The Pensions Triple Lock has to go

[Flammkuchen]

When it was introduced, the aim of the Triple Lock was to increase pensions faster than earnings as the state pension was low. The TL has been very successful: pensioners now have a higher standard of living and more disposable income than working families. A pensioner couple each getting the full state pension receive £20k per year, with any private pension income on top.

This is great for them, but it comes with a trade-off. In order to increase pensions by over 10% a year, there is less money to pay nurses, teachers or doctors. Highly skilled public sector workers have low pay and there is a recruitment crisis.

AIBU to think that now that on average pensioners have higher disposable income than those in work, a policy that aims to increase pensioner income by MORE than average earnings - and so keep increasing the income of pensioner households faster than working households - needs to be rethought? Even just linking the state pension to average earnings would be better.

Meanwhile, I’ll never retire, let alone spend 23 years raking in a state pension plus the other benefits they get simply for being retired.

Why will you not? Draw state pension from 67 to 90. Do you not want to live in an adequate state pension for those years?

The size of increases is a red herring. Sure the correct question is what level should the state pension be? If £10,560 is not enough, then obviously you would be wrong to think the triple-lock should end now. So it follows that you are trying to say that £10,560 (now and increasing with earnings in future) is exactly the right level. What numerical analysis have you done that makes you think that number is precisely right? I think most working people would think that is a very low income to live on.

The pension is less than a third of a median workers earnings. Why should workers have triple the income of pensioners? Don't they have comparable living costs?

Op l suggest waiting until you are old, possibly frail and possibly not able to drive or work or needing help at home before you criticise pensioners getting £20k between a couple. Many have no private pension, my parents don't.

Younger people have many options, progress their careers, change jobs, energy to work harder, many, many more choices

Reading these comments is really depressing. There is such an ageist attitude on MN.
I am two years off retirement age, will only get the state pension. I work in a physically demanding job on very low pay, exhausted and my arthritis is getting worse. Some days I really don't even now how I will get through another two years of working.
I am divorced and live in a rented house. I have worked and paid in all my adult life as well as bringing up children. I got screwed with the divorce [ can't change that now ], so no private pension. There is no pension credit anymore, this was done away with in 2016 when they changed to the new pension, and I know I will really struggle.

Also, I know no wealthy pensioners, including my parents.

The pension is less than a third of a median workers earnings. Why should workers have triple the income of pensioners? Don't they have comparable living costs?

You can make that argument but who exactly is going to pay for this?
ATM the Pension is quite low, so people who rely on nothing but the state pension will get pension credit, those with 2nd pensions and investment income don't.

If you want rich and poor to all get a pension of say, 20k per year, then expect taxes to rise dramatically and for these workers to demand even higher wages rises.

It might pay some people to read up on the UK 's Debt to GDP borrowing.....

@Getoff Fair point, except that even if I think £10,500 per year isn’t that high (though frankly when I looked at the numbers, the £21k we would get as a couple combined with £15k (£6k + £9k from final salary pensions looks fine to me and is not uncommon)

But I think the pay for junior doctors, for nurses and for teachers is all far too low.

Why should there be a law that pensions should increase faster than their wages?

From this discussion, it seems that people think abolish the triple-lock means abolish the state pension, or even reduce it in real terms. It means nothing of the sort. A single-lock to average earnings would protect the value and help fund public services.

Who are these people who are receiving a £2500 state pension? They are certainly not in the UK.

Your grandparents are not typical pensioners. Many don't have extra pensions and can't eat and heat life has changed a lot over 23 years

Absolute rubbish do I mix in elitist circles - my father was down the pit age 14.

If he was still alive he would be the first to say most pensioners have it easier than younger generations.

Why do you think it's been successful? Are you assuming everyone has 2 or more pensions....how many nurses get £10k

I'm getting pissed off with it now my Nan has been retired long before I was born same as my Granddad. That won't be an option for us we will be working until the grave.

@Willyoujustbequiet you earlier made the claim that most pensioners attended uni for free.

Are you suggesting that the barley worked benefit recipients are left to starve on the streets.....this obviously includes the disabled, carers who saved the system thousands a year by keeping relatives at home, the lazy who gave themselves cancer and life altering illnesses like MS or Parkinson's ...and any idiots who married, lived with or birthed them.......let's also forget that they were out at work at 15 or 16 whilst you could be educated at least until 18 and often 22 or older....with no need to repay your loans until earning what £24k

I feel similarly. All 4 of my grandparents retired before 60, before I was born. Been retired almost as long as they worked. My own parents are retiring this year at 60.
Meanwhile we're mortgaged until 70.
It's lovely for them, but has been somewhat at our expense.

Sorry, @Willyoujustbequiet most pensioners you know attended uni for free.

I know doctors work and train hard but I wish I could have earned what junior doctors do now starting salaries of £29k to ££34k raising to £40 to £53k .....but a pensioner shouldn't have £10k

I'm nearly 30 so they have been retired for over 30 years !!!! Their health has only started to recently decline a bit so 30 years of retirement in good health . I think most of us can only dream of a 30 year retirement in good health it's not going to happen for our age group. I think pension age will further increase..

If the elderly admitted that it's shitter for the younger generations I wouldn't be half as annoyed..

I think the generation that constantly tell the young they could buy a house if only they cut back on coffee and avocados should be reminded they had a lifetime to prepare for old age. No one who worked and who was fundamentally healthy should only have the state pension to live on. The pension is a safety net. If they didn't save for old age, why? I think the young need to ask these questions to protect their future. Everything is done for the old. And I'm in my 50s!!

In the1970s - ie our current pensioners, only 10% of people went to university, so either @Willyoujustbequiet moves in very privileged circles or that's ill-informed envious rubbish.

Most pensioners who attended uni did so with grants etc...so yes free. Unlike youngsters today who are up to their eyeballs in debt.

And many others became solicitors, nurses etc.. without needing a degree. It was so much easier for them.

And those that own their homes will have to pay for care homes out of the equity until it's all gone saving the government all that money....

@Flammkuchen can you point me to posts that are confusing issues? Posts where it is being claimed that abolishing the triple lock means abolishing the state pension, or a similar misunderstanding?

I see a few PPs defending the contract they have made with the state as a matter of principle. I don’t see how we can leap to the conclusion that they misunderstand your ideas.

So? What else should their assets be for?

Yes, @Willyoujustbequiet . This is very different from your earlier statement that most pensioners you know attended university, which suggests that you mix in fairly rarified circles (tbf this is also true in my workplace)