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Original poster

Starting not to like my son

38 replies

feelingoff · 04/01/2023 11:32

I feel horrible writing this but I split with ds dad when he was a baby and he saw his dad weekends growing up, he's now in his 20s

He has spent a lot of time with his dad recently who has very misogynistic views and ds now seems to share these views and opinions such as Andrew Tate and Jordan Peterson, he sees woman as second class, he hates feminists like his dad does and has no respect towards me or any other women and watches a lot of misogynistic material along with his dad.

Due to financial reasons he recently moved back home to try and get some savings behind him but I feel like I hardly recognise him.
The influence his dad has is so strong I can't change how he thinks as much as I try.

His dad has always belittled me to him and he's grown up listening to his dad mock and ridicule his mum so now he does it.

OP posts:
Nordix · 04/01/2023 11:42

You are not horrible at all.

Tell him to move out, you won’t have a misogynist in your house.

Thinks he’s better than women, but can’t keep down a good enough job to support himself, and has to leech off his mum? Sad little man.

He mocks and ridicules you in your own house? No. Get him gone. Now. And tell him why. “I won’t tolerate disrespect in my own home. If men are so fantastic then man up and go and support yourself. Be a real man. Off you fuck.”

Outandover · 04/01/2023 11:43

Nordix · 04/01/2023 11:42

You are not horrible at all.

Tell him to move out, you won’t have a misogynist in your house.

Thinks he’s better than women, but can’t keep down a good enough job to support himself, and has to leech off his mum? Sad little man.

He mocks and ridicules you in your own house? No. Get him gone. Now. And tell him why. “I won’t tolerate disrespect in my own home. If men are so fantastic then man up and go and support yourself. Be a real man. Off you fuck.”

This.

He can go and live with his DF.

FlipFlops4Me · 04/01/2023 11:44

I totally agree with @Nordix - if he's under your roof the least he can be is respectful. If he can't manage that, then maybe he should go live with his dad.

10HailMarys · 04/01/2023 11:44

He's in his 20s. If he doesn't respect you and holds misogynist views, tell him he doesn't get to live with you and he needs to find his own place. He's sponging off you and treating you like shit.

AnneLovesGilbert · 04/01/2023 11:45

He needs to move back out. Cheeky shit thinking he can mooch off you while being disrespectful. If his dad is so bloody marvellous he can put him up.

shropshire11 · 04/01/2023 11:45

Agree with PP that you need to set a firm but reasonable boundary here.

Also be wary of attributing all of this to his dad, as it may be narrowing your view. Sadly this kind of thinking is increasingly common. Maybe the dad is a contributing influence, but your son isn’t a young child anymore and has got to this situation himself.

He will need to learn that resenting and hating others for perceived injustices is a dangerous and lonely path to set out on.

RoseslnTheHospital · 04/01/2023 11:49

He hates women and thinks they're second class, but is happy to live with one and sponge off her in order to be able to save money? Does he not see the hypocrisy in his behaviour??

It's your home, you don't have to put up with being mocked and belittled by anyone, including your son. He either has to stop the behaviour immediately and be at least civil and polite, or he can leave and find somewhere to live where he doesn't have to share with and sponge off a woman.

StewPots · 04/01/2023 11:51

He can go and live with “D”F then can’t he and save money that way! Sorry OP it sounds like a horrid situation for you 💐

Lackofsleepishurting · 04/01/2023 11:57

I had a friend like this a few years ago. I saw the process occurring in real time much like how you have with your son. My friend was a similar age, too. I think it largely relates to personal insecurity of the young man, and he looks to influential "successful" figures in the media for direction. Your son needs to have better male role models, but also perhaps needs to be able to look to women as role models too. That's difficult because we are conditioned to look to our own gender.

It's likely that your son is unhappy, and the result is this change, into negative traits and defensive world views. It's like these men see women as something they have to protect themselves from. He needs to grow into a stronger young man, and get more confidence. I wouldn't cut him off at this age, with him in your house you can influence him, even if that's uncomfortable for you. I know what I'd do if he was my son, and that would be a programme of feminist indoctrination, but I'd make it fun. I guess then he can either leave when he's had enough of the feminism or finally change.

Mammillaria · 04/01/2023 11:58

shropshire11 · 04/01/2023 11:45

Agree with PP that you need to set a firm but reasonable boundary here.

Also be wary of attributing all of this to his dad, as it may be narrowing your view. Sadly this kind of thinking is increasingly common. Maybe the dad is a contributing influence, but your son isn’t a young child anymore and has got to this situation himself.

He will need to learn that resenting and hating others for perceived injustices is a dangerous and lonely path to set out on.

Agreed

In the meantime it might be worth googling transactional analysis to help avoid falling into old well-worn patterns of communication (you can't stop him mocking or belittling you, but you can change the way you react to it)

Original poster
feelingoff · 04/01/2023 13:00

Lackofsleepishurting · 04/01/2023 11:57

I had a friend like this a few years ago. I saw the process occurring in real time much like how you have with your son. My friend was a similar age, too. I think it largely relates to personal insecurity of the young man, and he looks to influential "successful" figures in the media for direction. Your son needs to have better male role models, but also perhaps needs to be able to look to women as role models too. That's difficult because we are conditioned to look to our own gender.

