Why are some NHS staff unkept looking?

[BoozySuzie]

I don't visit hospitals often thank goodness but I can't help but notice a lot of staff in hospitals are quite scruffy. Surely working in a hospital environment it is imperitive to be spotlessly clean and well groomed?? The Philipino nurses always look clean and tidy it's just our staff.

Ha Ha - still no excuses for eating crappy food. We all appreciate nurses works long hours (although in my NHS trust it's only 37h/w) so there really is NO excuse for obese nurses.

I agree reduce the door width to measure girth of staff, lock the lift

I think nurses should be like Air Hostess' in the 70's and 80's
Don't bother applying unless you're 5'8 or above.

Jesus, i don't want to be lying in my death bed washed by a smelly fat bird, no no no.

Bring me the nurse Angels with their beautiful faces, i bet they all know Jesus.

I'm sure they all have time to sit down to a healthy balanced tea when they get home at 12midnight

and get some fine ass consultants in there!

not these weasely kids masquerading as juniors or these old farts.

or women!

sheesh!

May i have a six pack inserting my catherter (sp?), why thankyou, now if you don't mind i don't not pay bupa for nothing, spray something a little more pleasing on, and get rid of that scruffy fat cow from behind you, she is ruining my view.

Not going to even bother responding to the op -

nhsmanager - if we are going to pretend that patients are "customers" then don't you think the majority of them would prefer a decent standard of care (eg plenty of contact with nursing staff and access to medical staff), good quality food, best treatment and access to up to date, working equipment? Don't patronise patients by pretending that they are customers - they are not. They have very little choice as to where they go or what treatment they receive. I doubt they really care that much that a nurse on a long day or night shift isn't looking his/her best. I was amused by your observation that nurses pick the high sugar/fat snacks in the canteen. Was that a randomised sample for your evidence-based research?

Most nhs managers have a clinical background you say. Well excuse me while I retort!

I challenge you to spend a week doing shifts with clincial staff. You need to walk a mile in their shoes.

Oh and I'm not fat. I'm not immaculate though - I do apologise. Like Peacelily I spend a lot of time rolling around on the floor with violent mentally disordered patients. On a good day I get to go to the toilet twice during a shift and manage to scoff some cereal and/or have a cup of tea. I don't want a medal.........but don't insult hardworking clinicians with your feckless comments.

I am a care assistant with the elderly and work for the NHS,I work three night shifts and usualy a forth night over time most weeks, it is over three years since staff had new uniforms and now we are wearing our own clothing to work, its time the NHS started reconising just what we do for the sick and the elderly, we are also waiting for three years back pay and their is no sign of it being paid in the near future.

Yes and don't forget that the government pays our pay rise (as much as 3% if we're lucky)in two stages so that it is worth far less by the time we get it and we have been taxed twice.

D'you know I can't actually be bothered reading the rest of the thread (I read up to this afternoon at some point).

I was at A&E this evening, with ds2, who needed his face patching up. Didn't really notice (or care) what the staff looked like - that they could do their jobs was more important to me (as I suspect it was to the "cardiac arrest, ETA 1 minute" arriving just as we were leaving)

Dh is an NHS microbiologist. He is fairly scruffy (that's just him - even at our wedding he looked vaguely dishevelled) but as he wears a white coat in work I don't suppose it matters too much. He works a 23 and a half hour shift when he's on call. Sometimes he sleeps for an hour on two chairs pushed together in the staff room. Before "Agenda for Change" and the Working Time Directive he often did 32 hour shifts and an 80+ hour week. He looked unkempt as hell at the end of that.

Still, he's damn good at his job and I guess that's what counts when he's, say, testing a sample from a baby with suspected meningitis.

Every time I am in hospital I always make sure to leave a nice tin or box of choccies at the nurses' station.

It should be healthy salads or fruit.

Well, I worked in a hospital (Respiratory Laboratory) and I found that the nurses working clinics with normal office hours mostly looked very well turned out a neat. Ward nurses also looked pretty good to me, though you could always tell which nurses worked the wards by their look of exhaustion coupled with a sort of frantic energy.

I think that working as a ward nurse is a fecking hard job, physically and emotionally. Staffing ratios are negligently low considering the needs of the patients and the staff are massively overworked. Nurses in the clinic I worked in would talk about their time on the wards the same way veterans talk about their time at war.

I think the OP's comment on Philipino nurses was racist and ignorant.

