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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to be shocked at universal credit amount?

513 replies

oddsocksmatchifsamethickness · 01/12/2022 07:26

I've just become a single mum of one, husband gone. So obviously I want to bring my earnings up. I'm self-employed and will be doing so. But I put in a calculation for UC to see if I could get help while I sought new contracts. I'm self-employed. I earned 1K this month and did the calculation and it says I will get another 650 a month from UC.

Can that be right? It seems a lot, it would take my income up to a wage of 28K/year, but I only work 20 hours a week.

Is this what people get?

OP posts:
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8
Original poster
oddsocksmatchifsamethickness · 01/12/2022 18:10

CellophaneFlower · 01/12/2022 18:08

But if you're self employed you won't be able to only earn 900.

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Why? With one dependent it seems to say I don't need to work 35 hours. This is why I asked, if not why not?

OP posts:
LakieLady · 01/12/2022 18:10

CrossStichQueen · 01/12/2022 12:17

I just know the amount she earns, the amount of UC she receives and the cost of having most of her rent covered every month.

So if you know the amount of UC she gets and what she earns what is it?

If her rent is being paid her UC award will look like this:

Personal allowance £334
Having 1 child £290
If child is severely disabled £414
Housing costs £583
Child benefit £94

Total UC with no work taper deduction £1715 pm.
PIP at higher rate £680 pm

That still means she is apparently earning

I've just done the calculation based on working 16 hours pw at NMW, but without any housing costs, and the figures look like this:

Standard allowance £334.91
Child element £290
Disabled child element (higher rate) £414.88
Carer element £168.81

Total £1208.60

Less tapered earnings £129.25*

Total UC payable £1079.35

*(£608 - work allowance of £373 = £235 x 55% = £129.25)

Then add in the other income:

PIP (E/DLC + E/mobility x 4) £627.60
Child benefit x 4 £87.20
Earnings £152 x 4 £608
UC £1079.35

TOTAL INCOME £2402.15

Add in the LHA for a 2-bed property where I live, £1001.96, and you're looking at £3.5k a month. An online calculator gives me a total of £3.3k net pay on a salary of £55k pa.

Caveat: I did this manually, so there may be errors and typos (couldn't be arsed to crank up my work laptop and use the specialist software).

A friend used to work in a residential establishment for children 11+ with LDs. The fees were over £1k pw, so it's cheaper to pay parents to look after them!

Original poster
oddsocksmatchifsamethickness · 01/12/2022 18:10

palygold · 01/12/2022 18:08

Food budget £100 a month for two people?

Yes I cook from scratch, no meat or dairy and very little processed foods.

OP posts:
Original poster
oddsocksmatchifsamethickness · 01/12/2022 18:11

CellophaneFlower · 01/12/2022 18:08

But if you're self employed you won't be able to only earn 900.

Show quote history

Why do I have to work 35 hours but my employed friend can work 16 hours and get UC of over 1,000?

OP posts:
CellophaneFlower · 01/12/2022 18:17

oddsocksmatchifsamethickness · 01/12/2022 18:11

Why do I have to work 35 hours but my employed friend can work 16 hours and get UC of over 1,000?

Show quote history

Because that's how it works when you're self employed as many posters have stated. It was brought in to stop people claiming whilst running non viable businesses.

I think it might be 25 hours due to your child so would be NMW x 25 if so. Whatever that works out at is what they'd take as your minimum wage. You'd need to put this amount in the calculator, not 900. Whatever the shortfall is between that wage and whatever you earn you won't get.

Original poster
oddsocksmatchifsamethickness · 01/12/2022 18:24

CellophaneFlower · 01/12/2022 18:17

Because that's how it works when you're self employed as many posters have stated. It was brought in to stop people claiming whilst running non viable businesses.

I think it might be 25 hours due to your child so would be NMW x 25 if so. Whatever that works out at is what they'd take as your minimum wage. You'd need to put this amount in the calculator, not 900. Whatever the shortfall is between that wage and whatever you earn you won't get.

Show quote history

Thank you that makes sense.

OP posts:
Original poster
oddsocksmatchifsamethickness · 01/12/2022 18:26

So I need to work 16 hours but if I can earn more working those hours, as some of my work is £20/hour, then I can stick to those hours but if I earn more by doing more hours I'll just lose UC?

OP posts:
CellophaneFlower · 01/12/2022 18:26

oddsocksmatchifsamethickness · 01/12/2022 18:24

Thank you that makes sense.

Show quote history

Do check it out though, obviously. I'm only saying 25 hours as that's what somebody else posted further upthread.

LakieLady · 01/12/2022 18:30

WishingWell5 · 01/12/2022 16:53

@Closuretime I think people should claim for whatever they are entitled to. But in some cases, people are struggling whilst working. And I don't think that's right. Or they are missing out on help because they want to work more hours which takes them over some arbitrary cut off point... So then (understandably!) don't work those extra hours.

I think there is some truth in this, but I think it's because the taper rate in Universal Credit is too high.

Once you're over the tax/NI threshold, you lose 32% of any extra you earn, then UC goes down by 55% of what's left.

If you work an extra 10 hours at £10ph, you lose £32 in tax/NI, so your net pay goes up by £68. Then UC claws back £37.40, and you end up £30.60 better off. That's a marginal gain of £3ph. I wouldn't work an extra hour to be £3 better off, and I don't blame anyone else who feels the same.

My SDIL has just fallen foul of this. My lazy shit of a step-son decided to halve the amount of maintenance he pays for their daughter, because he's gone part-time. SDIL went straight out and got a new job, 4 days pw, that pays more than the 2 p/t jobs she had before, in the belief that she could make up some of the shortfall. She takes home another £60pw, but only keeps £27 of it.

