CEO should resign and be charged with corporate manslaughter

[Istheworldreallydonefor]

It’s time senior management event their pay or faced the consequences
.
Rochdale Boroughwide Housing CEO must face the music.

www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-manchester-63641438

AIBU - you think CEO’s should not face the music

AINBU - they should be charged

An utter disgrace. Tragically I foresee many more deaths and illnesses occurring due to mould this winter if people can’t afford to heat. Anyone remember this report a year ago?
www.itv.com/news/2021-04-13/investigation-launched-into-disgusting-damp-and-mouldy-council-housing-after-itv-news-report

Could those blaming the tenants read @wherethewildthingis 's post ?

There has been an inquest. This has been thoroughly investigated. It isn't a case of foreigners from hot dry climates being too stupid and lazy to ventilate their luxurious home (surprisingly nobody has yet pointed out that this is funded by hard working British families)

*The flat Awaab lived in did not have a window in the bathroom and the window in the kitchen led to a communal walk way."

Shall I add more ? The landlord in this case has admitted fault and that they should have done more to repair the home and prevent the mould. The family is not to blame*

@wherethewildthingis

exactly

not the families fault.

i am amazed people defend the CEO etc.
if something isn’t safe it is not safe regardless of the legislation.

and ethical CEO would do something.

it is very clear they didn’t.

until these people are made accountable these things will continue.

Yes he should be charged with manslaughter. And all of those within the council who have been communicating with the family need to be investigated and also charged. I am just waiting for this thread to turn into a racist one, placing blame on the Sudanese family as mumsnet has form for this. Disgusting.

@Quveas

well one has to start somewhere and this is a good example of unethical behaviour that led directly to the death of a child.

stop being an apologist for this bad management.

some of the other things you say are true.
but the ceo is ultimately responsible

so it’s not about the public demain it’s about being a ceo and ensuring you have accountability in place.

"Tenants should open windows." There's a limit to how much this is feasible, for example when it's cold and hearing's expensive, or if you're out of the house most of the day.

Likewise not drying washing indoors. Not all rental properties even come with an outdoor space for drying, and what are people meant to do in wet weather? A tumble dryer isn't always an option for various reasons (cost, space).

I have voted YABU purely because I never understand why people want the CEO jailed.

Jailing a CEO should lead to accountability. Look what happened to companies who are listed on the NYSE after Worldcon and Enron.

You can guarantee if the top of the food chain thinks they might go to jail, they might implement procedures and checks that will prevent this kind of thing.

@Quveas

ps the law in corporate responsibility exists for a reason but I do t see it used much.

time to ensure directors are held to account

I am not blaming the tenants. I am simply saying we don't know what happened, or why. Clearly something went terribly wrong. Maybe what went wrong was nobody explaining to the tenants how to care for the home - that would not be blaming the tenants, that would be blaming the system

I was listening to the records of their complaints being read out on the radio news - the first time the mould appeared, it was dealt with, the second time, it wasn't. This is an old building, poorly designed, but it was overcome with mould in a relatively short period of time - there was no mould there 30 months ago.

WE dont know what happened or why. We dont know if any individuals were racist to this family, and if that impacted on their housing conditions.

This needs to be fully investigated, at length, no quick knee jerk reaction, like sack the CEO, or whatever.

I know lots of British whites living in mouldy accommodation. But it certainly seems from what the coroner said that racist assumptions were at play here, blaming the tenants for ritual bathing, etc. when they were not doing that.

My friend lives next door to someone who carries out ritual bathing. This causes a constant mould problem in my friends house, which she has to clear on a monthly basis. Could ritual bathing have been mentioned as a factor, meaning one of the neighbours, and wires got crossed?

Whatever happened, it needs to be examined in detail

How many times do you need to read this -

THE INQUEST HELD THAT IT WAS NOT THE FAULT OF THE TENANTS

@2greenroses we do know what happened. We know exactly what happened. Inquests are extremely detailed investigations, looking at every single aspect, with a jury. The conclusion of the inquest was that the family were not to blame

The tenants behaviour would have been thoroughly assessed to see if this was a contributory factor.

Inquest conclusions are entirely fact based

How many times can I repeat this

I AM NOT SUGGESTING IT WAS THE FAULT OFTHE TENANTS

We know what happened - we do not know why, or who

Your posts are literally "I am not blaming the tenants but....."