I think that cleanliness is far more important than looking good, it's a hospital for heavens sake! This is an environment where you will routinely encounter blood, piss, shit, vomit and big gooey green globs of mucus (you can tell I worked in the respiratory clinics, huh?). Farmers and builders don't get up in the mornings and doll themselves up precisely because they know they'll be covered in crap by the end of the day anyway, yet almost all the nurses I've encountered have taken the time to put on their make-up anyway.

This post on NHS Blog Doctor has a letter from a nurse describing how it is physically impossible to do her job properly. From the things I saw and heard while working in a hospital, and the few times I have been an inpatient I have no trouble believing that this nurse is describing a routine dilemma for many ward nurses. No wonder they sometimes look a bit frazzled.

I haven't read all the posts on this thread, but as a full-time nurse (currently on mat leave) I would just like to point out the situation with uniforms we're in. I had 2 sets of uniforms for a five day week, often working 7 or 8 shifts in a row. We are supposed to wash them separately at 60 deg, since hospitals don't launder our uniforms anymore. Sometimes I would get home at 11.30pm and need to wash uniforms before leaving the next morning at 5.50 am. Unsurprisingly, sometimes I skipped ironing them, just hung them up to dry. I was clean, if a little creased.
IMO trusts should provide a scrubs laundry service for clinical staff - would be far better for infection control, and no-one would travel to and from work in their uniforms either! I think I was the only person on my ward to change at work - not surprising since the 'locker room' was the size of a cupboard and shared with the blokes.
Also (last point I promise!), IME the 'tidy' looking nurses were the slackers who ignored call bells to check their make up. That's a massive generalisation by the way, and I'm envious of those rare people who manage to finish a shift without a hair out of place despite working hard.

Quoting the OED

Patient noun- a person receiving or registered to receive medical treatment.

Customer noun- a person or organization that buys goods from a shop or business.

Call me a pedant. (It's better than unkempt, and obese. )

I have not read all this thread but.....

I used to be a registered nurse and have worked both in a ward environment and also A & E. After a twelve hour shift, often with only one 30min break at lunch time, I was, by the end of the shift far from looking kempt and fragant smelling. I never had time to nip to the loo for a pee, never mind to check my hair/makeup/apply deodorant etc. Some nursing staff managed too (I don't know how, but they did).

As Meebles points out, our uniform allocation was dire, the changing facilities (if lucky enough to have them ) were a laugh. I used to wash my uniform when I got in at the end of a shift hang it up hoping it would be dry enough to put back on the next day.

I must say that in my frequent visits to hospitals (as, unlike BoozySuzie I do visit a lot), the presentation of nursing staff has never been notable enough to catch my eye. I cast my eye round the waiting room sometimes and feel a pang of sympathy and respect over some of the customers patients they have to treat, and have at times despaired of some of the systems in place - or not. I've looked at the floors and bathrooms and thought 'yuk' - but I honestly can't remember ever having a negative reaction to the personal apprance of a member of staff.

yes expat - to hell with the chocolates - nurses want nothing more than to chew on a lettuce leaf after a particularly hectic shift. Or why not leave them some shower gel and deodorant? they'll thank you for that.

Well I think nhsmanager summed it up very well. Obesity, as we all know, is a problem in this country and obesity will lead to health problems, nhs nurses (a lot) are obese or quite a bit overweight - they are not setting a good example to patients are they, especially if they have to advise patients on healthy eating, maintaining a healthy body weight, exercise etc.

As for appearance, I agree with BoozySuzie, the appearance of nurses is somewhat scruffy. Some look like they have just rolled out of bed having slept in their uniform .

I disagree, I don't think it matters, as long as they do their job well.

Where are the facts and figures then to say 'alot ' of nhs nurses are fat and overweigth ?

I take it that nurses that work in 'private' hospitals are slim ?

what a utter load of crap , get over yourselves some of you !

You try doing their job !

I think a number of important issues have been raised by this thread and it is shame that they cannot be debated without puerile mudslingling and the sensationalist evocation that nursing equates to martydom .

At my trust I have been surprised by the number of very overweight nurses that I have seen. Apart from the health issue for those concern, I have seen some who struggle to move about or who move about very slowly indeed. They don't need castigation - they need support, advice and help but until they recognise that they do have a serious health problem, how can anyone help them?

Also, I maybe old-fashioned but I believe people should make an effort to make themselves presentable at work. In a NHS trust you are coming into contact with the public all the time and therefore you are an ambassador for that trust. If you look like you have just rolled out of bed, it gives the impression that

1. you don't care about how you come across to others
2. you are indifferent to those who employ who and with whom you work
3. it implies (wrongly in most instances) that you apply the same indifference towards your work
4. it does affect the way others approach and/or treat you.
5. if you want to take on leadership role such as ward sister, you are not cognizant of how you may appear to others.

