The Pensions Triple Lock has to go

[Flammkuchen]

When it was introduced, the aim of the Triple Lock was to increase pensions faster than earnings as the state pension was low. The TL has been very successful: pensioners now have a higher standard of living and more disposable income than working families. A pensioner couple each getting the full state pension receive £20k per year, with any private pension income on top.

This is great for them, but it comes with a trade-off. In order to increase pensions by over 10% a year, there is less money to pay nurses, teachers or doctors. Highly skilled public sector workers have low pay and there is a recruitment crisis.

AIBU to think that now that on average pensioners have higher disposable income than those in work, a policy that aims to increase pensioner income by MORE than average earnings - and so keep increasing the income of pensioner households faster than working households - needs to be rethought? Even just linking the state pension to average earnings would be better.

Interest is calculated on the nominal value. 10% of fuck all is much cheaper than 5% of 5 or 6 times combined salaries.

It is astonishing that this still needs explaining ad infinitum, when so many studies have proved again and again that average housing costs take up a higher percentage than ever of household income on average, and that is with two people working in the average household.

The "help" with childcare costs is tiny compared to the overall cost. And with housing affordable on one salary for many people, a significant proportion of people didn't even have that bill at all so didn't need a discount on their non-existent bill!

And lets not forget - for all those going on about high interest rates - about mortgage rate relief. Mortgage interest used to be tax deductible! Today's young people would kill for that deal. Always neglected to be mentioned in these discussions, quelle surprise.

Like I said earlier, you alienate those of us who support higher pension payments by this venom and ridiculing of the genuine struggles of young people now when it is objectively much harder financially these days. That has been proven. By denying reality you shoot yourselves in the foot by alienating many who would otherwise be on your side, if you'd only have the decency to do the same for them.

@AlarmClockMeetWindow honestly don't waste your time. It's like beating your head against a brick wall & so much gaslighting.

I completely see why young people are getting pissed off, I'm pissed of by the numpty posts on this thread!

There's the 15/30 hours every child gets for a year. Then tax free childcare. I know there is extra help for families on UC but unsure exactly what. Childcare would still cost more than I used to make (I SAH for now).

And both of those are misnomers. Deliberate ones to make it sound more generous than it is:

"30 hours free childcare" is actually only 30 hours in term time (like most parents have 13 weeks per year if annual leave??). It is actually 22 hours per week "free". And only starts the term after a child turns 3.

"Tax-free childcare" is not tax-free. It is a 20% discount even if you pay 40% tax. And only up to £500 every 3 months so usually - if you need full time childcare - the actual discount received is below 20%.

No child benefit whatsoever for many working parents now.

In a fucking heartbeat!!!!!!!

Save your breath - you see you are just facing people who did as they were told, pay in, who believed that they contributed even if the real economic reality is that the tax and NI they paid would not even cover themselves.

@AlarmClockMeetWindow - you seem clever, you can do better than worrying about a state pension. I accepted that mine is coming at 70. Working towards having an easier time before that now. It will have to be on my own ticket of course

It is ridiculous. They have fallen for divide and rule hook, line and sinker and are attacking the very people who they rely on to be able to receive their pensions, even those of us who have stated support for the increases explicitly! Bizarre.

If I went back full time now, we wouldn't get any tax free allowance and even with 30 free hours, our childcare bill would still be over £2k.

I work 3 evenings a week at Tesco instead. I actually make a bit of money then.

When you take out a mortgage at 6.75% and it goes up to 16% which takes the repayment to more than your wages is hardly “f…k all”. Houses were repossessed in their hundreds daily. At the time that was happening, you had to have a bigger deposit, and two times possibly two half times salary not five/six times salary where there is no leeway.

It was nigh on impossible to get childcare then unless you had parents or family

This thread originally was about pensions. Let’s hope we are all lucky to actually get to the age where we are eligible to get a state pension.

My mother died long before the age of 60, she was a self employed hairdresser/beautician all her adult life, paid a lot of tax in her lifetime, I can assure you that the loved ones don’t get a refund for the pension the deceased may have got!

It is ridiculous. They have fallen for divide and rule hook, line and sinker and are attacking the very people who they rely on to be able to receive their pensions, even those of us who have stated support for the increases explicitly! Bizarre

Who is "they"?

Thank you. I am working on that assumption. I'm a lone parent but have a good salary fortunately. Huge mortgage but I provide for my children and save everything I can for my future and theirs. I will be ok. I am not relying on a state pension. But that doesn't stop me being concerned for many in my generation who absolutely will be because our entire working lives to date has been during a period of wage stagnation and economic turmoil. It's depressing that so few of the older generation seem to care about them, and in fact make very spiteful comments when their situation is explained.

The very many posters on this thread who seem to have little grasp of economics.

Well in that case they are, apparently, ignorant of the facts, but that is not an attack.

They have fallen for divide and rule hook, line and sinker and are attacking the very people who they rely on to be able to receive their pensions, even those of us who have stated support for the increases explicitly! Bizarre.

I guess it explains why the Tories are still in power though.

And why we ended up with Brexit

When you take out a mortgage at 6.75% and it goes up to 16% which takes the repayment to more than your wages is hardly “f…k all”. Houses were repossessed in their hundreds daily. At the time that was happening, you had to have a bigger deposit, and two times possibly two half times salary not five/six times salary where there is no leeway.

So you found that hard. Many did. We understand. Yet many, many studies have all shown that the housing situation now is worse than even the depths of those crises: housing takes up a larger share if average incomes than it ever did even during those repossession years. This is fact. Why can you not accept this? And it's not a temporary spike, a permanent situation. And one that's about to get even worse.

cue some replying to my post with I didn't vote Tory or Brexit 🥱

Indeed.

ElephantMeetRoom

Just found my next username. 🐘

High interest rates of 16% in the past are akin to 5% today in terms of effect on disposable incomes.

Also the 70s saw huge growth in salaries, something that is never mentioned.

Yep. Inflate away your debts only works if salaries actually rise with inflation... 🐘🐘

You can never tell people that the tax they paid does not really count or that more is needed. They take it personally, because what you are saying to them is that they were low paid. I'm sure that many of the posters on this thread did not feel like millionaires or wealthy during their working life. What you are saying is that they didn't pay enough.

A lot of people cannot face that. You will get lots of "I did my bit" but no acknowledgement of "but I did not earn very much so economically I have done far better than you and your children will".

The country is already changing. The generation who paid in are facing social care and a collapsed NHS. That is not that great if you are old.

You mean when the recession bites again next year and the year after, the house prices won’t come down straight away, it will be about a year after.

We all have differing opinions, and just because I’m not agreeing with you fully you start trying to bully “why can’t you accept that”

@ScroogeMcDuckling ypur mortgage was not 16% for more than a matter of weeks. Some people’s it was a matter of days. Your savings were 10% plus for 30 years though.

We didn’t have savings on one wage 🤣

Ahhh yes you didnt need them with your 100% mortgages did you 🙄