To risk arrest for protesting about the climate emergency?

[medicellen]

I have recently taken part in climate protests with Extinction Rebellion but have stopped short of activities that would lead to an arrest.

I am a scientist and it has been beyond doubt for some years that the climate emergency is accelerating.

And yet, global carbon emissions continue to increase. Our government is granting new licences for fossil fuels, whilst oil companies rake in massive profits. This is utter madness (aka "collective suicide" according to the lead of the UN).

I have an 8-year old son who says one day he might like to have children. I have avoided saying that this may be either not possible or not desirable due to the state of the climate by then.

Petitions, campaigning, pleas, marches have failed. In my mind, the only option left is civil disobedience. Mass arrests advanced the causes of suffrage and civil rights and I am now contemplating arrest as the only meaningful contribution I have left.

@PaperDoves - I am aware that there is disagreement about exactly how the suffragette activity played out, but there is more consensus around the general efficacy of non violent civil disobedience (India, US etc)

I agree with your concerns, but I don't agree with the sorts of protests which would risk you getting arrested, especially if they destroy artworks, (or attempt but fail to), or prevent sick people getting to hospital in an ambulance.

The comparison to the civil rights movement is not really fair to me. Those were protesting to enable people to access the same rights as everyone else. I don't think they ever stopped ambulances getting to hospital either?

Like you, I studied environmental science and I also studied politics at uni. I personally think that most significant political change has come from legal means. I also think XR etc protesting makes little sense unless it is just to vent frustration (in which case do that, feel better, get arrested, done) as no sane person disagrees with their concerns about climate change.

I also think they spread disinformation sometimes at rallies. People with no education on the subject make slightly wild declarations that the world will end in the next decade etc to whip up enthusiasm.

TL:DR - I agree either your concerns but yabu to join in with these protests (imo)

@TheaBrandt - what action would you advocate to try and mitigate the worst of what is coming?

@ShallowHalWantsAGal - knowing the science, what actions would you advocate to try and mitigate the worst of what is coming?

This! They need to cause massive disruption to the government and the richest in society (otherwise known as those with the highest carbon footprint!), and not us "normal" folk who don't have the power to change anything.

Yes please do actions. The more people that do, the more likely we can stop this. All movements that effected systemic change in the past were unpopular to begin with.

@girlmom21 - I would arrange childcare for the 24-48hrs associated with arrest

I'm sure you're aware of the supposed Einstein quote about insanity. Groups have been trying civil disobedience for climate issues for years, and all it's done is piss off the general public and allowed politicians and businesses to demonise the cause. Why would you keep doing it?

I have an 8-year old son who says one day he might like to have children. I have avoided saying that this may be either not possible or not desirable due to the state of the climate by then.

Nah, by then earth may be trashed but Elon will have colonised Mars so he’s likely to get a few generations in before that’s gone 😂.

@Peoniesandcream - do you have any evidence for any of the claims you have made, or is it more convenient to dismiss protesters due to your perception of them? Have you ever spoken to any of them?

Noone gives a shit about the message you are trying to send when you prevent ambulances reaching dying patients.

And yet it’s okay when nurses want to strike possibly having the same outcome on patients. (Yes, it won’t be specifically emergency nurses but it’ll still affect things and have knock on effects if all the non emergency ones are off.)

Name and shame politicians

Give a public list of politicians by impact and voting record to help people know who to vote for your

Did it work for the suffragettes? The faction that engaged in it ended their hardline campaign in 1914 having achieved nothing in the advancement of suffrage. Their mainstream leader then worked with the government during the war years and lobbied for change. This was successful after the war.

What civil rights movement are you referring to? Many have ended in crack downs and endless violence followed by descent into chaos. Surely you can see that MLK achieved more through peaceful protest than the more radical groups?

peaceful protest and lobbying have been far more successful at achieving progress in the world.

Extremist action doesn’t result in change. It results in a reaction and hardening of positions. Resulting in vicious circles. For that there are many awful examples of life getting worse.