I know this appears superficial but I'm afraid, first impressions count. Also, being presentable is not about wearing makeup, or not having a hair out of place - that is nonsense - it is about not looking dishevelled.

As usual there have been the predictable ignorant, lazy comments about managers, pen-pushers blah, blah, blah? Do you think hospitals run themselves? The NHS is going through a number of changes because it needs modernising. NHS trusts have to provide clinical assurance on the services that they provide via a framework of clinical governance which assesses the quality as well as the effectiveness of its activities. In my experience, the biggest blocker to these changes are people. It is very difficult to change the culture of an organisation, especially when you have groups with extremely entrenched views. I totally understand and sympathise with their reasons but ultimately, they have to recognise that the NHS is there to deliver a service to its patients and they have to derive maximum benefit from the resources they have at their disposal and to our those services with those of primary care providers like GPs, community services etc. That requires leadership, management and judgement which has to be provided by the much maligned pen pushers who work in concert with clinicians, nurses, midwives, allied health workers like physiotherapist etc.

It is very easy to sit outside and carp on about waste, pen pushers, too many managers etc but it is more difficult to get involved and make effective change for the benefit of the patient who whether you like the term or not, is ultimately, a customer receiving a service from us.

Anyway, I will definitely leave this thread now.

to integrate those services with those of primary care providers like GPs, community services etc

"I have not read all this thread but.....

I used to be a registered nurse and have worked both in a ward environment and also A & E. After a twelve hour shift, often with only one 30min break at lunch time, I was, by the end of the shift far from looking kempt and fragant smelling. I never had time to nip to the loo for a pee, never mind to check my hair/makeup/apply deodorant etc. Some nursing staff managed too (I don't know how, but they did)."

I said the same thing about no breaks and not being able to go to the toilet a few pages back and got accused of exaggerating.

Before I left I was down to one uniform. I would get home at 11 night after a shift and put it in the wash, stay up to hang it up and hope it was dry by morning. Then at 5 AM I would get up, have a shower and iron it quick. It was a mess anyway though. But we weren't allowed to have any new ones or buy our own. We also had to change in a supply cupboard outside the ward in the foyer. The door wouldn't lock and there would be people sitting out there in the foyer. So whenever anyone came into the closet to get changed while you are mid change...

What other univeristy educated professionals put up with this crap?

We are always so rushed with an overwhelming workload and constant interruptions. Years ago one of my colleagues was trying to do a drug round at the end of a long day and was getting constantly interrupted by phone calls and relatives. She made a huge mistake with warfarin that killed someone.

It's no picnic that is for sure. I now work from 9 to 4 monday through thursday and get to wear a nice outfit to "work" (if you can call it that).

Nursing would be great if nurses had a manageable number of patients, less interruptions and could do their job properly. There is no back up by management. No slack in the system. If one patient goes bad then you cannot see your others and they will complain about you!

They will leave one nurse in charge of 15 patients and when they complain about waiting too long for their call bells to be answered management will chuck the blame back on the nurse. It's sick. What is happening with one patient can interfere with what you can do with another so the more patients you have causes your existing patients to suffer.

Can't wait until we move to the states next year. The state I am going to has nurse patient ratio laws so I will never have more than 5 patients, I will have lots of nice uniforms to wear to work, and I can take in a 6 figure salary if I pick up enough overtime. I used to work there years ago and I am looking forward to it.

NHSmanager - I'm a university administrator, and so am in a similar position to you in that I'm facilitating what happens in my institution (ie universities could run without admin (not terribly well) but could not without academics), but I do hope that your attitude here is not one you take to work with you, as it implies:

1. you don't care about how you come across to others
2. you are indifferent to those with whom you work, and whose work you are supposed to facilitate
3. it implies (wrongly in most instances) that you apply the same indifference towards your work
4. it does affect the way others approach and/or treat you.

Have you asked the nurses whose appearance distresses you how they're doing?

Right Marissa and NHS manager. I challenge you to come to my ward and work a 15 hour shift in charge of 20 patients with nothing but one auxillary to help you out. You have to wear my uniform (size 10).

We will take a polaroid of you at the beginning of the shift and one at the end of your shift....which will probably be an hour later as you are running away screaming from the insane workload and the responsibility.

NHS manager, the nhs does need managers. That is a fact. But they are not effective unless you have enough frontline staff and good organization on the ward. You can have the best managers in the world, if the RN/patient ratios are too high the care delivered will be terrible. It's like asking teacher to teach 200 kids at once with constant interruptions. She may be a good teacher and her manager might be good but how effective could she be?