WishingWell5 · 01/12/2022 18:33

@Closuretime I think my point is, you're right it's NOT a lot of money really, with the cost of living etc. BUT there are some people who work full time and take home far less.

Lougle · 01/12/2022 18:53

oddsocksmatchifsamethickness · 01/12/2022 18:26

So I need to work 16 hours but if I can earn more working those hours, as some of my work is £20/hour, then I can stick to those hours but if I earn more by doing more hours I'll just lose UC?

If your minimum income floor is 25XNMW, i can earn that however you like. If you can get work that you charge £60/hr for, you only need to work 6 hours per week to meet the MIF. If you earn £10/hr, you need 36 hours per week. Don't forget that it's profits that they look at in SE, not income.

Lougle · 01/12/2022 18:55

Also, if they've only offered you an advance of £200, that indicates that your award will be around that level, I think. We were offered an advance equal to our award.

Original poster
oddsocksmatchifsamethickness · 01/12/2022 18:57

Lougle · 01/12/2022 18:55

Also, if they've only offered you an advance of £200, that indicates that your award will be around that level, I think. We were offered an advance equal to our award.

They asked me how much I needed and I said that and they just said okay fine.

OP posts:
Original poster
oddsocksmatchifsamethickness · 01/12/2022 18:58

Lougle · 01/12/2022 18:53

If your minimum income floor is 25XNMW, i can earn that however you like. If you can get work that you charge £60/hr for, you only need to work 6 hours per week to meet the MIF. If you earn £10/hr, you need 36 hours per week. Don't forget that it's profits that they look at in SE, not income.

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Thank you, so I just tell them what I earn as minimum and they should make that the MIF I would think?

OP posts:
Creameggs223 · 01/12/2022 19:14

IncompleteSenten · 01/12/2022 07:32

Oh well. There you go. You can manage without it. You don't need to claim.

Ridiculous, she just about gets by the help is there for people in this situation and if it wasn't needed then pretty sure she wouldn't be entitled!!

Willyoujustbequiet · 01/12/2022 19:27

skerd · 01/12/2022 12:55

Bullshit. Absolute bullshit. Sorry, but this is just not true.

I work in this area and there is no way one adult with one child would ever get this much, unless their rent was sky high (which OP says it is 400 a month), or they were profoundly disabled.

The numbers just do not add up.

If anyone wants to check how much they'd be 'rolling in it' on UC, then put your details into a benefits calculator and see. It will be way less than this, and hardly anything after rent.

Typical spam benefits bashing post.

I'll post figures if you want me to, that it would be impossible for OP to get this much.

This

These threads are always fake/disingenuous.

jannier · 01/12/2022 19:47

LakieLady · 01/12/2022 15:41

An awful lot of people live in London and the SE, where rents and house prices are most expensive. I think it's over 18m now, so over 25% of the population.

I did a benefit calculation for a friend of a friend the other day. Her DH has just fucked off and left her with 3 kids, and she was frantic about how she was going to pay her rent on just her £40k salary.

She's entitled to just under £800 a month in UC, because rents here are so high. UC allow just under £1,200 a month for a 3-bed property in this area, but her actual rent is £1,600, so there's still a big gap between what they'll pay and how much rent costs here.

People moan about how much claimants get in benefits, but they don't realise that often a huge chunk of that goes straight to landlords.

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Lol....in my rubbish area of London nobody chooses to live in 1600 doesn't get a 2 bed anymore thanks to Chinese investors and the Elizabeth line I have a friend living in a one bed with 2 children 5 and 9 boy and girl while she sleeps in the living room of a poorly insulated flat and moody walls £1350

CellophaneFlower · 01/12/2022 20:14

oddsocksmatchifsamethickness · 01/12/2022 18:58

Thank you, so I just tell them what I earn as minimum and they should make that the MIF I would think?

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No. How much you earn is irrelevant. They will tell you how many hours they expect you to work (I assume 25) they times this by NMW. This will be the amount the assume you earn, even if you actually earn far less. This figure will determine how much UC you are awarded.

Justthisonce12 · 01/12/2022 20:16

Equally if i earn £1000 a day pressumably i could work for 1 day ?

carefulcalculator · 01/12/2022 20:20

Justthisonce12 · 01/12/2022 20:16

Equally if i earn £1000 a day pressumably i could work for 1 day ?

If you were rational you would work 2 days at that rate and save yourself the bother.

XenoBitch · 01/12/2022 20:23

I am always baffled that anyone gets their wage topped up by UC to the tune of £650pm, when if you are unable to work, that is all UC will pay you to start with.

CellophaneFlower · 01/12/2022 20:27

@oddsocksmatchifsamethickness
I work it out as they'll assume you earn 1128. If you put this into the calculator as your monthly wage, it should give you an idea of how much UC you'll get per month.

CellophaneFlower · 01/12/2022 20:27

That's based on NMW from April.

Justthisonce12 · 01/12/2022 20:33

carefulcalculator · 01/12/2022 20:20

If you were rational you would work 2 days at that rate and save yourself the bother.

Show quote history

I wouldnt ever have a day off, but that wasnt the question

bloodyeverlastinghell · 01/12/2022 21:01

XenoBitch · 01/12/2022 20:23

I am always baffled that anyone gets their wage topped up by UC to the tune of £650pm, when if you are unable to work, that is all UC will pay you to start with.

To be fair the op would get just over 1k due to rent. My UC entitlement is £1358. I don’t get that.I have a full time job and get substantially less. Lots of people could be entitled to more. Couple allowance, two kids in childcare, renting could realistically have an entitlement of £2500 a month. They’d need to be taking home over £3.4k between them to not get top ups. It’s an interesting system. If we funded childcare properly or social housing or gave a tax credit to parents like many western countries the need for top ups would e greatly reduced.