Is BIL Being Unreasonable?

[LindyHopathon]

NC for this.

BIL is always asking DH and me for money. Over the last two years we've given him £2,500.

He gets behind with his payments to utility companies, then makes no effort to stick to payment plans.

Today, he asked for a further £200 for his broadband, which he says he has not paid since June. I wish he'd mentioned it in June, so that there wasn't now a load of interest and charges on top of the original bill.

Would I BU not to give him the £200? I know quite well that he will never be able to pay us back (for any of it, not just the £200).

BIL has a lot of genuine health conditions and his sole source of income is state benefits. I feel so mean to be even considering not helping him out this time.

We're not - it's a new problem which he has just mentioned. I asked him how it came about that he hasn't paid since June and he didn't have a reasonable answer.

I think you’ve been really kind. Does his income genuinely not cover his outgoings? I’d sit down with him and do a budget and if he’s £xx short a month I’d probably look at taking on a permanent bill for him monthly at source and be very clear that that’s all the help you can afford to take on. That is if you feel he’s properly in need which sounds as though it could be the case. I’d also offer food/ assistance to help him access food bank help if that’s something else he needs.

You've done enough and I say rhat as someone who has bailed out a sister in similar circumstances for years.

Very sorry BIL, you cannot afford it anymore and giving money isn't fixing lifestyle problems.

There are debt services available through citizens advice. Refer him there every time.

Tell him to ask his broadband provider about social tariffs. There was something about them on one of Martin Lewis's itvshow recently.
Also tell him you can't give him anything as your own outgoings have increased.

You are not a bank OP. A one off payment to help someone get over a rough patch - absolutely. But you are just a regular income stream for him and the longer you pay out, the longer he will expect it and not be accountable for his own spending

I would accept that the £2500 is a sunken cost - you are not going to see that again. But you would be daft to keep this going

Or if you do budget it into your own outgoings as this will be an ongoing expense

Where do you draw the line? My answer: here

He needs to live by his means, which he clearly isn't doing. Is he claiming everything he's entitled to?

Where will it end? Refuse and ask him not to ask again as it’s getting very awkward.

He's relying on you as another source of income. You need to stop funding him or it will never end.

Does he have enough income or is he just poor at budgeting?

@FlissyPaps OP said he was on benefits, if he is only getting PIP that would explain why he has so little money, he should put in a claim for UC. Internet is considered an essential wen not on benefits too though, but there are ways to use free public wifi if you're mobile. I do agree, she shouldn't pay his bill. He needs to work out how to handle his finances and bailing him out all the time won't help him to do that.

He wants you to pay for his broadband. But he doesn't care that you also now have to pay the interest and overdue fines, so that the bill is even larger.
Also, he's not asking for a loan.
He's asking for a payment. And will ask for another payment.

Several posters have talked about offering to go to CAB or other financial helpers with him, and get him to work out his budgets, etc and what he can claim for ( and the social broadband scheme another pp mentioned.) seems like a very good idea

tel him to contact his braodband provider, and ask to be moved to a social tariff, and to ask them to agree a payment plan to pay off his debt. he needs to manage his won money. if he cannot manage it, then he needs to go to CAB to ask them to help him. its not your job to do this for him

Is this because of cognitive needs, physical needs, MH needs? What I mean is would his needs makes budgeting harder and maybe impulse control. Does he need support with financial management or anything else.

Disability payments are small and it is hard.

I think I might take a slightly different approach.

genuinely do his outgoings exceed his incomings or is he just massively disorganised?

Do his health conditions mean he has trouble sorting himself out?

If you think that there is genuine financial issue and you are willing to help him long term, (and there are a lot of ifs in that sentence) then I would choose one thing that I would be willing to pay for and take that on, on the basis that he doesn't ask for anything else.
There are also a lot of charities that will help with budgeting and I would be insisting that he gets help too.

If you feel mean not helping him out, could you give him the money this time, but tell him you can’t/won’t give him anything more going forward? Perhaps you (or your DH, as it’s his brother!) could also offer to help him to work out a monthly budget, so that he’s able to manage on his income, without asking you for help.
I certainly don’t think YABU though if you say no this time; you’ve already given him a lot.

It's not borrowing if you don't give it back. Can you afford to write off another £200?

If you can afford to lose it and you want to then yes. However I'm of the opinion that people won't sort their shit out unless they have to. It's easier for him to take your money than budget

Is there any charity associated with his specific illness that might support him now and then to help with bills? Is it possible for him to live on the money he gets? Here in lreland some social welfare payments can be accessed on a once off ..anything like that?
If l could afford it and was comfortable with my own bills l would take on one bill..maybe broadband so he is not cut off as its not easy coping with a lon term illness.

If he's on UC/ESA he can get BT broadband for £15 a month. It's a deal specially for COL crisis.
www.bt.com/broadband/home-essentials

He can maybe negotiate paying off the owed amount, assuming he's already with BT.

Most people use their phone. You can get very cheap Sim-only unlimited data plans. Mine is £15 per month.

He’s almost certainly paying for both a phone and separate broadband, so he could ditch the broadband.

Can he / you call the broadband provider and agree a repayment plan?

Can you afford to?

Is he wasting his money on other things, or can he genuinely not afford to live?

@LindyHopathon

Whether or not you and DH gift the money is between you.

Your BIL is disabled and his only income is benefits, it can be very difficult if you get an unexpected expense with little or no savings and this can impact on paying bills.

you and DH have been kind helping your BIL with cash. This time have you thought about offering a different type of help. Using your IT skills could you help BIL do an audit of his bills, MoneySavingExpert has a good guide how to do this. Simple things like moving to online bills may save your BIL money.

The other thing you could do is suggest that BIL sets up a second Bank Account for his bills. Each time he receives his benefits he puts x amount in the account (standing order) to cover the DD. This may help him budget better and possibly overtime build up a small buffer for unexpected expenses.

Some good advice on this thread. Going through his income and outgoing is a good idea as well as having separate accounts for payments. Getting advice to ensure he is getting all the benefit income and passport benefits. Even after that things may be very tight and knowing that might make you may want to help in a small way especially if there's nothing more he can do for himself. Do you know whether he has asked anyone else for money?