The Pensions Triple Lock has to go

[Flammkuchen]

When it was introduced, the aim of the Triple Lock was to increase pensions faster than earnings as the state pension was low. The TL has been very successful: pensioners now have a higher standard of living and more disposable income than working families. A pensioner couple each getting the full state pension receive £20k per year, with any private pension income on top.

This is great for them, but it comes with a trade-off. In order to increase pensions by over 10% a year, there is less money to pay nurses, teachers or doctors. Highly skilled public sector workers have low pay and there is a recruitment crisis.

AIBU to think that now that on average pensioners have higher disposable income than those in work, a policy that aims to increase pensioner income by MORE than average earnings - and so keep increasing the income of pensioner households faster than working households - needs to be rethought? Even just linking the state pension to average earnings would be better.

And you would like to take it from him? Get your hands on it because he has abundance? Your own DF? Exactly my point.
Why should you even want to? So you can moan at how stingy they are?
I'm sure most parents or grandparents try to pass a bit around if they are able to.
The generation with Costas in manicured hand every morning getting in their 4x4 to take dc including some teenagers to school every day are automatically enrolled in pensions now so won't need to rely so much on state pensions. Another perk but so many only see negatives.
Quite a lot of the younger generations don't live within their means like we did but some of them still feel entitled to more and more that isn't theirs. I'm not a boomer btw.

It has not been derailed only by those seeing it as an attack on pensioners but also by people expressing resentment at pensioners and suggesting the state pension should be means tested etc.

Do you not think moving the age out is means testing by stealth? And I think it will be means tested in 20 years. Stating those things doesn't mean I'm attacking pensioners. I'm not young but I do think that the NHS won't be free at the point of delivery in 10 years time.

I have children though & nieces/nephews & I think it's perfectly ok for them to question why they are & will pay more & more tax for services that won't be there for them.

It's also creating more division in society because some dc will inherit a considerable amount & some won't. That isn't going to lead to a more productive society.

National Insurance is a scheme that pays for someone to claim contributory state retirement pension. You contribute during working age, and before you receive state pension.

It also counts towards sickness benefits, and unemployment benefit, in case of needing them.

As a pensioner (working or not), would already be getting their state pension, and wouldn't be entitled to the other things, what would they be paying for?

Wouldnt make any sense at all.

The generation with Costas in manicured hand every morning getting in their 4x4 to take dc including some teenagers to school every day are automatically enrolled in pensions now so won't need to rely so much on state pensions.

Is this actually a joke?

a) what generation are you talking about?

b) you think auto enrolment means people won't need to rely on the state pension?

@Zebedee55 I understand what national insurance is. It's not "saved" for the person paying for it because it's paid forward.

I think it does make sense for working pensioners to carry on paying NI because the money is needed for social care & the NHS. Plus as the gov keep moving the pension age out other younger workers will be doing it anyway.

What doesn't make sense is the complete lack of planning for the demographic shift & the lack of investment in public services over the years.

I agree, plenty of people who went and did non vocational degrees are driving delivery vans etc but is that because there are too many opting to go university unnecessarily and - their parents like the status of course.

People don’t want to listen because it doesn’t suit their agenda.All this talk of £2500 pm is ridiculous.It’s just age baiting..

I too was there, with two parents who were both teachers, and I can assure you that they absolutely did go on for years and were certainly disruptive. Not walk-outs but work-to-rule.

Also agreed.

Wow,such vitriol,will you be happy when you have whipped up enough hate that pensioners will be scared to leave their homes for fear of attacks.Because this is how it starts..

No one's saying pensioners shouldn't get these things but the working age population are paying for services they themselves wont be able to use. The NHS won't remain free for our age group nor we will we retire as the retirement age is going up it's 68 now. What will the age of retirement be for millennials/gen z be? Private pensions are much less generous and you get significant penalities for drawing before state pension age. What benefits can the young expect ?

