To say “no” and mean it

[Flutterbybudget]

Quick backstory, my ex DH is a scout leader. My DD (14) is a scout. She is in his troop. Their is a court order in place, specifying that she goes to scouts on Tuesdays with him. However, she has started doing the gold scouts badge, which involves lots of hiking and other activities. Many of these fall on weekends that she is with me. She enjoys them, and I’ve never tried to interfere or prevent her participating. However, he says that it’s my responsibility to cover the costs which I’ve always done. And to get her to where she needs to be - again, which I’ve always done, even when it’s a couple of hours away.
I have tried saying no before, but he guilt trips me with “if you don’t, she can’t go” and I always give in, because I don’t want her to miss out
This time, there are two events coming up. One in Jan, one in Feb. I haven’t had a holiday in 3 years, and have only had one week off work in a year. I work three jobs currently (all low paid, including day times, evenings and weekends) whereas he has a high paid office job (ie 9-5 mostly WFH) Ive booked to go away for a break, due to my main job closing down for a couple of weeks, giving me the opportunity to book a couple of days off my other 2 part time jobs to get a proper break. I’ve arranged for my dog to stay with a friend, a couple of hours drive away (somewhere where she will be happy and safe).
These two events for my daughter. happen to be on the only days that I can drop off and collect my dog, as I will need to be working at both ends of my holiday. My friend is unwell, and unable to drive, or he’d bring her back for me.
The plan had been that my DD would come with me to take and pick up the dog, so I wouldn’t have been leaving her on her own, but I’m unable to accommodate doing both the dog and getting her to her activity.
So AIBU to say that if he can’t take her, then she won’t be able to go?

I used to be a scout leader, it was absolutely normal for kids to all share lifts to and from expeditions so get her to text her friends to and if you want, offer to do it next time to even it up since your ex is a waste of space.

This is just a normal life event though. She wants to do something and you can't drop off. You aren't asking someone to adopt her, just to give two lifts. You know he's useless, moaning here won't change that. So just make other arrangements instead of sobbing about it.

She’s 14. If you refused to cooperate, and it went back to court (assuming he could be arsed to do that / spend the money on it), they’ll just ask your DD what she wants.

Even if they awarded him the same contact pattern, you could ask them to stipulate he picks up etc and they’d almost certainly add that in.

I’m another that thinks you should go down the CMS route. I can’t see his new partner being happy for him to cut his nose off by earning less.

The thing is , if you don't get her there won't you have to cancel your holiday?
You won't be able to leave her on her own.
Can she appeal to her Dad ? (Shouldn't have to I know)
Agree he is an arsehole.

Just say no, it won't hurt her, infact it might even help, and make her realise that sometimes we don't always get what we want, and the bank of mum for time and money isn't always open. I used to cover for my exdh, but now simply say I can't or don't have the time/money. My dd is fine with this, actually it highlighted what a knob df was at times. She realised that sometimes I simply couldn't, but her df chose not to help.

If he starts to guilt trip you, just block him or have a few choice sentences in the bag: 'I'm sure she will get over it' 'it's not the end of the work' 'if you're so concerned you could take her'

Erm - go to CMS and request a variation.

I honestly don't see why you are doing the picking up and dropping off for an activity he has demanded - he is going anyway, so why isn't he doing the ferrying about? No offence, but I think he's taken you for a mug for all these years xx

Can she get a lift with a Scout friend? Or, given she's doing the gold badge, can she get a bus/train/taxi combination by herself?

I was you years ago. The first thing I would say is that this all seems huge now but it will all pass. You only have 4 years until your daughter is an adult. I know it probably feels like an absolute lifetime but it will come and then your contact with her father will be through her ,if at all. I found that the very best way , from a mental health point of view , was to remove his control from everything I possibly could. I had a solid and brilliant group of friends who helped me enormously. They knew how my exhusband was behaving and we swapped babysitting, lifts, holiday cover. I always said yes to things they needed and they were always there for me. Can you develop a support network so you are not always driving everywhere. I would certainly revisit court stuff. Things change and legal stuff needs to be up to date. It will pass. Your daughter will look back and realise how much you did. My sons are now married and having children of their own. We are very close . She won't forget what you have done. Hug to you.

YANBU but what will happen if she can’t get there? Will you still be able to go away?

For sanity I'd take ex out of the equation. Just treat him like any other scout leader. Does troop have online communication for parents? Id put a message out asking if anyone could give dc a lift. Asking for help from other parents isn't a weakness and.you can reciprocate further down the line.

You matter too.You can say no and it's good for DD to realise she has to think of others sometimes. If you can't afford it or just need a weekend off, sometimes you can say no. If it means enough to her father, he can facilitate it.

What has she got left to complete to get the gold? She can still work towards it in her first term at Explorers too.

And where is your daughter going while you are away?

I cant quite make sense of your post, sorry, so cant offer any useful advice but I'm reading it as follows

Dad wont take her to the weekends away in Jan and Feb. You are going away and need to take your dog and collect your dog. Those days your daughter needs dropping and collecting but you cant do both in one day so she can't go but you cant leave daughter to collect dog so she has to go with you?

Options are

Ask Dad been as he is going to these events, I cant understand why he wouldn't

You take dog and daughter on same day and collect? How far apart are they that it can't be done?

