/2023 20:40

WalkthisWayUK · 10/01/2023 19:57

In every scheme that I’ve seen, including car free cities, disabled people who need to use a car are allowed as exceptions and can keep their cars. I would think it’s highly unlikely that disabled people would be forced to be housebound and not have a car. There has been no case I know where car reduction areas have penalised disabled people, mostly there are huge advantages to many disabled people, many of whom find places with cars quite difficult if they are wheelchair bound, have a guide dog, a stick or mobility issues.

I think this is an unfounded fear.

Show quote history

Not all people with mobility issues are registered disabled it can take months and sometimes years to get that rubber stamped.

jannier · 10/01/2023 20:42

Devoutspoken · 10/01/2023 20:00

Jannier, so how do young women without access to cars stay safe? Should we be transporting our daughters door to door in cars just to avoid sexual assault? What a way to live

They either do get lifts or taxis ....and I didn't just say women or just sexual ...streets without cars are quieter less passers by and therefore more opportunities for harm.

Devoutspoken · 10/01/2023 20:43

Gosh, people do get rather angry and sweary when reducing car use is brought up - lots of angry drivers out there

daybroke · 10/01/2023 20:44

There is actually no register of disabled people.

There ar dodo please who have a blue badge and people who have pip awards but there is no "register" of disabled people.

daybroke · 10/01/2023 20:44

*There are those people

Disabled fingers and phone don't mix.

eatdrinkandbemerry · 10/01/2023 20:47

Two disabled kids and shopping bags 🤔
How would that work exactly 🤷‍♀️

MoiraDavidson · 10/01/2023 20:52

OP, I always think this when I’ve been to Center Parcs. A housing development where kids are free to play and ride bikes would be brilliant. Also think it when I’ve been to little seaside villages with narrow streets and no pavements, dominated by massive cars - there should be a carpark on the outskirts for people who are mobile and then they walk in. We’ve got so accustomed to dutifully jumping out of the way for enormous cars.

CuteOrangeElephant · 10/01/2023 21:17

I will bring up my FIL again who is stuck in his house now he can't drive.
He lives on a sprawling housing estate with no amenities within a reasonable walking distance. If it wasn't so car centric where he lived he could have had a mobility scooter or an adapted electric bike.

Not all disabled people can drive.

Squamata · 10/01/2023 21:58

Devoutspoken · 10/01/2023 20:43

Gosh, people do get rather angry and sweary when reducing car use is brought up - lots of angry drivers out there

They really, really do. You say 'wouldnt it be nice if we designed somewhere you could live without it being built around cars' and suddenly you're responsible for disability discrimination and sexual assault.

People go bonkers about anything to do with limiting car usage, especially if you bring cycling into it. Maybe people are guilty about it so get defensive?

No one's talking about banning cars, just designing places to not be centred around them. You can make a suggestion without having a full and detailed plan.

Squamata · 10/01/2023 22:00

MoiraDavidson · 10/01/2023 20:52

OP, I always think this when I’ve been to Center Parcs. A housing development where kids are free to play and ride bikes would be brilliant. Also think it when I’ve been to little seaside villages with narrow streets and no pavements, dominated by massive cars - there should be a carpark on the outskirts for people who are mobile and then they walk in. We’ve got so accustomed to dutifully jumping out of the way for enormous cars.

Some cities try this 'park and stride' but the surrounding areas that get huge car parks built in them don't exactly love it!

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 10/01/2023 22:03

Not all people with mobility issues are registered disabled it can take months and sometimes years to get that rubber stamped.

Exactly. So many able-bodied people seem to think that there are only two groups: blue badge-holders and people without any disabilities or mobility problems.

It's also very common for those who are lucky enough to live enough to get old to struggle with their mobility, even though they may not technically count as disabled.

I don't think anybody responded to the point that I raised earlier, about people being forced to move out of their homes and neighbourhoods when they get older or if they become disabled. Even if it's a choice as to where you live (i.e. once you're old and/or disabled, it's your 'choice' to go away from the home where you might have lived for decades), you know exactly what will happen to the demand for and prices of the homes in areas that do allow the cars that such people will need access for.

jannier · 10/01/2023 22:55

KickHimInTheCrotch · 10/01/2023 19:51

My 94 yo Grandma has recently traded in her car for a mobility scooter. It's removed the worry of maintaining a car and interestingly given her more freedom. She can now park right outside the library/shop/GP surgery before zipping off to her knitting circle instead of having to battle for a parking space, pay for parking on her mobile phone (which is not within her comfort zone) and walk the last 100 yards with a stick.