The majority of pensioners I know are single and just making ends meet. Lots of them have been nurses, local authority workers don’t they deserve a decent pension. Lots of them have worked most of their lives. They now help out with childcare, volunteer for charity shops, volunteer for the food bank, hospital voluntary drivers and support older people in the community. These are people in their seventies and a couple of very fit pensioners in the eighties.
I left my job due to the stress and daily violence I was suffering and am waiting for my pension in the spring. I have brought up my children without any support from my parents, had no help for nursery fees and worked in low paid jobs to fit around my family. I supported two through University. I own my own house because I bought a cheap house, then a wreak and was careful with my money so I have some savings and some inheritance from my aunt and my parents which I invested in an ISA instead of buying a new car, furniture, expensive holidays etc. I am living off those savings at present. I volunteer for two charities. I give to three charities and I am trying to keep this going but may have to stop two of them. My friends and I bake, help with other local fundraiser days at our church and schools. We are making show boxes for Ukraine and knitting blankets for them and hats for local Special Care, homeless.
Most are worried about their fuel bills. We have all cut back and have Smart Meters to monitor how much appliances are using. My house is heated from a multifuel stove. I have always picked up windfalls luckily I live rurally. We have no mains gas and septic tanks here. No bus service and the villages once a week volunteer driver bus hasn’t come back on since Covid. No shops now, no mobile shop and GPs are four miles away in either direction. Dentist 5/6 miles away.
Do you really begrudge these people the pension they have worked for?

@DontMakeMeShushYou

If working within agreed rules is disruptive, doesn't that say something about all the work that has to be done just to keep schools running " normally" despite the rules!

But owning a house is not unearned wealth.My husband worked many hours overtime to pay our mortgage so I suggest you fuck off with your American ways.

Don't talk rubbish no body wants that. It would be nice for the older generation to admit the young have been shafted. They won't get the services they have been taxed for. Pulling the ladder up behind them.

I think property taxes on unearned asset inflation is the way forward.

Yes it is unearned wealth. I'm a home owner my house has increased in price 25 percent since the pandemic. I've just sat in it I've not worked for that money.

I agree, plenty of people who went and did non vocational degrees are driving delivery vans etc but is that because there are too many opting to go university unnecessarily and - their parents like the status of course.

I agree that a degree has become devalued but it doesn't change the fact employers expect you to have one.

But they are not unearned assets,people worked hard for their homes and anything else they own.If you really care about young people why don’t you campaign to abolish the zero hours contracts and minimum wage.Before you ask yes I do campaign for this.

the majority of people on this country pay over half their earnings in direct and indirect taxation.

Just because your house is worth some money, unless you have lodgers - it’s not giving you an income

Wow,such vitriol,will you be happy when you have whipped up enough hate that pensioners will be scared to leave their homes for fear of attacks

Instead of deflecting with hysterics what genuine reason is there for younger people to pay more tax towards things they will either not receive or have to wait longer for?

Instead of taxing property when people are living in it

Take the tax when they die.

And remember if you didn't blame the pensioners and were not quite so keen to shaft them you would find it easier to get more of them behind you

A lot of them didn't vote for Maggie.
My granddad refuse the offer to buy his council home at a cut down price.

Never ever blame a whole group for the actions of some.

That is how hatred and violence take hold

It is unearned wealth! You worked hard to pay the principal on your mortgage balance not the massive inflation in house prices.

“Interest rates on lower amounts” but wages were lower so mortgages were not more affordable in relative terms. There was also a huge negative equity crisis in the 90s. House prices crashed and many people found themselves with bigger mortgages than their properties were worth. Repossessions were commonplace. So stop making out that it’s been all plain sailing for boomers.

👆this

Just because your house is worth some money, unless you have lodgers - it’s not giving you an income

That's not true, there is equity release, more equity gives you better rates & you can borrow against your home eg for a second property. I certainly recognise i'm a lot better off because I have a home (even though I have a mortgage) then renters. I also couldn't afford to buy my home now.