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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

At breaking point

30 replies

TinyDancer45 · 27/12/2022 11:28

My son's dad has not returned my six year old despite court order. He is telling me he is keeping him an additional five days and said if I try and retrieve him he will call the police on me. He does this routinely and it's as though the court order doesn't matter to him because he knows if he breaks it, I don't have the money to do anything about it.

He's taking me to court again despite a barring order in place due to multiple vexatious applications and I'm waiting to find out what's going on.

I'm at the point where I just feel I have no agency and there's nothing I can do. The court order is basically used to keep me in line and not him. I feel so angry and sad about it all.

Has anyone been in this situation and how do you cope? I've got to talk to Cafcass soon and I wonder how best to frame what's going on and the impact on our lives. I don't feel like Cafcass always get it.

Any advice really appreciated.

OP posts:
Original poster
TinyDancer45 · 27/12/2022 15:49

bumping. anyone?

OP posts:
FairyBatman · 27/12/2022 15:52

If he is in breech of the court order can’t you report him to the police? I thought I,d read that on previous threads on here.

I’m sure someone more knowledgeable will be along soon, but I can’t imagine how hard it must be and I hope it’s sorted soon.

Hopeyoursproutsarealreadyon · 27/12/2022 15:55

At least the police can go and do a welfare check. Ring them ASAP op.

LakieLady · 27/12/2022 15:55

You must be in bits, OP, but short of going back to court to get the contact arrangements varied so he only has supervised contact , I haven't got any suggestions.

Appalling behaviour by him though. Sorry this is happening to you.

londonrach · 27/12/2022 16:03

Report to police if breaking the court order. Hope you get your son back soon. Xxx

upfucked · 27/12/2022 16:05

The police won’t bring your son home but they will do a welfare check to make sure he is safe. I would do this.

Merryoldgoat · 27/12/2022 16:07

Why don’t YOU call the police?

Hellobaby22 · 27/12/2022 16:13

This reply has been withdrawn

This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request

Hellobaby22 · 27/12/2022 16:20

K

L1ttledrummergirl · 27/12/2022 16:24

Call the police. When this happened to my friend the police visit was enough to make him take the dc straight home.

It's also evidence that your ex is unreasonable for future potential court ordered visits.

Original poster
TinyDancer45 · 27/12/2022 16:29

I've phoned the police but they won't do anything as he has PR so they've said it's a civil matter. He won't answer his phone. Last time he did this over summer, he threatened to beat me up if I came to his house to try and retrieve him. It's just really unbearable and it's so hard to have seemingly no recourse.

OP posts:
dcadmamagain · 27/12/2022 16:36

If you are the resident parent per the court order then I thought police had to intervene

Soakitup37 · 27/12/2022 16:47

Can you say you’ll come and get your child? If he makes any threat, then you can report to the police as a threat to you?

id insist at least a welfare check.

Soakitup37 · 27/12/2022 16:47

sorry op this sounds so stressful x

warofthemonstertrucks · 27/12/2022 16:49

We've been in this situation when DSS's mum has decided (twice) that she is keeping them for zero reason. We once didn't hear from them for 10 days as she blocked all phone contact as well
We have Learned the hard way that there is nothing you can do bae requesting an urgent court hearing (or getting your solicitor to write them a letter-which they obviously free to ignore).
It's a ludicrous system we have where court orders have no conditions attached to them when they are broken on the whim of either parent.
Sorry this is happening to you.

If you are lucky the police will do a welfare check-maybe given the age of the child.

AkoraEdelherb · 27/12/2022 16:50

and said if I try and retrieve him he will call the police on me

For what?

Tell the police you’re going to get your son and he has threatened physical violence. Don’t minimise it.

Googlecanthelpme · 27/12/2022 16:50

If you have a contact order in place then you can apply to the court to enforce the order. You do this by filling in a form. Whilst it’s better to have legal representation, you don’t absolutely need it, if you can’t afford it then it’s perfectly OK to take this to court yourself.
you will probably be able to find a lot of good solid advice on mn.
In an ideal world you’d have a solicitor but please don’t assume that you can’t do this without, if he’s relying on your financial position stopping you.