Tell your daughter she can't go because of having to drop and collect the dog and that her Dad won't help

Ask another Scout parent to drop and collect. We are a scouting family and do thos all the time with our child and other scouts (Explorers now though)

Probably not. Scout campsites are not often near public transport routes and camp often starts at 630pm on a Friday night till 2pm on a Sunday.

Our nearest Scout campsite for example is in the middle of moorland and to take public transport would be around a 15 hour journey or a 35 minute car journey.

I can ask other parents, (or even my brother or other relative, who would help out if necessary - but live further away) but as far as I’m concerned, my DD isn’t THEIR responsibility - she’s mine - and officially my exDHs.

OP, you badly need your holiday. Approach these people now to help you. I'm sorry but it's plain that your xDH is indifferent to your needs and has no intention of behaving decently. He will not change.

Please have your holiday.

Be honest with your daughter. Say you can't get her there because of your plans and that you asked her Dad but he won't help. Don't try to cover up how useless he is.

As far as I am aware, there is no reason why he “can’t “ he just refuses to help out with childcare/ accommodating any requests for help in “my time” with her - that’s my problem to work out.*

Well there you go it's "your" days. He doesn't get to dictate what happens on your days, just as you don't on his.
Just do what you would do if this was another activity she went to, not with Dad, so say volleyball and this was a weekend camp. She either couldn't go or you would ask another parent for a lift.
Your days, your call.

And as mum of teenager DDs I agree with PP, sometimes they can't go to everything as there is something else important for another family member, and that's a good life lesson to learn.

If the court won’t enforce him seeing her then they can’t enforce you taking her to the scouts events.

Does he attend the scout events? He should take her if he wants her to go.

Stop enabling him.

And it should feel absolutely right making him
full child maintenance, don’t doubt yourself. If he wants to fuck up his career to take a temp job to pay you less then let him.

OP, is your daughter a witness to how put upon you are and how your ex treats you with complete and utter disrespect and like a mug?

If so that is really not good modelling for her.

Do you want her to end up with a similar loser?

Read some books on assertiveness to help yourself and her.

Good luck.

I don't understand why you wouldn't ask someone to take her, it's as though you want her to miss out because she has a crap Dad. Personally at 14, I'd put her in a taxi. That's what I had to do as a Widowed parent. It is what it is with her Dad. You are being a martyr by proxy, like you want to make the point to your DD, tha it's you or no-one. What exactly are you crying about? You've had seven years of him being shit and at 15 she can be left alone and travel alone (mine were at her age now), so you've got a year at most of this.

Op, gently, I don’t think you are seeing the woods for the trees here. Sometimes kids miss stuff as things clash - that’s life - it’s not the end of the world, don’t overegg it with her and she’ll get over it. He’s not going to get less shit either, stop crying about it and take a step back. It’s clear you need a break - if someone else can’t take her, she misses it on this occasion.

OP if you put in a CMS claim they will look at his most recent P60.... so him temporarily moving jobs is unlikely to help him.

I know CMS gets bashed on here, but when I out in a claim I found them really helpful (albeit you fo have to wait a long time to get through) abd they explained the process fully.

Honestly, it would be worth giving them a call and exploring putting in a claim....

@Ponoka7 that was mean.

Op I've never been in your shoes but it must be very stressful protecting your DD which also results in protecting and covering for your ex being an arsehole.

Can she ask her dad if he will do it this time? Will he be horrible to her? There's nothing wrong with asking for help/ lifts from other scouts and you may be able to reciprocate another time. If there is no one to take her, there is no one to take her, we all have to miss out sometimes. I've only just realised that putting yourself last after everyone all the time does no one any favours in the long term.

I changed jobs, so had to use my last years holiday from my last one, to cover my notice period. And this place is in hospitality, but with uncertain hours through the winter, it’s the holiday pay that covers when we have to close early. Otherwise, we have to take it unpaid. The joys of zero hours contracts,

My daughter will be with her older sister while I am away. I need to do a three hr round trip in one direction to drop the dog off and pick it back up. My daughter was coming with me, because she likes seeing my friend, and we were going to make a day of it. Now, she needs to be dropped off and picked up in completely the opposite direction to where I am heading with the dog, in order to go on these hikes. I’ve told exH that I can drop her off, but he will need to pick up afterwards. I think it’s the best I can do, and frankly more than fair.

ask dad? I did and he said no. Because it’s her weekend with me, and he has no responsibility for her on those
I could tell her that she can’t go, but she really enjoys it, and I think it’s good for tbh. Gets her away from the screens.

if it really comes down to it, I might have to ask another parent, but I’m so tempting to post and ask someone to help, stating that I can’t do it myself and as her father won’t help, I see no other option.
I will admit that it sticks in my gut that he’s a scout leader when he can’t even help out with his own kids.

My daughter was coming with me, because she likes seeing my friend, and we were going to make a day of it. Now, she needs to be dropped off and picked up in completely the opposite direction to where I am heading with the dog, in order to go on these hikes

No she doesn't. Your arrangements were already made before this hike was planned. It does not trump the arrangements for your weekend away which was first.
I have teen daughters and they know that their needs/wants do not trump everyone else's.
Just tell your DD that weekend does not suit as you and she already have plans.

End of story