To be upset about my mum’s attitude to the NHS?

[Beautifulblues]

She’s turning 64 this year and so has benefited from the NHS all of her life.

She came from a fairly poor background, council house, working class, she had to leave school at 16 to get a job as they needed to contribute to the household. She shared a bedroom with her siblings until she was 14, very little in the way of luxuries.

Despite all of that she’s now a staunch conservative and she has said several times recently that she believes the NHS is no longer fit for purpose and we should be looking towards a health insurance system like other countries (she referenced France here but I have no idea of their healthcare system). I’m feeling very angry about it…she’s benefitted this long but doesn’t want me or her 4 year old grandson to benefit from the wonderful NHS as he gets older.

Dd is that you?? 😂

NOt sure why you are upset, your mother seems right. Even if she was wrong, why does it upset you?
Not sure about France but in my home country /post communist/ the system works a lot better. You can always get a hold of a doctor or an ambulance, all hospitals and other places have an overnight emergency walk-in clinics, including dental care.

Some upcoming stats

The number of centenarians living in the UK has increased 85% in the past 15 years (ONS, 2018f).
• By 2030 it is anticipated there will be over 21,000 centenarians (ONS, 2017b). •
• By 2030, one in five people in the UK (21.8%) will be aged 65 or over, 6.8% will be aged 75+ and 3.2% will be aged 85+ (ONS, 2017b).
• The 85+ age group is the fastest growing and is set to double to 3.2 million by mid-2041 and treble by 2066 (5.1 million; 7% of the UK population)

The NHS and social care doesn’t work for the elderly now, can you imagine what it’s going to be like in the coming years? We need as a country to decide how we are going to deal with this. You’re Mum is scared of what’s coming for her, and the NHS won’t have the capacity. I’m 50, and terrified at what it will be like in 25 years time.

The very people who are clogging it up! 🙄🤔

Drip feed! Due to thread not going as wished

I used to be very supportive and defensive of the NHS but not anymore. I don't know what the answer is but its absolutely diabolical. A family member has been in and out of a&e/hospital now for 6 months+, somethings obviously very wrong, but they just keep getting blood tests that come back clear and sent on their way, only to be sent back by their gp the week after. No ones interested in investigating what the issue is.

Its a disgrace.

NHS defenders never seem to be able to come up with proper responses. Even they can't defend specific accusations - like the waste and non-jobs and the wasted hours that must be incurred by their failures to keep antibiotics and oxygen cylinders on the shelves. Huge kicks up the backside are required. You know it. But sure, deny it.

I did some management consultancy work within the NHS a couple of years ago and it is staggering how inefficiently it's run from a business perspective. There was certainly an appetite for change from people at a practitioner level, but the level of bureaucracy and waste at the central function was breathtaking. It seemed that the only thing keeping the NHS going was its own momentum, and it's not surprising that after the last few years, the spinning top is slowing down and becoming unsteady.

I absolutely believe in public healthcare that's accessible to all, but the NHS is not free and we shouldn't have to be grateful for it; if people really thought about what they're paying for this service through their taxes vs. the service that's being delivered, I should think they'd be appalled at how their money is being spent.

That is just not true. I'm going to guess that you have never worked in a hospital. There seems to be a popular belief that if hospitals were staffed ony by doctors and nurses it would be the most efficient organisation on the planet. This is simply not true.

Yes the NHS budget has increased year on year but what you are forgetting is that demand for NHS services has increased at a much faster rate. This country needs to decide what it wants for the future. Given the massive increase in demand we either need to spend a lot more on a healthcare system or agree that the service is going to get worse and worse.

'Wonderful'?

Have you used the NHS recently? ' Hit and miss' is the most positive description I can summon.

Honestly, this just reads like a desperate “by the way, she’s racist” drip feed because you don’t like all the comments agreeing with her and want everyone to pile on your DM and say how nasty and awful she is. If she thinks the problem is immigrants (as you’re now saying) then why does she think the French system would be better? You’ve stopped making sense.

There is a difference in believing in a minimum standard of health care for all and the NHS model.

i find it unbelievably frustrating that people think it is the NHS or nothing

many many countries have far more efficient and effective universal health care standards

the NHS is an absolute shitshow

My word, you are describing my mum here too, to a T!

All these people in the daft overpaid yuppie jobs like 'executive gender advocate' and 'chief fart analyst' really need to have a think about what they'll be doing 8 months from now because they won't be in post.

As someone who worked in the NHS for decades, but has also been a patient in the French health system a number of times, I know which I'd choose. Even a properly funded NHS offered nowhere near the standard of care and treatment in the French system. NHS outcomes fall far below those of France.

If there was a referendum tomorrow to move to a French style system, I'd vote for it.

That's RacistWang!

Mumsnet rule No 422: If a thread isn't going how you would like, chuck in an accusation of race. Now, surely, everyone is duty bound to agree you are reasonable and hate the poor person who OP has chucked under the Race Bus.

Have noticed this, lots of people who're keen to bring in the 'free for some, others to pay' are generally meaning 'free for me I don't care about those that would have to pay and how this would affect them' but are quick to have a go at those who don't want to do this and call them selfish.

I've spent the last 6 months in and out of hospital visiting and being next of kin to two family members and I can count the experiences i was grateful for on one hand. The whole thing was hideous.

YABU.

The NHS is fucked. It isn't fit for purpose. Hasn't been for a really long time.

This ridiculous worship of "our NHS" needs to go away. It was bad enough during covid but seems to be continuing.

Something needs to change and treating it as some untouchable immune to criticism holy cow isn't helping anybody.

I’m retired for 10 years….the NHS was dying on its feet then. It’s only getting worse…

The first thing that might need to happen is for people to realise how poor the UK actually is. There are so many people who repeat they have "paid into the system" - sure, but far less than the system costs. I guess all the Covid furlough and fraud has convinced people there is in fact a magic money tree.

Tories AND labour have contributed to the downfall of the NHS over many years.

She's not entirely wrong, it's not fit for purposes at the moment and the whole system needs looking at.

Not keen on the insurance system though and I say that as a person with a chronic illness.

If we can't run the country on the taxes we pay, serious cutbacks in general are needed. I bet I could take a scythe to government and council spending without really affecting services. Plenty of feathers would be ruffled mind.

I’m not surprised by inefficiency. It’s hard to change though

I’ve had good experiences mostly but it costs a huge amount and you can see why it’s still struggling, especially now post pandemic

I think this is a fair comment tbh.