111 is non functioning

[Wronglane]

Spoke to them at 8:30 this morning about my sick son. Had a callback 3 hours later from a nurse who said we needed to speak to a doctor who would phone us. Heard absolutely nothing back since. 111 is no longer a functioning service is it?

I think 111 is useless. I’ve called them probably ten times in 5 years for 2 of my children and for me. They’ve been crap.

on a similar note though, people need to stop going to walk-ins and a and e when they don’t actually fucking need to be there. If your child has a cough/cold it’s winter that’s fine. A and e is for croup or coughs so bad they can’t breathe and need help. Don’t take your child with a sick bowl in to a walk in (yes, I’ve seen this). If they are so unwell with vomiting that they need a drip, that’s a and e. don’t take your child with conjunctivitis to a walk in - go to the pharmacy.

there appears to be 0 common sense. The govt would be better off airing a weekly show on illnesses and how to manage at home/when to go to a doctor.

And also presumably because there was an entire Comms campaign about calling "111 first" and how they could give you an appointment in a and a (if for example you have a suspected broken foot) so you didn't have to wait as long.

E.g.

northcentrallondonccg.nhs.uk/my-health/nhs-111-first/

That's normal for 111

I was talking to my friend about this as she works for 111 although handed in her notice this week. At her trust 111 do not have enough permanent staff and even though they've had 40-50 join every month for training since August, most quit or are booted out if they fail an exam in the first week leaving <7 on each cohort - there's 4 left from hers which started in July from 28 in her evening group and 3 from the morning group! Agency staff are paid less than NHS with most on £9.50ph for standard hours and £10.27 for night enhancements whereas perm staff are £11.11 standard then enhancements after that.

There isn't enough clinicians either.

We had to use the service last weekend. I knew DP had tonsillitis as it was evident and we needed antibiotics as it was becoming inflamed quickly with more white forming. Was told 6 hours for a GP, didn't happen and instead closed by text for the GP. Called again and clinician to call within 5 hours - they called 11 hours later in the middle of the night but we'd already decided to wait it out until the Monday even though he was in a lot of discomfort.

My local pharmacies wouldn't treat my child when she had conjunctivitis, they all said she needed to see a GP. What do you suggest then?

They have always been useless ime. Poorly trained staff using a call centre flow chart - can be fucking dangerous.

I had to call them when DS had 2 or 3 unusual
symptoms that didn’t really fit together. I was told I had to pick one to be assessed because computer said no. I hung up and drove him to the walk-in. No point.

there appears to be 0 common sense. The govt would be better off airing a weekly show on illnesses and how to manage at home/when to go to a doctor

This is honestly a good idea. I'm in Canada (where we are having identical problems) and I listened to a phone-in with a paediatrician that discussed when you actually need to seek medical attention. It was so helpful. Having a high temperature and being lethargic is normal with a virus, it isn't medical attention-worthy! But people don't seem to know this anymore.

My colleague recently moved to the UK and got sick. It was something serious. I gave him a link to a local University advice which tells students what they should do if they are ill. Calling 111 is a first priority. He says he couldn't get through. Ended up getting a taxi to a walk in centre.

Filled in the form for DP at 7am. He had a call at 7.10am. They called back at 8am with an appointment to go to hospital for 9.10am. He'd been seen, xrayed, seen again and discharged by 10am.

I can't fault that.

I would just go in and ask for chloramphenicol. I have no idea why they won’t give it for children but I ask for it for me then give it to my child. That’s what a GP will prescribe you anyway so better to cut out the middle man.

When I called a month ago, and they insisted they had to call an ambulance, I kept saying we didn’t need an ambulance and could get to hospital by public transport if they thought it necessary, they just said that they were obliged to send one-which came incredibly quickly. The paramedics said it was a 111 problem because it’s not staffed by nurses and they have to follow a flow chart. I did think it was a huge waste of resources. The ambulance crew didn’t seem in any hurry at all to get on to another job -I do suspect that we were quite an easy job for them. And in fact they had to come back a couple of hours later when I phoned to say they’d left some of their equipment behind. But I thought the service was excellent. I just wish the service we had had for cancer treatment had been anything like as good.

@holdingoutforagptiltheendofthenight the trouble is though schools and nurseries won't allow them back to school without prescribed eye drops so unless it happens to coincide with school holidays you have no choice.

My Ukrainian guest spent 4 hours in a queue for 111 trying to access emergency dental treatment.

When I needed it a year ago it took 45 minutes to get through and they sent an ambulance, so that’s another 45 minutes wait for someone in trouble. Clearly I should have called 999 but I didn’t know that.

All the judging of people for going the wrong route (A&E when it should be OOH GP, OOH GP when it should be pharmacy) just distracts from the real problem which is that all services have been cut beyond what is workable. NHS 111 was meant to help with the problem of people not knowing which service to access because guess what, we’re not doctors.

For everyone complaining about call queues, you can use 111 online now and the online system asks exactly the same questions as call handlers. The reason queues are so long is because people don't listen to the automated message and use the services provided.

Agree that whatever flow charts they are using don't seem very helpful.

When I rang for suspected scarlet fever in dc they asked me which symptom I was most worried about. I said the rash because that was the thing which was most unusual and indicated SF. The next series of questions were mostly irrelevant and prob why the conclusion that got spat out at the end of that process was 'go to the pharmacy'.

The illness show seems like a splendid idea. In the event of social media and dr google, we all expect an immediate answer and resolution when watch and wait is often more practical.

Thing is the flowcharts are over cautious as once someone phones they have a duty of care and they'd rather phone an ambulance than miss something and someone say well I phoned 111 and they said all was fine when it isn't. Of course tragically it doesn't always work out that way, the solution is probably to pay call handlers adequately so they can attract people with experience in healthcare, but they won't.

What doctors? There's a massive shortfall of doctors in the UK. There's barely enough to staff hospitals let alone answer the phone

I get serious allergic reactions. I've found them next to useless for this because the advice every single time, without fail, is "go to A&E", which A&E are not happy about, I can tell you. In the past I thought they might arrange steroids at a walk-n centre but there's no such intermediate step, it seems.

However, I'm not saying don't call them if you are a parent of a child with allergies. Children are different, obviously.

*walk-in centre

Last night my friend's case was closed because of high call volumes!

It depends if a walk in clinic is available though, the issue is much bigger than 111.

Bullshit.

This is a passively dangerous attitude that leads to people getting worse because they're scared to bother people again because they trust that if it were that bad they would be called back already.

This. It's winter so there are loads of the usual coughs, colds and bugs circulating but because of the media reporting of Strep A (which is not a new illness and goes around every year) 111 will now be absolutely inundated with calls about children with sore throats and mild fevers.

Yes, one of the problems is that the initial operator has a script that they're not allowed to deviate from even when common sense says otherwise.

Twice in early spring I had a category 1 ambulance called on me for "chest pain" when what I had (and what I tried to tell them I had) was gallstones (diagnosed) which I just wanted an emergency painkiller prescription for (or at most a walk-in appointment) as it was a weekend.

The second ambulance told me off for it too, despite my apologies and explanation that I hadn't wanted to call them but 111 had been very insistent, and were so huffy they didn't actually check me over because "clearly if you can answer the door it's not that bad". Turns out it was actually that bad and I was bluelighted in 12 hours later (in yet another ambulance) with pancreatitis.