To think we wouldn’t be having as many strikes if we weee under Labour government?

[lurkinglittleladybug]

I find all these strikes we are having in our country quite worrying. Especially the NHS nurse and paramedic strikes. I support them fully and think they deserve a fair wage…

But can’t help but think there wouldn’t be all these strikes or at least if there were they would be resolved quicker and therefore fewer strikes if we were under Labour government right now?

We wouldn't. Not because Labour would be better but because some of the strikes are politically based anti-Tory government protests. Mick Lynch is open about it imo as his rhetoric has become much more generalised rather than focused on his own union members and there's also his presence at other strikes. I didn't vote Tory but only the ballot box should be allowed to bring down a government.

Re Mick Lynch he called for Starmer to resign at last conference

Starmer doesn’t have to face any of this pressure in opposition but it would be all aimed at him if he were in government. Whether they could keep the pro union image and get through it unscathed impossible to say

The 70s strikes hit Labour hard though and then Thatcher got in. Labour are not immune to the pressures of strikes

Inflation would be less under a Labour government I expect. Anyone other than Boris Johnson (Tory or Labour) would have managed the Covid pandemic such that the economic impact would have been less, and of course there would have been a Brexit deal that did not create the level of shortage in filling the jobs there are.

If there's no money, there's no money.
Labour might choose to distribute it differently, but they can't magic up any more money, unless they tax us more.

IMO we do need to pay more taxes, or at least some of us do.
My master plan would be to raise the income tax threshold to £20k, or even £25k. The loss of income to the govt would barely be noticed, but it would be fab for "the poor", who would then spend more and so give some of it back to the govt that way.
I'd also move the higher tax bands up a bit too. I'd ringfence a lot of the extra income for the NHS. Not for salaries, but for improving the computer systems so that the staff's workloads could be reduced.

The inequality, destruction of value of wages, and the housing crisis all began under New Labour due to New Labour’s actions.

I don’t trust the Labour Party, especially not one treating their only socialist leader of the last 25 years the way they have.

It's impossible to know, but one thing that always confuses me when there's talk of nhs pay increases for a specific group is that the pay rise would go to pay bands as opposed to specific roles. So nurses wouldn't be the only ones who would benefit from the increase. And they can't just regrade nursing roles because of Agenda for Change, which would mean a lot of other roles also would get that uplift. So it's a whole lot more people than just nurses. I'm glad it isn't my job to have to think that through.

Sorry, but that isn't born out by the facts, wages & equality both improved under Labour.

BUT lets assume it is all Labours fault, the Tories have been in for 12.5 years and they have not improved anything, nothing, not one single thing is better and we are all paying far more in indirect taxation, not least Council Tax.

Unless you are very wealthy or one of the 1.7m extra millionaires created since 2015, then the TOreis have been excellent value for money.

I don't think there would be so many strikes. Labour would just use their magic money tree or sell something off cheap for a quick windfall. NOT that I think the current bunch are good, we're in a shocking state. Labour keep saying 'it's all costed' but I have sneaky feeling that means tax the middle classes more and we don't have anymore to give.

Labour broke the country thanks to Gordon. Why would they do any better now

Labour are better off being in when there aren’t strikes. If you look at 70s they’re more hampered by union connection.

I’m not Tory, I’m not labour, I certainly am not Lib Dem after Nick Clegg.

I don’t think this country has seen true labour in a lot of our lifetimes.

I do know that when you have a full roll of bin bags, you empty the rubbish more frequently, as you are not thinking I need more bin bags.

I think when things are plentiful, we do get a little wasteful, but how do you manage that in such a massive organisation such as the NHS/Schools etc.

Cleaners in schools about 20years ago were instructed to put toilet paper in the dispenser a certain way because it breaks after a couple of sheets and doesn’t run and run.

i think it’s shocking that the very people that were hailed as hero’s a couple of years ago, most of whom are on low wages, (supermarket workers, bus drivers, nurses, all the people who weren’t able to stay at home on few pounds a week less) are now being totally vilified for asking for a fair wage.

19% wage increase on a nurses salary is a start, but in my opinion it doesn’t go far enough.

This week, and not for the first time I have read their aren’t ambulance crews to pick up (literally) people because they had fallen over. The one in Wales was tied to a plank of wood, and carefully placed in an old van, and driven to hospital that way - if you’ve ever been in an ambulance, you will probably be thinking the old boy was more comfortable, and perhaps that’s why there are no staff.