Yes, lots like to blame mould on that, but these severe cases of it are quite often due to structural issues that tenants cannot and should not have to fix them themselves. It’s really convenient to blame it on “lack of ventilation”.

The inquest stated that the family's lifestyle was not to blame. It is not hard to understand. Why go around, and around asking the same questions, that have already been investigated? The family did nothing wrong.

It might be that the parents behaviour contributed or did not, but that is not blaming them. If they could have done something but they didn't, or they did something that made it worse, then the investigation needs to look at why that happened.

how this this not blaming the tenants?
@2greenroses

Maybe do a bit of research into what an inquest is and how they work? The questions you pose above WILL HAVE BEEN THOROUGHLY EXPLORED

With regards to lack of social housing to rehome people,this is Rochdale i can't speak for Rochdale directly but knowing 2 people who have been rehoused recently due to tenacies ending in neighbouring areas both were rehoused without an issue, neither needed to go to emergency housing. There is availability in the general area.

How anyone could see those pictures and start saying maybe the parents contributed to it i don't know, maybe because I know about buildings and was with someone else who does too and we were both horrified, trust me you don't get that from drying clothes inside unless something is fundamentally wrong with the property and then it's not the drying that caused it.

I am not being an apologist. I'm being a realisti. Rant and rave and blame as much as you like. Why don't YOU try balancing the books? Public services have been lodly telling anyone who would listen for over a decade that people are at risk because of the lack of resources to support the most vulnerable people in society. That isn't blaming the family.

How much more taxes and council tax are you prepared to pay to support the many and iverse demands of the most vulnerable in society? ANd I mean that - how much more will you pay? Because I keep reading all the threads about how people are disgusted about their tax bills, can't afford the cost of living / energy bills despite being on decent wages, and demanding CUTS in taxes and no increases in council tax. How will you square that circle. People don't want to pay / can't pay, but you expect public services to continue to resource adequately an increasingly heavy social care budget that includes housing for those who don't have the luxury of alternatives. ANyone who think that the era of slum housing is over hasn't seen the state of a lot of the private sector housing, never mind the public sector.

This isn't "news". Housing conditions - both public and private, have been adding to the burden of ill-health and early death for decades and will continue to do so because NOBODY CARES about the poor and disadavnatged until they are a headline that they can post self-righteous rants about. Then move on. The condition of much of our UK housing is no secret. None at all. So why weren't you kicking up a fuss about it on Monday, last week or last month? What will you be doing about it next month?

Being a keyboard warrior and demanding retribution is easy. Job done, move on to the next thing to rant about. It doesn't require effort or money or thought. Let me know when you have a solution to the chronic underfunding and how you intend to go about doing something about that. Then I might be impressed.

Fine - why don't you fund a prosecution?

There isn't going to be any nuanced discussion here. It all going to be "hang them high" provided it doesn't impact on me in any way.

Let me know when you have fixed the housing crisis in the UK, will you? Until then, rant on without me. Rants have never changed anything. Actions do.

Corporate manslaughter is a legal offence that was brought in that means the person at the top is legally liable for criminal activity in their organisation if there were reasonable opportunities to avoid it. Remember the staff further down are simply enacting policy made by the top people.

This is not about nuance. That flat was riddled with damp and was a danger to human health. No one should have been living there. A court case was started. The council should have just fixed it instead of fighting the court case.

Reminds me of the Lyme Bay Canoeing case back in the 1990s

What happened is absolutely heartbreaking and tragic but we don’t know enough to
conclude that corporate manslaughter charges are appropriate.

I rent out my old house. When I lived there for >10 years - no damp. 2 subsequent tenants - no damp. Next tenant - constant complaints about persistent damp which I rectified but it kept coming back, at one point paying for their accommodation in another house. They were unhappy that it started to come back again and gave notice. I painted over and warned next tenant. No damp issues with next and current tenant… 🤷🏻‍♀️

ofc Rochdale should have made sure there was nothing being inadvertently done by the tenants to cause damp, but any house is damp with wet washing, no dehumidifier, no daily window opening etc. We just don’t know enough about the cause 🤷🏻‍♀️