Secondary school not allowing kids to eat lunch inside in cold weather

[Bananabrain99]

Secondary school not allowing kids to eat their lunch indoors in this cold weather AIBU to feel cross with this as it is detrimental to pupils' health and wellbeing? My child was upset going into school today due to this and less than half the kids are in her class at the moment due to illness. Reasons cited by the school not to open up the hall is building works and needing the hall for flu vaccinations. Obviously I do expect my DC to have fresh air at breaks, but I don't think many adults would like a freezing cold picnic. Don't think there is anything I can do now (and school say will open a hall in January) but just feel upset about it and not sure if AIBU - I had presumed DC had somewhere warm to eat at least (12yrs old)

Same at my kids school. I think it's totally miserable.

I agree ridiculous, the school my son attended was the reverse of this, the kids were not allowed to eat outside, due to being coastal to prevent seagull attacks.

My kids old secondary school, literally at lunch time, no pupil is allowed in the building at lunch,being it thunderstorms, lightning, severe winds, snow, 40 degree heat, whatever. No trees for cover, just grass field. They even closed the lunch hall, where they served hot food and built wooden stalls in the playground and you could then queue for the whole of the lunch break to try and buy something. How we treat our young in the school system is a joke. Like not being able to take your blazer made of recycled plastic bags off in 40 degree heat without getting a 30 minutes detention. Understanding rules are rules, but there was never any lee way to these rules, making the kids disrespectful as their voices were never listened to.

But all kids don’t do these things either.

How would you suggest schools find out who drops litter and engages in antisocial behaviour and who doesn't?

We used to have dedicated class rooms for the years open when I was at school, I don't believe it can't be done.
Not all kids will trash classrooms, it would be the minority with the bad behaviour there not the majority.
And if that happens then those few students should be dealt with properly, I find at my children's school this doesn't happen.
Bad behaviour goes around unchecked.

The minority's poor behaviour shouldn't control the majority's access to the bare minimum benefit of being able to stay inside instead of freezing outside.
We were also allowed to walk around the school.
Expecting children to stand outside in the freezing cold is unacceptable.
As are the ridiculous lunch line at my kids school. They spend more time queuing than eating.

I don't think kids are treated as well as they used to be at school these days.

This thread makes me think that we could do with a lay visitors scheme for schools similar to the one for prisons- volunteer members of the public going in and seeing what a normal school day is like. It’s clear that things go on that ordinary people find really horrifying and which teachers think are normal ( or at least unavoidable). Or a Jamie-style exposé. Can’t see how things can change without more public awareness.

I would be all in favour of this …

Reasons why pupils eat outside? No facilities to accommodate every growing pupil numbers.

Reason why my child isn’t learning enough in “X”? Their teacher is unqualified doesn’t have a GCSE in that subject. (Yes that’s me, teaching A-level psychology).

Reason why there’s no lockers? The cloakroom has been turned into a classroom.

Reason why the data manager is teaching KS3? No supply teachers.

These are all true for my school.

Who to blame? 12 years of Tory underfunding.

It’s the only time my DD gets any fresh air. They can all have a whinge together, it’s bonding,
I will reconsider my stance if anyone actually dies from this policy.

At ds's (state) school the kids eat in the dinner hall and can stay in all lunchtime if they want in computer rooms/the library or the 6th form in their common rooms - most want to go out though. There are more problems with toilets being vandalised than anything else because they are the unsupervised areas - but you can't stop kids going toilet at lunchtimes!

Why are kids not allowed to wear coats/ fleeces in class, appropriate winter footwear aka boots to school. Why did our school insist that the kids took their coats off whilst Carol singing in the town square. Were the Tories responsible for this? The A' Level Psychology teacher at my kid's school has been incapable for over 10 years, he's a running joke - that's not the Tory's fault either. Not that I'm trying to give the Torys an out but everything isn't their fault.

Quite. I don’t think the general public has any idea about how bad things have got.

Does your dd not walk to and from school? Ah whinge together about the school being shit - that sounds right. As an employer - you think I should treat our employees badly so that they can bond over a whinge? That sounds like a great idea! 😁
What are we doing to our schools?