But if she needed to go further like a hospital 3 bus rides away how could she independently do it? If she was of working age should her job prospects be limited to her battery life and speed? Has she been for a 20 minute joy ride in the recent cold weather, snow or rain? .not all disabled people have someone to ask or wish to live lives dependent on others.

celticprincess · 10/01/2023 22:57

Terrible idea. I usually get annoyed when I can’t get outside my house and have to walk the full street from the car. Especially with my weekly shopping or as a teacher my several bags of resources and books to mark. Even worse if you have small children - not practical to leave them in the car whilst you walk home with all the bags and not practical to take them home and leave them there whilst you go and get the bags. I also can’t see the supermarkets and other big delivery companies using milk float type vehicles. Then the wheelie bin folks, how do they get done to empty all the bins??

jannier · 10/01/2023 23:01

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 10/01/2023 22:03

Not all people with mobility issues are registered disabled it can take months and sometimes years to get that rubber stamped.

Exactly. So many able-bodied people seem to think that there are only two groups: blue badge-holders and people without any disabilities or mobility problems.

It's also very common for those who are lucky enough to live enough to get old to struggle with their mobility, even though they may not technically count as disabled.

I don't think anybody responded to the point that I raised earlier, about people being forced to move out of their homes and neighbourhoods when they get older or if they become disabled. Even if it's a choice as to where you live (i.e. once you're old and/or disabled, it's your 'choice' to go away from the home where you might have lived for decades), you know exactly what will happen to the demand for and prices of the homes in areas that do allow the cars that such people will need access for.

Unfortunately many don't care about disability.....you wouldn't be getting on a bus around this eutopia for eco mummies with super big buggies and trolleys refusing to give up the disabled space and especially walking to the stop before if they saw you waiting.

CuteOrangeElephant · 10/01/2023 23:06

jannier · 10/01/2023 22:55

But if she needed to go further like a hospital 3 bus rides away how could she independently do it? If she was of working age should her job prospects be limited to her battery life and speed? Has she been for a 20 minute joy ride in the recent cold weather, snow or rain? .not all disabled people have someone to ask or wish to live lives dependent on others.

Show quote history

I know two elderly people who do a 5 mile journey to their son 3 times a week on a mobility scooter. Good infrastructure is not just for the abled or for people with a car!

I think OPs idea a bit extreme. But there's nothing wrong with a pedestrian/cyclist focussed estate where cars can take a back route to behind the houses/parking a couple of minutes away.

Thewildling · 10/01/2023 23:11

Although not this exact thought.. Last time I was at centerparcs I had the thought that building small eco friendly villages, like a centerparcs set up in the outside world would solve an awful lot of issues. Low cost housing & living alongside nature.. what’s not to love.

BradfordGirl · 10/01/2023 23:22

CuteOrangeElephant · 10/01/2023 23:06

I know two elderly people who do a 5 mile journey to their son 3 times a week on a mobility scooter. Good infrastructure is not just for the abled or for people with a car!

I think OPs idea a bit extreme. But there's nothing wrong with a pedestrian/cyclist focussed estate where cars can take a back route to behind the houses/parking a couple of minutes away.

Show quote history

I would not risk that. They must have very good scooters.

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 10/01/2023 23:22

One thing that occurs to me, that would help with the issue of people using their cars, would be if developers have to plan services into their estates - or at least contribute to them.

Where I live, we have a lot of building going on - someone on our community FB page reckons that every blade of grass around our village is owned by developers who want to build houses on the edge of a popular village. So we are seeing lots of houses being built - but just houses - no shops, no extra provision in the already overstretched schools, GP surgery and dentist - just dormitories. Even if people wanted to walk to the shops, they are not close by - only the really fit would be able to nip to the co-op for milk without getting in the car.

The Scottish government has a new policy of building communities for living - where the things you need will be within 10 minutes walk - but this is not filtering down to the local authority planning departments who are happily approving more and more estates with just houses.

lilyipad · 11/01/2023 00:46

I've lived in a block where I used to have to carry my full shop and baby from car to flat. No thanks. Never again. Park in my garage now.

Emily19944 · 11/01/2023 05:49

I do agree that some people drive without due care and attention, and some road users are overly aggressive.

However I also find that children seem to have no road sense nowadays - where I live half the time they ride straight onto the road on bikes without looking, parents are oblivious because they’re stuck to their phones, and kids are playing in the road instead of the pavements with no supervision.

Grumpybutfunny · 11/01/2023 06:37

We live on a lovely estate where the kids play at the dead end of the street. Maybe make it so parking on the road is illegal and all new build estates have to be dead ends. Also I find the kids go in and out of each other gardens to play on toys rather than play in the actual street.

mozzyworries · 11/01/2023 08:00

Lovely idea OP but not practical. I live in a house which is only accessed by footpath, but can park my car about 20 minutes away on the road. It's a huge pain for bringing shopping home, not to mention having anything large delivered or having work done to the house.

mozzyworries · 11/01/2023 08:01

20 metres not minutes!

EatYourVegetables · 11/01/2023 08:02

YANBU.

The obsession with cars is killing our planet (and our bodies).

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 11/01/2023 09:12

We live on a lovely estate where the kids play at the dead end of the street. Maybe make it so parking on the road is illegal and all new build estates have to be dead ends. Also I find the kids go in and out of each other gardens to play on toys rather than play in the actual street.

Makes a lot more sense to me - I don't see why it has to be one extreme or the other.