It's likely that your son is unhappy, and the result is this change, into negative traits and defensive world views. It's like these men see women as something they have to protect themselves from. He needs to grow into a stronger young man, and get more confidence. I wouldn't cut him off at this age, with him in your house you can influence him, even if that's uncomfortable for you. I know what I'd do if he was my son, and that would be a programme of feminist indoctrination, but I'd make it fun. I guess then he can either leave when he's had enough of the feminism or finally change.

You're right about his personal insecurities and he is very unhappy.
This stems from school bullying, or rather than bullying he had few friends and the ones he had often excluded him.
In a way I think he enjoys putting woman down as he feels if they're second class he must be first which probably gives him a sick kind of boost so he's proud to be "the better sex"
I've even told him this and I get "mum look through history books...

OP posts:
RoseslnTheHospital · 04/01/2023 13:01

What does "look through the history books..." mean?

Testina · 04/01/2023 13:02

He needs to move out. No matter how much you love him, it’s actually doing him a disservice teaching him that it’s OK to treat a woman like that.

Testina · 04/01/2023 13:03

It’s probably best to keep it to a simple, “you don’t respect me, so you need to leave” but I’d be wanting to point out his hypocrisy mooching off a woman too 🙄

Original poster
feelingoff · 04/01/2023 13:04

I don't know, something he's been told probably, I doubt he's even got a history book.

OP posts:
Clarich007 · 04/01/2023 13:05

Oh the irony!! Puts you down, but is happy to live with you. Does he not see this. I'm afraid I would ask, no, tell him to move out

RoseslnTheHospital · 04/01/2023 13:09

I would ask him to explain himself, when he comes out with statements like that, to say exactly what he means. He's clearly implying that history shows that men are superior to women, so I'd want to know how he came to that conclusion. Then I'd point out the errors and logic fails in his reasoning.

SheRasBra · 04/01/2023 13:11

I assume the history books comment is to do with this belief that men discovered and created everything because they're superior rather than because society spent a huge amount of energy subjugating women and denying them an active role in society.

Perhaps tell him that many women scientists had their discoveries stolen by male colleagues and were written out of the history books, or maybe save your breath and just ask him why he chose to live with you over his DF? I suspect it's the feeding and pants washing.

pillow56 · 04/01/2023 13:12

Also be wary of attributing all of this to his dad, as it may be narrowing your view. Sadly this kind of thinking is increasingly common. Maybe the dad is a contributing influence, but your son isn’t a young child anymore and has got to this situation himself.
He will need to learn that resenting and hating others for perceived injustices is a dangerous and lonely path to set out on

I agree but then there is alot of misandry too and I see women and girls being very man hating/boy hating too both on here and in real life. It can come from parents.

pillow56 · 04/01/2023 13:15

He hates women and thinks they're second class, but is happy to live with one and sponge off her in order to be able to save money? Does he not see the hypocrisy in his behaviour

This is quite common on mn and real life too though, many threads are male bashing over the years yet many of these posters have sons and husbands etc. I know a friend who appears to hold strong views against men yet is living off her male partner as she doesn't work.

ForfuckssakeEXHstopbeingatwat · 04/01/2023 13:17

Bloody hell @pillow56 .. fantastic bit of "whatabouttery" there. This is about the ops son and HIS attitude. Your point about misandry on Mumsnet may be valid, though actually on any thread titled "men are crap because.." or similar will be jumped on instantly with "SOME, not all"but it's totally irrelevant to this thread.

Keyansier · 04/01/2023 13:18

Your son sounds like an absolute loser (or at least, his views do).

Tell him to go and live with his precious dad and see how he fares when his dad decides a 20 year old man child hanging around isn't such a good look if he decides to bring a woman he claims to hate so much back to his.

RoseslnTheHospital · 04/01/2023 13:19

Yeah, "misandry" isn't a thing. When women express what is characterised as "hate" for men, it has zero impact on the men they supposedly "hate", and is usually just an expression of having issues with genuinely problematic behaviour from men as a class. And those women who talk about having issues with men, who live with men, are not mocking and belittling the man they live with.

Testina · 04/01/2023 13:28

@SheRasBra “maybe save your breath and just ask him why he chose to live with you over his DF? I suspect it's the feeding and pants washing.”

Well indeed. I’d love for @feelingoff to tell us she doesn’t include his laundry with hers, or cook for him… but I’m sure she does.

So @feelingoff if that’s true, and you don’t feel ready to tell him to move on, at least reinforce in your own home that you’re not a second class woman there to service him.

tattygrl · 04/01/2023 13:58

Very worrying. Young men (well, not only young men, but particularly young men and boys) are being groomed and indoctrinated by these "alpha male" online figures. Misogyny is on the rise and we've already seen hate crimes against women because of it (see Elliot Rodger, for example).

I fully agree with pp that you don't have to put up with this from anyone, whether they're your children or not; however, I would recommend, if you feel up to it, doing some research on how to combat harmful indoctrination to extremist views, because this can cause serious problems for him in his own life, and might predispose him to harm others. I wish I had more knowledge or could signpost you somewhere, but I feel there must be online resources or helplines or something, for advice on how to try and reach someone who has started demonstrating extremist views.