Are we morally obliged to work ?

[Justthisonce12]

630,000 economically inactive people in the UK not claiming benefits. Early retiree’s I guess.

Hunt plans to tackle this and encourage work force participation to allow businesses to grow. ie cheap labour I presume ? But also preventing a brain drain.

Will be interesting to see how he plans to address this.

I wouldn't have put it quite like that but ... exactly ! 😀

@Mariposista doesn’t sound controversial. Just really stupid. If everyone was in paid employment, who did you think would run the food banks, the homeless shelters and do countless other charity work?

I have a feeling that‘a already on the cards for a lot of nations that felt they could weather a population decline and energy one at the same time.

Agree. He is trying to get 600k+ people off Universal Credit and back into the workplace not to get £600k+ non benefit claiming people back into the working arena if they've already retired.

These are people who are not entitled yet to a state pension. They can do what they want.

There's a couple of SAHMs that have commented on this thread, they are a good example. Most will have used the NHS for the birth, pre and post-natal stuff and then the kids that they're mum to will go to school. Both health services and education are free for SAHMs but they are not contributing their fair share of tax to help pay for it

So how would you target women like me to get us back to work full time? I have two University degrees, currently working on number 3. Not in receipt of any benefits. I have a civil service pension and a private pension. I can't think of "acceptable" carrots or sticks which would push me into working full time right now.

@Lozzybear I'm in a very similar position, 47, 2 x DC in private school. I have about 8yrs left of school fees to pay then I'll be stepping right back too. I've paid nearly £50k in tax so far this year and don't want to keep working all hours in a stressful job to hand most of it over to HMRC. If labour get in at the next election and add VAT to school fees, my DC will be back in the state system immediately, which would mean I can step back even earlier and stop paying so much tax.

But early retirees are funded from the private/company pension, not the state pension so your argument there is flawed.

I notice that there's a lot of concern over getting back into work the non-working over 50s who stuck two fingers up during pandemic and decided they'd had enough - me included. Their 'experience and maturity' is needed, apparently

I didn't "work" for a long time when I was a stay at home parent. My financial circumstances meant that I didn't need to, and even now that my kids are grown I only work sporadically. I have contributed to society just as much, if not more, as many people who have paid jobs, by raising my children and a lot of volunteer work in various roles. I do not feel guilty about not helping businesses grow, ffs.

@Schlaar two different childminders if need be ? What are you qualified in?
There are part time jobs in hospitality and sometimes just lunch shifts so maybe 11-2.30 etc also many jobs consider job share , reduced hrs
Yes harder to find but they are there
School jobs , even if only a few hrs a week it keeps you in the workforce and once your in somewhere often Other offers come up
But its situations like yours that show more after school clubs needed , holiday etc

@Pixiedust1234 you wouldn't be included or forced but why does your dh not let you have access to money that is more worrying

630,000 people is nothing. Barely a blip of demographics. Will make for soundbites so it appears like the Tories are tackling the 'workshy' and economy but taxing the very rich and companies will be far more effective.

As would improving pay and working conditions in certain sectors, as well as making it financially easier to retrain.

I'm economically inactive, fit, healthy and in my 50s.

If I were to go out to work, either my husband would have to cut back his extremely well paid hours, or we'd have to employ a part-time cleaner, a part-time gardener and a part-time carer for my elderly mother. Plus the charity I support would lose that support.

So I suppose my going out to work would create a further three part time jobs (the gardener would only be a couple of hours a fortnight, so not exactly a job).

My husband is a higher rate taxpayer, so he if cut back, and I went out to work, our tax bill would drop dramatically, so that would be a plus for us, though maybe not what Mr Hunt wants to happen. We are aware that we'd be financially better off if the hours my husband works were split between us, but he's in a job which is both specialised and important, whereas the sort of job I could get would be the sort of job anyone with the right degree could do.

Yes this too, although apparently retired people get hefty discounts, we’re all paying council tax for at least the majority of our lives. VAT on almost everything we buy.
If you have a big inheritance the tax has been paid on the income originally and you’re then paying tax again when you get it. Stamp duty when you move house etc.

Unless someone has found a way of buying shit without paying tax on it, or without the people you buy it from and who made it paying taxes (and so on) then nobody in the UK can possibly "economically inactive" and Jeremy Hunt is a stupid cunt.

Buy a bus ticket to your UC interview ? Then you, my friend, are economically active.

DLA isn't means tested, or at least it didn't used to be. Are you sure you've been given the correct advice? I'd look into it again.

Been there people are surprisingly nasty about it or insist it's not so as if we hadn't done the sums.

DH Uncle ended up giving up work - MIL didn't help us or her parents with even minor care - he had so many hospital appointment with both parents couldn't cope with work as well- went p/t then though oh well will only be a few years - nearly 15 and by end nearer 60 and people weren't keen to take him on.

My Dmum stopped before retirement age as she was so exhausted and her own health was starting to fail from 4 lots of GP care and medical appointments and my Dad increasingly failing health. Then they helped Dsis single mother out a lot. They did end up okay as one set of GP left some wealth to their children.

I knew a few women take early retirement to provide full time childcare for their usually daughter when they split - so they could work ft.

Also know a few who had to give up work as waiting for operations their health decline to such an extent it wasn't possible any more.

There's quite a few reason people can support themselves or really can't work.

Early retirees do not get their state pension early they have to wait until State Pension age. At state pension age they get the state pension they have contributed to.

I am an early retiree and pay tax on my work pension, I also pay tax on savings income over £1k a year with rising interest rates I will pay more tax this year. When I get my state pension I will pay tax on that, I am therefore still contributing to NHS etc. I also pay council tax and VAT on purchases which all go to council and government services.

I am not sitting back and expecting society to fund me.

Thank you. I was in the last few months of maternity leave so think I'm not not "available for work" until DC starts nursery in January but I'll look into it.

No, you are not morally obliged to work. If you can find a way to live without having to work you’ve basically won at life.

However, you are morally obliged to not be a burden on others.

@edwinbear there is a part of me that wants to downsize our home, pay the school fees in advance, take a minimum wage job and then stick two fingers up at the future Labour government and everyone else who thinks that they are subsidising my DC’s education when in fact DH and I have been subsidising others for years. I barely use the NHS and then I am expected to pay more tax on my private health cover. It’s all bollocks and I am sick and tired of it.

I think he is talking to me at the moment…. I work 25 hours and have 4 DC. I could work more. DH works 60 hours and pays huge amounts of tax. I shall not work more for you Jeremy Dear because you are just going to tax me 40 pc if I do and if I go all out, you are going to tax me 45 per cent now. Would rather watch/supervise my DC because the shit education you are providing where I have to plug the gaps. And the poor teachers are on their knees.

I have friends in my category who are trained doctors etc, lawyers, teachers. Provide some good quality education and childcare if you want us to be at our most productive. An educated mother is always going to prioritise her DC if she is already comfortable enough.

Yes, I agree. So many vital services are run by volunteers.

Yep. But people are very attracted to the idea that there's a conveniently sized cohort of skivers available for the state to plug the labour market hole. It's easier than addressing the reality that we have very significant structural issues that aren't easily fixed.