Lots of people go to A&E when they shouldn't

[Liz1tummypain]

To be clear- I couldn't think of a way or wording this so I just came up with something that might attract some opinions. It isn't something I can spout about with any authority.

But is it true? My kids are older so I haven't had to go to A&E for ages. Very little experience. On the radio I heard they are trying to re-direct potential patients to pharmacies etc . So what is your view on it?

My mum worked in A&E , a long time ago and she says she thinks people wouldn't have dared to turn up with some minor injuries that she thinks people go in with now. She thinks people just tried home remedies and only went in with broken bones, trauma, sick children. But I think maybe she was just getting a bit worked up after seeing something on TV. She also hasn't been to A&E for a long time.

I think you're right OP and of course there are idiots who shouldn't go to A&E when their ailment is neither an accident nor an emergency, but as others have said, in some areas it's almost impossible to actually SEE a healthcare professional any other way. If you call your GP and they say they don't want to see you and you want to be seen and the local minor injuries unit has been closed (like ours has), then what are people supposed to do?

@Feetupteashot yes there is but sometimes it’s impossible to get to see them!

Of course they do. In the same way they see a Gp when there’s no need.

I don’t know what drives it - a lack of common sense? An absolute faith in GP’s? I’m not sure.

I think that it would be helpful if you could get a GP appointment. It is utterly ludicrous that you can't. My friend was recently told by her GP (on the phone) to go to A&E with an infected piercing. That is not an A&E matter!

In the summer I had an accident on my bike and was taken to A&E by a passing police car because they couldn't get an ambulance. Next to me in the waiting room was a woman who was desperate as she couldn't get a GP appointment for a lump in her breast. She said it was an absolute last resort but she felt she no longer had a choice . That is beyond shocking. So yes people are going to A&E with things they shouldn't but they do it because of desperation.

GP opening hours and appointments can be a really issue if you work full time any distance from your home (yes you can register with an out of area GP but they don't have to take you and that is often the case for Central London - for obvious reasons).

A lot of workplace have started paying for private GP services like GP@Hand for those reasons.

A lot of NHS services still seem to think people structure their family and working lives like it is the 1950s.

I t's all part of the overall strain on NHS resources. My GP only offers 'emergency' same day appointments (and that's if you can get through - average waiting times on hold even if you call on the dot at 8am are upwards of 45 mins and then when you do get through all appointments are often gone). It no longer has a minor injuries clinic. The NHS walk-in clinic in the city centre has closed down, there's no OOO service. My local pharmacy is great for advice but cannot provide actual treatment in most cases, or prescribe meds.

Often the only options are calling 111 (which can be very hit and miss - I've had to persuade them not to send an ambulance for me twice now, one time for COVID symptoms at the start of the pandemic when guidance wasn't clear, once for a trapped nerve in my hand!) or going straight to A&E.

It's crappy all round and I know the pressure the NHS is under, but I really don't think most people would be sitting in A&E for hours if they had any other options...

The issue is that for some it is the only access to medical care they can get. It's simply impossible to see a GP. So that's one thing.

Then some people are hysterical - people on here were up in arms when I not long ago suggested that a grown man, having had a temp of 39 and having a nap after work was not grounds for A&E. Didn't I know it could be sepsis!!! I do feel that do to constant (social) media campaigns some adults seems woefully inadequate at assessing what requires medical care and jump straight to panic mode.

Then some people simply take the piss. I was in A&E a while ago and a man walked up to reception asking to be seen about his injured knee. Was in a new injury, no. Had he seen a doctor, no as his GP wasn't open at times convenient to him 🙄

Also people love to judge others in general so they are sitting there sizing up all the other people in A&E working out who needed to be there or not but this isn’t an appropriate way to measure how much they need medical care.
Recently my DD appeared to be one of the ‘least sick’ kids in A&E but I knew she was unwell and so did the doctor’s hence she was admitted for multiple days for treatment. She is young but very good about pushing through illnesses and will hide it as much as possible. No doubt plenty of those parents thought I didn’t need to be there and yet they were sent home and we were admitted.

I'll try and find the figures but I believe that the number of both A&E and GP appointments has increased significantly over the past few years suggesting people are attending for much less now. I'm always surprised by how often people on here seem to attend the GP.

Lots of people use the NHS when they’ve no need to. We are a nation with terrible health anxiety, especially when it comes to children. This is fuelled by social media and places like Mumsnet!

We also have a huge compensation culture so most people ringing 111 are told to go to A&E just in case.

Likewise people who do need the NHS often don’t use it as it’s so difficult to get an appointment.

My sister's GP refused to see her face to face and would only offer telephone consultations. She was in increasing agony and the day I visited I took her straight to A&E because she needed to be seen by a doctor.

It turned out her kidneys were failing (which the triage nurse spotted a sign of within seconds because of how hard and swollen her legs were from fluid retention) and she was admitted for immediate treatment.

Don't get me wrong, my sister was inevitably heading for in-patient treatment but the route there should have been via the GP not A&E and much quicker than how it happened. Ultimately the GP's neglect means my sister is no longer here (not just this incident). A&E is being battered partly because Primary Care in the community is failing.

If you need antibiotics and you can't get a GP appointment and 111 advises you to attend A&E then oddly enough that's where you'll end up. That's not what A&E is for - but increasingly being used that way because there aren't any other options, especially for people who can't afford a private GP.

This isn't a general GP bashing comment (although I do have issues with one specific GP), they are under immense pressure too. The root of it all is the purposeful mismanagement of the NHS to enable it's ultimate failure and privatisation to the financial benefit of every corrupt MP.