You are going to end up with a criminal record and for what?
It won't change anything.

People are trying to make the changes they are able to, no one is minimising the climate etc and we are slowly changing ~ yes it is not fast enough, but honestly for now it will have to do. People are too worried about their bills, keeping warm and getting through the winter, you are likely just to create anger and backlash and turn people off the cause.

Already the mood in the country is changing because of these nutters. Holding up ambulances and special needs buses, no one is going to thank you for this idiocy. Do something powerful and positive.

Push for mitigation as well as reduction in emissions through legal means, such as raising public awareness through social media and through people with a public profile. Positive public engagement is absolutely key imo.

Shrieking that the end is nigh, plastering on a petulant face and chucking soup at a painting does not improve engagement.

Where movements in the past have successfully used the sorts of protests where they risked arrest, it was to raise awareness when the majority of people did not agree with them. This is not the case for the climate emergency where every sensible person on the planet agrees with the science. If you were engaging in these protests 30-40 years ago when Shell was still telling people global warming was a myth, I'd be with you. But you're shouting to people what they already know at this point. I think most people are asking for solutions at this point. Protesting and being disruptive on a subject most people agree with you on is nonsensical. But I would understand if you did it for your own reasons - simply to vent frustration. But don't pretend in that case that you're doing it for anyone but yourself.

@medicellen There is lots you can do personally that can have significant impact. Rather than spend your time protesting, which by and large will just piss a lot of people off, why not volunteer to become a sustainability champion at work of within you local community, perhaps your sons school of local sports clubs? All these organisations will need people like you, and to be honest as a scientist you're incredibly well placed - carbon footprint calculations are GCSE level max. Once you understand the carbon footprint of e.g. your village hall it's relatively simple to identify the changes required - more insulation, zero CO2 heating, charging points. It then needs someone to raise the money and find and apply for grants. Once you've done this advertise it! We need positive examples.

We need to stop shifting responsibility to big business and governments and take individual and community responsibility.

You also might need much more than 48 hours of childcare if you end up in the cells over the weekend. The earliest court appearance will be after lunch.

Do you think that is fair to your children?
Will it impact on your job/future jobs having a criminal record?

If you can accept the consequences and have arrangements to cover foreseeable eventualities (i.e. childcare) then it's entirely a matter of your own conscience.

Personally, I find ER, SR, Stop Oil, etc. to be very ineffective as campaign organisations. I know several individual members and they're just about the big protest and media attention with zero participation in grassroots environmental issues in the local community. The prominent local environmental campaigners are all ex-ER. They mostly left in 2019 after the London protest.

Depends what you do.
Glue yourself to JRM glasses, more power to your elbow, throw paint on lambo showrooms, shrug, hold up and disrupt people who have no influence over anything and you won't get spport.

Go to China. Protest against the new coal fired power stations they are building. I’ll chip in for your ticket.

To all the hostile/whatabouters on this thread, what do you plan to do instead?

OP, I think you're a hero.

Come on OP, as a scientist you should know that the poll you linked is not a majority, the article states they only polled 1382 people. When compared to the approx 67 million people in Great Britain, you can’t call that a majority.

Do you understand the implications of you having a criminal record on your child's future?

Do you think one arrest will be enough?

Those protesting against climate change will always be painted as criminals unfortunately. It’s a clever way of the government who hold the power distracting everyone from the real issue.
I remember it years ago with greenpeace going on to ships etc and protesters stopping roads being built etc it was very much painted as ‘they are criminals, criminal damage, stopping people getting where they need to be etc’
we need to wake up but by the time everyone does it’ll be too late

I believe there are simply too many people in the world and it’s too late to stop climate change now, we simply have to accept our fate. There will massive upheaval in the world and then hopefully the humans who do survive can start again.
What we really need is a massive pandemic to sweep the world and decimate the population. However that didn’t happen because the scientists worked hard to prevent it. You see we are all basically selfish and want what’s best for us and our families.