Also, always communicate in writing - Email or text. Keep a log of when he breaches the order, keep evidence of any threats or harassment.

is there any chance you can move away? Got to be honest, in your shoes I’d save up, move away and change mine and DC names. No way I’d spend my life like this, or subject my child to such a piece of shit as a parent.

Grumpybutfunny · 27/12/2022 16:55

Do you have a brother or new partner that can go with you to get DS. I would turn up for DS and when he kicks off let him hit you then phone the police and get him charged with assault. Black eye would be worth it to get DS back.

windmill4865 · 27/12/2022 17:00

Take Court Order to Police. Ask them to enforce it. You should also have paperwork to support the fact that he is not allowed to make any more applications. Take that also. It is not a civil matter as there is a Court Order in place. If they do not intervene, then present evidence to Court, when you do get your son back. Then ask Ex to make an application for an Enforcement Order to make you adhere to Court Ordered contact. You then will be able to submit your evidence as to why you do not agree. You will not need to make any further applications or spend money. Court Orders are Orders by the Court. Police are duty bound to honour them. Remind them of that. Wishing you luck. I am ex CAFCASS btw .

StrawberryWater · 27/12/2022 17:02

You need to take the court order to the police and get them to enforce it.

You have an court order, it’s no longer a civil matter.

Tell then you want your child back and would like a police escort to do it. It’s what my friend did. She got her son back the second her ex saw her with the police.

Hellobaby22 · 27/12/2022 17:05

Windmill - you mention you're ex cafcass. I'd be really interested in understanding why stuff like this doesn't get a look in with cafcass. I've been advised by barristers to minimise abuse because cafcass might accuse me of alienation. I really want to understand more about this. I mean, I'm sure theres many cafcass officers who see through this culture but my experience is that cafcass have invariably minimised abuse and put the blame on me. Btw, I work in Children's services in child protection (albeit in public law)

bigbells · 27/12/2022 17:10

You sound like you're being badly bullied by him. Why does he get to call the police on you? Why does he call the shots? Why is the court order to keep you in line and not him? Be assertive, don't roll over and let him dictate to you. Do you have anyone to go with you to his house to collect your son? Would that be safe for you? If it were my son id be banging the door down but I know that's not safe or practical for all situations.

Failing that I would also call the police so there's a log of this if nothing else. Then I'd get legal advice and get back to court. You can't allow him to control you and your son like this?

scotscorner · 27/12/2022 17:32

Hi, I’m a police officer (and assume you’re in the UK). From what you’ve said, I imagine this is a civil (not criminal) dispute which means the police won’t enforce it for you, but our relevant responsibilities would be to:

  1. prevent a breach of the peace (immediate threat to property or people)
  2. ensure safety of children

Clearly you should be going through the courts to get the order enforced, but you can ring the police and say you are going to get your child, are fearful for their safety (if that is true) and/or anticipate your partner will hurt you. They will almost certainly send someone to do a welfare check at minimum & I’d imagine they’ll send someone to the address if you say he’s threatened you.

Hellobaby22 · 27/12/2022 17:36

This reply has been withdrawn

This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request

scotscorner · 27/12/2022 17:41

windmill4865 · 27/12/2022 17:00

Take Court Order to Police. Ask them to enforce it. You should also have paperwork to support the fact that he is not allowed to make any more applications. Take that also. It is not a civil matter as there is a Court Order in place. If they do not intervene, then present evidence to Court, when you do get your son back. Then ask Ex to make an application for an Enforcement Order to make you adhere to Court Ordered contact. You then will be able to submit your evidence as to why you do not agree. You will not need to make any further applications or spend money. Court Orders are Orders by the Court. Police are duty bound to honour them. Remind them of that. Wishing you luck. I am ex CAFCASS btw .

Not sure what you mean by ‘police are duty bound to honour them’.

Civil court orders are not for the police to enforce…Police have specific use of force/arrest/entry powers which we use to enforce criminal law. We have no such power to deal with civil issues - it would place an inappropriate responsibility on police to assess the particulars of whether an order has been breached.

Possibly I’m misunderstanding the source/nature of this instrument (Sorry if so) but if it’s a civil order and no crime has been committed, OP can’t demand this.

you can certainly ask them to go with you and as a PP said, often that will be enough to scare someone into doing the right thing.