...to believe that as parents we have responsibilities, not rights, to our children?

[ABrotherWhoLooksLikeHellMugYou]

Not sure how much backdoor to give, but last week received furious messages and a blistering call from exH because he wanted to talk to the children on the phone and DS had basically locked himself in the loo with a book.

ExH's premise was that I was 'blocking access to the children'.
He had then EOW as agreed, plus I have said numerous times that if he wants to see them on the in between weekends or during the week to let me know and we can arrange it if we're free.

Our agreements were all done between ourselves, there's no child visitation order or whatever it's called. If the kids want to talk to their dad (and it's not a prevarication method half an hour after lights out) then I hand them my phone and let them call. I often prompt them to call him when somethings happened (class trophy etc).

Sometimes he calls/ messages asking for a call randomly. I don't always see the message because evenings are chaos. When I see the message, providing the kids are awake, not about to go to sleep and not out of the house at an activity, I ask them if they want to talk to dad.

Sometimes they do. Sometimes they don't. They're very much focused in the moment and don't always want to do what they're doing to call their father. I think it's a positive thing because it means they're secure.

In his head I am deliberately blocking access to them and should, I'm not sure, make then call him? He expounded loudly on how he has rights. He didn't specify exactly, but presumably rights to talk to his children whenever he's sad and lonely and it suits him? I dunno. I always believed we had responsibilities, not rights. AIBU?

I'm wondering about seeing up a regular phone call so they call to talk to him at X time once or twice a week and all the ad hoc shit stops. Not sure if that would placate him or infuriate him farther. I suspect someone has been in his ear winding him up about the whole thing. I've not heard him ranting about rights previously. It's not a welcome departure.

I do think there should be some other regular contact between EOW - that’s a long time to go without talking to your kids. But that might be his choice I guess.
He can’t decide that contact should always be on his terms that’s just not fair

I don't know but you sound kind of heartless, superior and hard work frankly. I wouldn't like to be the ex, I'd probably encourage my children to speak to their dad more personally but I assume there's some massive drip feed coming that he was abusive or something which is why you seem a bit cold about it all.

How old are they? Can you not just give them access to a phone between set times of the evening and tell him he's welcome to call then and they'll answer if they feel like it but you're not getting involved any more?

Yes its this possible

Friends DD is 5 and has her own phone just for her father - works well.

I forgot to mention DS does actually have a phone. Can call his dad whenever he wants and vice versa, but doesn't always charge the phone, or answer it. I do my best to remind him, but ultimately it's his phone.

Maybe he just misses his kids.
Maybe some empathy about how he feels might help you feel less inconvenienced.

Not heartless. Just trying to be dispassionate in my post and give facts not feelings. There's lots of backstory ( no deliberate abuse though) but not sure how relevant it is.

I've worked incredibly hard to keep things amicable for the kids. It feels like another betrayal to be accused of this when it's not true.

Yup that's all thats needed

That's too black and white. It's not either or.

As a parent you have responsibilities certainly but you also have the right to a relationship with your child unless you are abusive or the child is of an age where they can make an informed choice, made freely without manipulation from the other parent.

There's also some overlap where a responsibility is also a right.
For example, you have the right to make decisions that are in the best interests of your child. This is also your responsibility.

Actually, now I think about it, the right to a relationship with your child is also a responsibility to be in your child's life so maybe you are correct and parental rights are actually parental responsibilities.

YANBU. Your ex is totally focused on what he wants, rather than his child's preference.

I spent years putting his feelings first, then he left. I take my responsibility to the children and their access to their father seriously. I have to work very hard not to prioritise his feelings at the expense of my own, or theirs, tbh.

It's rather sad really, I can't imagine DS not wanting to talk to his dad, nor grandparents for that matter. As an adult, I've had countless 1-2 minute conversations with my dad where we just check in, say we love each other and that's that. I suspect there's a lot more to it, because "hi dad, we're good but just going to x. How are you? Ok bye, love you." only needs to take a minute and is perfectly friendly. If it were my kids, I'd want to get to the bottom of why they aren't chatting and teach them to use their own words to explain it to dad. For example, if he's asking too many questions and they just want to be quick, then they should say so, but TO HIM. If they just don't like him, then that's a more difficult matter.

