To think it's better to work full time?

[Catslovepies]

I am hosting a guest from Ukraine- she's lovely and no trouble. I helped her get a job interview where I work for an admin job paying £21-£24k based on experience for 37 hours. At the moment she's working in a café for NMW topped up by universal credit. She works about 16 hours a week.

She has now said she's concerned as she will lose her universal credit so will be working a lot more hours for not much more money. I said I thought it would add up to more and that she would still receive child benefit (she has 2 children, 7 and 12). If she gets the job she could work 2-3 days from home and the rest from the office. On the days she works from the office I or DH would do the school drop-off for her and then her daughter would go to after school club for under £5.

So AIBU to think she would be better off working full time or is she right that she would be on approximately the same money as she is now? She has a good work ethic and I would have thought she'd rather work than take benefits she doesn't need but there should be a financial incentive to working surely? I have never been on benefits so don't understand it really but she says this is the reason many English people choose to work part time.

I do agree its a trap people fall into. I'm a lone parent who works full time because I'm aware my children won't be little for long and bigger children come with bigger expenses so I need to boost my earning potential. People just keep looking short term rather then long term. I do sort of agree with your guest though if she is going to return to the Ukraine and this is a stop gap for her just to survive.

I think this is exactly the kind of person benefits are meant for . It’s not like she isn’t working at all!!!
she has been through trauma and upheaval I’d imagine and like you say she wants to go home when safe so this temporary I wouldn’t begrudge her a penny

Um, excuse me? I'm hosting her and her children (and doing a massive amount for her and her family), did you miss that part or are you just hard of thinking?

its clear you are doing a lot for her and her family which is lovely but you have to take a step back and allow her to make her own decisions about work. It’s her choice and she will know best what she can manage and what she can’t

It's crap that the system works like that. But I think you need to remember how much stress and worry she must be have. She probably needs some time and mental space to process what is happening to her family and her country.

I only worked part time when my dd was young because I was not a genius mother who could guide and know my child while working fulltime.

She needs to do what’s best for her and her family. Has she written out a realistic budget for both scenarios? So her income and outgoings for both set ups?

She has been here 6 months but I definitely take the point that she needs to do what suits her and her family. My surprise really is about the system rather than this particular case. It seems wrong to me that there is so little incentive to work.

My guest has pointed out that if she takes this job and then for any reason needs to rent her own place that she thinks she would be unable to get housing benefit so would be much worse off. She actuallyreally wants the job for the experience which would enable her to get a much better job in Ukrainewhen she goes back. But she is afraid of the financial repercussions of taking the job. It really shouldn't be this way. I didn't know any of this.

Long term, pension for example, and promotion prospects it’s better to be full time

And this is why so much “benefit bashing” exists! Because it pays to work minimal hours and rely on the tax payers to pay the rest for your kids!

I can see why working 16 hours is better than zero but in the other direction it seems madness if it increases state pay

I don’t really get why the system incentives lower hours

The system doesn’t - what makes it pay is the low hourly rate that companies are prepared to pay experienced workers.

That didn’t take long!

And this is why so much “benefit bashing” exists! Because it pays to work minimal hours and rely on the tax payers to pay the rest for your kids!

Instead of recognising that employees benefit from keeping wages low and rely on the tax payer to make it up to enough to live on - just. No one working full time should have such a low wage that they need benefits to top them up, and moving from part time to full time work should pay enough to see a signifier financial uplift from part time plus benefits.

What is your point, @Pumperthepumper ?

Maybe she's not planning to stay in the UK long term If I suddenly had to take my kids out of a war zone to another country I'd want to spent time with them rather than thinking about building up a pension in that new country. Maybe being through a war made her think about her priorities.

Just that the benefit-bashing didn’t take long, I’d say that was fairly obvious from my post.

It wasn't and still isn't. How on earth is saying that benefits should be for people who need them benefit bashing????

Single parents have to be both mother and father, working part time leaves you with the energy to do so.

Her children, even if they left Ukraine before they saw anything will be traumatised by the move, what is going on in their home country, worrying about friends and family members and from being thrust into a different country and adapting to the language and culture. If I was her I would want to be supporting my children instead of putting them in after school club. EAL children find school incredibly draining too. If she's working and getting some support I don't see t. I issue with that.

But @Singleandproud she actually wants to work, she just doesn't know if she can afford to.

I haven't fully RTFT but OP are you planning on hosting here and her family for the entire time she's here or will she be looking to move into her own place?

If it's the latter she will need the higher salary to rent somewhere. I am a landlord and when I had a property to rent out I had over 70 enquiries. I hate to say this but I could pick and choose my tenant.

I opted not to go for anyone on UC as, unfortunately I've been turned over too many times by tenants receiving UC - believe me I've learnt the hard way and sadly, no longer give them the benefit of the doubt. Other LLs I know have experienced the same and will only go for working professionals.

As previous posters have said full time work is better in the for long term especially if she's looking renting property here.

At risk of getting flamed:
Many many people take advantage of the 16 hour rule, and associated benefits that flow. Granted we need a safety for the most needy. But at the same time, a cliff edge does nothing to resolve the current recruitment crisis so many businesses are enduring. I bust my nut to earn well and pay my way. It pains me to know the country's public finances are a mess, and people make those finances worse by milking the system around the 16 hour rule. It's just wrong. Makes me angry.

‘Not just for people who can’t be bothered to work’ and your ‘shock’ at the ‘system’, despite being ‘lefties’. Very disingenuous of you.

Assuming the office job isn’t a term time only role, I think it would be school holidays that would cause her big problems. If she gets say 5 weeks paid holiday, that leaves her with 7-8 full time weeks to have to cover childcare. School holiday childcare is often expensive, patchy and oversubscribed. If she doesn’t get any extra funding to cover all those weeks then she has to factor it into how it would significantly reduce her pay effectively if she worked FT.

I do think people have been unfair to you her though OP. You’ve obviously been very kind in taking this family in to your home in the first place, as well as helping the mum find job opportunities and helping with the DCs. You seem like a lovely person and the world needs more like you.

Not in the slightest. I'm actually a card-carrying member of the Labour Party. I even have had signs up in my garden for the previous several elections. I think work should pay more than benefits to incentive people to work, and I didn't realise it didn't.

Benefit bashing to my mind is saying that people on benefits are all sitting there with big TVs and new phones and are all lazy etc. That's not at all what I have said. But yes I do think it is wrong that people can choose not to work with no financial penalty to themselves. That cannot possibly be good for our economy and a strong economy would benefit all of us.