Its become shocking that we are paying a kings ransom in tax, that various governments seem to spend on every vanity project going, except helping the working poor live comfortably, and I don’t mean wide screen tvs etc, I mean proper food, and not worrying about freezing to death.

Perhaps I have gone full circle, we have given the government to many bin bags, if only there was a way for us to make the tax man/government go cold Turkey/clean out the cupboards,fridge,freezer and larder for a few months.

Devolved governments can only work with the resources allocated to them under the Barnett formula. They have little scope for raising extra funds themselves.

I haven't forgotten that the last Labour manifesto included a garden tax.

Who the hell do we vote for then? What is left out there in the political world that would ever do any good for this country? Genuine question because we surely cannot have another Tory government after this lot.

Op you are entirely correct

It's an utterly pointless hypothetical as the reason we have these strikes is because of the last 12 years of Tory policymaking, much of which would not have been politically acceptable by any shade of Labour government. However, New Labour certainly didn't help by building castles on sand and supporting low wages with tax credits that were just got rid of by the Tories rather than engaging in proper reform.

It is totally unacceptable for NHS employers to be handing out food vouchers to staff whilst simultaneously parroting the government's view that anything other than the most meagre payrise is affordable. It obviously shows that people aren't being paid enough to do highly skilled highly stressful jobs.

However, the reality is that nurses are getting offers far in excess of what most the public sector are seeing. I work at an ALB and since since 2009 we've had multiple pay freezes and only 1% max at other times (I joined in 2016 but know colleagues who've been there since then). We've been given 2% this year and it's the best payrise I've actually ever had since moving into the public sector and it is utterly shit!

We have such low wages in this country when compared to any other that would be considered in the same tier as us. This has been deliberate policy of wage suppression for 12 years while we have seen national debt balloon and the rich getting richer. Working people have largely had enough and whilst in the private sector this is being recognised in many quarters by decent, if still below inflation pay rises, in the public sector at large the government is making sure that it is impossible for any employer to move beyond the low pay rises they have mandated through 'independent' pay review bodies (let's remember that these bodies were set up by thatcher to avoid collective bargaining and essentially receive their marching orders from government and can only make recommendations anyway that can and have been ignored routinely by governments when it suits them.

I suspect many Tories see these as their great Thatcher moment so don't expect it to get any better. There will be more strikes, unionising of previously ununionised areas of the public sector and potentially spread of strikes into areas of the private sector that have not responded sufficiently to the cost of living crisis. That's on top of probably quite a few job losses in the new year as well. Grim times.

Starmer doesn't appear to be supportive of the strikes so I don't see why everyone thinks things will magically change for the better when Labour get in.
I also don't see too much of a difference between Labour and Conservatives anymore.

We have an ineffective government and an ineffective opposition.
Its no wonder why it's such a mess.

Starmer doesn't appear to be supportive of the strikes so I don't see why everyone thinks things will magically change for the better when Labour get in.

He couldn't do any worse.

Labour government in Wales. We are significantly more in a mess than England when it comes to the state of the NHS. All our nurses etc are striking. Yet our government is spending £20million on new road signs that’s going to cause travel hell.

We have to get over this idea that Labour are better. They aren’t.

Yes op, cos labour didn’t suffer with Strikes. 😂

I reckon he could,,,,

It would damage Starmer though. He’s can get away with Lynch yelling at him from sidelines when he’s in opposition. No hope if in charge.

Labour got trounced in 70s so the idea they can weather it better isn’t the case. Unions expect more and they get tied up in that.

Re formula yes I’ve heard that before, however glad to see Welsh nurse didn’t buy it, taxes can be used and pay per head is higher anyway.

Wales puts me off Labour even more

Hasn't Kier Starmer said the 19% pay rise for nurses is unaffordable? If that's what they are going for they'd be striking regardless of who was in government

Under a Labour government we would not have seen the unprecedented levels of under investment in the NHS, education, and all,other areas of public spending. Nor would we have likely seen the very real decline in wages in these sectors - teacher’s salaries in real terms are down over 20% since 2010.

So whilst I agree 19% is unaffordable, the fact that we have professional people with high levels of training and an absolute need for those people to ensure a functioning society, demanding such a pay rise, we need to look further back and consider why we have arrived at this point. It wasn’t inevitable.

Devolved governments can only work with the resources allocated to them under the Barnett formula

May 2022

Labour leader Keir Starmer has defended Welsh Labour's record on the NHS in Wales despite the Labour-led Welsh Government giving health services a smaller funding increase in Wales than the NHS in England is receiving.

www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/put-labours-record-funding-nhs-23600620