Every other weekend makes it hard to build a meaningful relationship with kids. If there can’t be contact in between then phone calls should be facilitated by both parents and (depending on the age of the kids) the resident parent should be actively encouraging contact because children deserve to have meaningful relationships with both of their parents.

This is a really good point. DS certainly struggles with phone conversations. Their dad often wants more from them than they give naturally. DS just avoids it, DD engages and talks for ages to him, but it seems to take something out of her. It feels like she's stepped in to try and fill the hole I spent 15 years trying to fill.

Yanbu
My kids barely have contact in between the EOW that ex asked for...
They need I think to keep their lives separate, and Dad pushing for phonecalls was met with one word answers on the call when it was asked for by the court, so it's been dropped and it's kid-led now.

They have their own phone, wattsapp works better as they can leave a message before we leave the house for an activity, or if they have a certificate for something....but theres no pressure.
Dad very rarely answered either so it was a lot of disappointment for them when they did call.

During lockdown, my ex demanded he have video calls with ds every two days, basically because he was bored as far as I could tell. He hadn't bothered much over the preceding 11 years, but I answered the calls, took the phone to DS and left them to it.

After 30 seconds of the second call, ds said "I don't have anything to tell you so I'm going to play Minecraft now." and hung up.😂 Ex then rang me and said I'd poisoned ds against him.

Your dcs can call him whenever they wish, you aren't stopping them. Sounds like your ex can't take responsibility for his own failings. I wouldn't take any notice of his moaning. He's just another one who needs to look in the mirror occasionally.

This is true. Maybe the regular phonecards would be easier on everyone. I don't get random ad hoc requests or having to deal with him as much, the kids can have it as part of a routine (which works well for them (ND)) and Ex can talk to them regularly and just have as long as they're prepared to talk.

Sigh. This is all so horrible. I didn't want this for my kids. You just don't imagine it when you get married, do you? That one day this man you love will make you feel nauseous with anxiety every time your phone goes.

Getting someone off the phone when needed is a life skill, whoever the person is, so get them to learn how to do it. It's even harder in person, so it's important to start practicing by phone while young enough to hone the skills. It might be worth talking to them more generally about how to express what they want and how to stop conversations they don't like. Literally write the phrases down with them, so they start to see a range of options and start coming up with their own versions.

I think you read a different OP than I did. It sounds like her kids speak to their dad an awful lot in between contact with him and that she is very generous to allow (and indeed encourage) this all the time. She doesn’t sound cold, just a bit fed up. He’s being an arse in demanding that OP and the kids should drop everything to answer his calls at any moment. That’s extremely intrusive.

Not sure where you got “hard work” but it’s a classic misogynistic language to try and stick a woman back in her box. It’s never aimed at men.

Lol - v familiar! I think that's the reason my DS has most of the time!

I wasn’t suggesting you put his feelings first by the way. I was suggesting that you think of where this is coming from to help you come up with a workable solution that you sound very frustrated by.

There is obviously history but it’s better all round if you facilitate the relationship with their dad, for them not him.

They can’t not want to speak to him all the time but if they don’t it would be helpful to get to the bottom of that to understand whats going on for them.

This really isnt about rights or responsibilities

I love doing life skills. This is a great idea. DS is very practiced as getting granny off the phone 'I'm going to put mummy back on now. Bye granny' but has never tried this with his dad. I guess he knows we're not that keen to talk to each other.

I now have a list of niceties forming, let's see

• it was really nice talking to you but I have to go and do homework/ eat dinner/ get ready for bed
• sorry, I have to go, perhaps we could talk again on Wednesday?
• I'm going to go now but I'll see you the day after tomorrow

Any other ideas?

I wish I could just give DD a phone then she can bombard him with endless emoji and everyone would be happy, but I think 7 is too young and the back up phone I was considering got smashed so I'd have to buy something specifically and sod that.

Is there a reason why there is only EOW contact? Because rather than a regular phone call I’d expect the NRP to (at a minimum) see their children EOW and once a week for tea/overnight.

With us, the main issue is that ds finds his df very dull. Ex insists on telling him the cricket scores and what happened in the rugby, neither of which ds is interested in.

I even resorted to writing a list of things DS could tell his dad about - places he'd been, came top in physics test, karate grading - but that lasted about 90 seconds.

The real issue is they have nothing except genes in common. Ex never takes ds anywhere because they have totally different interests, and ex refuses to put himself out at all. A few phone calls won't fix that. And in the end I can't fix it for him.