Part of the problem is lack of space in schools - a lot of schools now have staggered lunches which means classrooms are in use by other students whilst half the school eats their lunch. There may be some classrooms available but not enough (and they may not be suitable for eating lunch in, eg a science lab).

Also, for those saying students can be unsupervised at secondary age, the school would be liable if someone had an accident etc, it is very difficult to leave secondary students unsupervised now. So there would need to be supervision if not in every classroom certainly in every area of the school. Teachers, just like everyone else, do have legal entitlements to breaks, so it's not as simple as giving every form tutor an extra lunch duty.

I do think the school has messed up by having the hall in use for something else if it's the only inside eating space, though.

Buy her a warm coat, hat and gloves. Walking briskly, or playing a ball game will also generate heat energy. You may also wish to consider one of those metal thermos containers filled with hot noodles/soup/pasta.

Or you could ask for a refund.

Actually teachers aren't supposed to do lunchtime supervision.

If this is how it is in your kids school (or the one you teach in) then you have a big behavioural problem. In a normal school children of 11 and over can be left in classrooms with light supervision.

It doesn't fill you with much confidence if the school's starting position is that every child is there to ruin school equipment and property rather than 'most' children are fine so let's do the decent and morally, ethically right thing and have a canteen/hall children can eat in! Mine DC's school just can't be bothered post Covid as with my eldest who is 15, I saw the canteen on open evening, my youngest in year 7 can walk around, has her food card taken off her even though £100 on it, so mix up as staff are incompetent and if you lose or don't have enough money on it, the child has to queue outside in cold to get a new one. The system is inefficient and I have emailed the school to point this out but all you get in reply is one line answers asking me the parent how to solve their IT software issues! I should really have to tell them how to procure a product that works! I work with schools for my job and I find it too depressing, it was better in my 90s school days, hence I am leaving to a different sector.

Thanks for all the replies. To @CinnamonJellyBeans the school haven't told parents this was what they were doing so I didn't think to give her a flask of hot chocolate and hardwarmers, it was only when she was upset and was coming home with a full lunch box (which often happens anyway because her lunchbreak is only 30mins post covid and she says she doesn't get time to eat) that I was finding out. I am not sure what you mean by refund? It is a comprehensive school not private so I couldn't ask for one, just feel upset for my 12 year old that she hasn't got an indoors space to eat her lunch during subzero temp in 2022 England. Seems pretty common place though.

As to those saying they'll survive and they will only care if there are deaths, that is a bit dramatic but more than 50 per cent of the class are off ill at the moment (not too many teachers though) and there is a cost of living crisis where public buildings are being designated as warm spaces for people to go to as there homes are cold, surely it would make sense for kids to be warm at school when eating.

What if you can’t afford a warm coat, hat and gloves? What if you are a neglectful parent who thinks that school should keep your child warm and so you don’t bother? There are lots of kids who turn up to school without breakfast, without coats etc - throw them out into the cold for 45mins - what harm will that do? I honestly feel schools have lost their moral compass. League tables and order/control seem to be all that matter.

We're -10 right now, though will be warmer at lunch time. Our school has 3 lunch sittings, long tables and the form teacher sits with their form on a table. 20 minutes for lunch then kids go outside, where they have other staff on duty. It works. Staff get breaks.

They do in every secondary school I have worked at and the one my child attends.

As I have said none round here have lunch time supervisors in their secondary schools or any I have worked in. The teachers supervise.

They do in every secondary school I have worked at and the one my child attends.

I think your experience is unusual. I don't know any local secondary where teachers do lunchtime supervision. They do a lot of extra-curricular clubs though.

Of course it is appalling that they have to eat outside. The fact that I had to do it in the late 90s doesn't mean children should still be doing it now. I don't blame individual schools and teachers though because they aren't to blame for lack of funding for supervision and dining halls. The idea that it is acceptable to leave groups of children unsupervised in classrooms is ridiculous - I hope none of those suggesting it are responsible for children's safety in school!

You sound lovely.

I am shocked to read that this happens. It’s freezing right now. Thankfully my kids could eat indoors. I accept that due to resources many schools now don’t have the space or staff to facilitate indoor eating.

What’s awful is that so many teachers thinking it’s acceptable, fine for the kids to do this etc. Depressing attitude. Not caring at all.