Today I had a 60 yo man come in with a painful knee.
He has arthritis. He hadn't taken any paracetamol. He hasn't called his own GP despite having pain for over 3 weeks
He is awaiting a knee replacement on the other knee.
He wanted an X-Ray- he got told to ring his own GP.

I think the issue is two-fold

1. Getting a GP appt is impossible and so much is done over the phone now that mis-diagnosis must surely be on the up?!

2. Lack of follow on social care. There is something like 12,000 medically fit individuals currently in hospital beds unable to leave due to no ongoing care provisions.

I think the pay issue is a bit of a red herring. Dont get me wrong, they totally deserve to be paid more but paying more isnt going to solve the inherent problems as above. If anything we need to pay carers far far more so more people work as one and relieve the bottle neck. ^^

Pharmacists being able to prescribe would help a lot - antibiotics and strong pain relief. Also as other have said, being able to get a GP appointment, including at weekends

A third of cancer diagnoses are made from A and E visits

https://news.sky.com/story/amp/more-than-third-of-cancer-patients-in-england-wales-and-scotland-diagnosed-in-a-e-study-shows-12584120

@Looloo278 when you phone the surgery try asking to be put on the duty Drs call list.

I’ve been two A&E twice recently. Both times I was directly by another healthcare provider to go there as the only option to get medical care. There’s nowhere else to go. On one occasion I went to the pharmacist who said GP, GP said walk-in clinic because they had no appointments and the walk-in clinic said A&E because they were full and couldn’t see children below 1yr anyway! I tried phoning 111 but it got cut off twice and then I was told I’d get a call back but they never did. People have no choice but to go to A&E.

People don’t want to be sick. That’s the impression I get from booking in patients. Colds, coughs etc that they have had for a day needs antibiotics now. Some come in and have done nothing at home. No paracetamol, no rest and are simply annoyed that they are unwell and want a quick fix. A few hours of vomiting that is ‘the worst ever’ and yet not one vomit on 7 hours waiting. An ambulance called for a UTI in an otherwise fit healthy and young adult. That’s not to say no one needs A&E but people make choices. Why go to A&E simply because you e had knee pain for 7 years and now you’re fed up of it…no change to pain levels, haven’t needed pain relief. There’s definitely an issue with self care and common sense and obviously that’s not everyone but not all need a GP or A&E in each situation.

Back in my home country when I got food poisoning I was taken to the a&e at a public hospital and put on some drips without any questions and this isn't a first world country. Last year my ds picked up a bug from nursery and had a very high temp for 6 days going up to 40.6 in the early hours and no gp appointments prior to that. Day 6, 3 am he has 40.6, cold hands and feet. I called 111, they arranged an appointment at the a&e and I took him there. My son barely able to walk from losing so much weight and hadn't eaten or had any fluids in his body for nearly a week, Dr's looked at me like I'm mental to bring him here and how dare I bring him despite being advised despite the website. When you are abroad, you are advised to go to a local a&e, we tell friends and family to take out travel insurance etc to cover unexpected things, but when you are here in this country as a taxpayer you get fuck all care unless you have a chainsaw poking out your chest. Tell me what are people meant to do. My then 2.5 yo was a stick insect barely able to walk, open his eyes or speak. No gp appointments, no one to see you. Instead of spying on people and questioning why they are here maybe people should question why people can't have access to basic health?

Couldn't believe it when our minor injuries clinic closed. It was the go to out of hours place for child related injuries. Anything major or urgent they referred you immediately to A&E. Plus parking was easy and free. A&E has only drop off parking for ambulances. Everyone else has to trawl round the enormous car park looking for a space with a screaming/bleeding child in the back of the car, a potential 10 minute walk back to the unit and then a 5 hour wait. It's not working.

Mine was - that was pre-covid

I agree with all of the comments here already.

Another issue is, the doctor who I see at my GP (as lovely as he is) will tell me to go to A&E for the smallest things. ‘Oh you’re struggling with your asthma and finding it more difficult to breathe? Go to A&E even though you have no wheezing or anything of the sort.’ I went to A&E, waited 5 hours and was told there’s nothing they could do and they don’t know why my GP told me to come.

Called 111 to get advice for my 8 month old son yesterday. They said they need to send an ambulance to the house and he had to be taken to A&E. Waited 8 hours to be told there’s nothing they can do and go home. What is the fucking POINT of being told to go A&E unnecessarily. It’s as if some health professionals aren’t sure what to advice so they just fob you off and let the A&E staff deal with you

There are several issues. Parents are terrified of not getting medical care if their children may need it (which would be neglectful) but can't make these assessments, so take the safe option. Hard to blame them.

If you have private medical insurance and use the online GP service, they often send you to A&E. They don't really do much more than that. It's a useless service, sucking up private insurance payments and abusing the public system to shield themselves from the functional uselessness of seeing an online GP.

And, to be clear, I’m in the very lucky minority to have an absolutely stellar GP who I cannot fault in any way.

I keep seeing these threads about A&E misuse, but it's a red herring. It's not the reason for the massive waits. Most people in A&E are there because they need to be - the majority have been taken there by ambulance. There are and always have been people who misuse A&E but even if you took all those people out there would still be a huge problem.

Demographics have changed since your mum worked in A&E - the majority of users are elderly with multiple health problems. That's not to say there's no way to reduce the strain - better social care would help, to stop these people getting to the point where they need A&E. But it's not the sort of misuse you are talking about.