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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To find managing gen z a massive headache

624 replies

Managinggenzoclock · 03/11/2022 17:01

I’m a millennial and I manage a team of people. Some of them are gen z. It may be individual personalities but these are the things winding me up.. please excuse this rant. Is it just me? I manage people from late teens to early 60s. The younger group are by far the hardest work.

  • Very interested in career progression and pay (not a bad thing but see below)
  • at the same time not being willing to ever (I’m not talking often) work more hours or support a colleague
  • not willing to recognise that anyone knows more than them, even those with decades more experience
  • resisting hierarchical management structures
  • making lots of mistakes (including repeated over and over) but not have the humility of inexperience/ youth which would make this much less annoying
  • trying to patronisingly ‘educate’ people on contentious issues in inappropriate ways.

I think maybe I’m being too nice.

OP posts:
reigatecastle · 06/11/2022 12:14

If that same employee keeps asking the same stupid how question, it is a waste of everybody's time

I understand that - I would get annoyed if I kept getting asked the same question as well, but I don't object to people (of any age) asking me something they might have been able to work out for themselves eventually but I can answer it right away. A lot of bosses seem to think that it's a sign of weakness to ask a question.

Although - not work - but I did use to get annoyed with people who wrote in to our running club with questions that were answered on the website. But I think that is a bit different. I used to reply but with a link to the section of the website where the question was answered.

pixie5121 · 06/11/2022 12:32

This reply has been withdrawn

Withdrawn at poster's request.

Cuppasoupmonster · 06/11/2022 12:37

But we see cancel culture on here all the time. Anything remotely ‘goady’ (aka a topic that hits a few nerves) and it’s all ‘REPORTED’. Who do these people think they are, shutting down adults discussing something because they don’t like it?

Equally there are lots of ‘TW’ in thread titles, ‘it’s CHILDFREE not CHILDLESS’, etc etc

If they’re intolerant it’s because we taught them to be, that you can save yourself from every unpleasant emotion by demanding other people change their behaviour.

pixie5121 · 06/11/2022 12:50

This reply has been withdrawn

Withdrawn at poster's request.

Cuppasoupmonster · 06/11/2022 12:56

I’ve had loads of replies on here which have been quite personal. But then I do tend to be involved in more ‘controversial’ threads so I see it as all fair in love and war.

But so many posters take an abstract situation so personally. It’s all ‘thanks for making me feel like shit OP’ because the OP mentioned something completely nonspecific that hit a nerve.

In my view, the older generations on here are the worst for it. This thread would’ve been zapped long ago if it was about boomers or older generations. Equally, it’s absolutely unacceptable to discuss/critique older mums on here, but young mums are seen as a scourge who have wasted their lives, ‘Oh I would be so disappointed if my daughter became a mum at 25’ blah blah.

purplepricklypineapple · 06/11/2022 12:58

I am a Boomer. My Gen Z son sent his friend a clip of a famous Rap artist (X) who had been shot dead. 'Bad Day for X' read the caption.

I asked him how he found such graphic footage, and why he thought it was appropriate to send it to his friend.

He answered, that he'd seen worse, and he wanted his friend to see it before it got withdrawn from the Net. No thought about the family of the victim, no thought about the ethics of passing on graphic posts of murder victims. No empathy.

Gen Z are digital natives. They have never known a time when there was no social media. Someone mentioned echo chambers, and I think this is true. If you live a lot of your life on social media, you become shaped by its algorithms.

The humour - well it is multimodal. I often think 'what on earth are my son and his friends laughing at?' It is usually something distorted or just weird., and whilst there is the 'cancel culture' there is a huge wave of ultra-misogynistic, racist, awfulness in the under-belly of Gen Z culture. I suppose there has been in all generations, but via social media, it is quickly spread and amplified.

I love this bright, sensitive, energised generation, but there is also a certain darkness there as well. I suppose our parents said the same about us when we were young, but I just think there is a different edge to the darker side now.

PorridgewithQuark · 06/11/2022 13:12

Beezknees · 06/11/2022 12:13

My mum is gen X (age 53) I am a millennial (age 32) and my DS is gen z (14).

Sorry, I had the cut off for gen Z. wrong - I thought it was until early 2000s (with alpha being from 2003/4/ ish) not early 2010s.

Still it does require fairly small age gaps for a gen X to be grandparent (rather than parent) to gen Z and isn't generally the case that gen x get on with gen Z because grandparents get on with their grandchildren's generation better than their children!

withaspongeandarustyspanner sorry, I was trying to quote the poster saying Gen X prefered gen Z to Millennials because gen Z are the grandchildren generation of gen X.

withaspongeandarustyspanner · 06/11/2022 13:48

PorridgewithQuark · 06/11/2022 13:12

Sorry, I had the cut off for gen Z. wrong - I thought it was until early 2000s (with alpha being from 2003/4/ ish) not early 2010s.

Still it does require fairly small age gaps for a gen X to be grandparent (rather than parent) to gen Z and isn't generally the case that gen x get on with gen Z because grandparents get on with their grandchildren's generation better than their children!

withaspongeandarustyspanner sorry, I was trying to quote the poster saying Gen X prefered gen Z to Millennials because gen Z are the grandchildren generation of gen X.

Ah, OK 😊

ddl1 · 06/11/2022 14:10

People may not have used the word 'triggered' until recently, but there have always been taboo topics of conversation, both generally and with specific individuals: I would say that censorship was often greater in the past than now.

I am reminded of a poem by Ogden Nash from the 1930s:

Mr. Barcalow's Breakdown
Once there was a man, and he was named Mr. Barcalow, to be exact,
And he prided himself on his tact,
And he said, One thing about an apple, it may have a worm in it, and one thing about a chimney, it may have soot in it,
But one thing about my mouth, I never put my foot in it.
Now never was Mr. Barcalow's tact so exquisite
As when he went for a visit,
Because whenever he entered a community
He inquired of his host and hostess what topics he could discuss with impunity,
So no matter beside whom he was deposited,
Why, he could talk to them without disturbing any skeletons that should have been kept closeted,
But one dire day he went to visit some friends,
And he started asking tactful questions about untactful conversational trends,
And his host said that here was one place that Mr. Barcalow wouldn't need his tact,
Because taboos and skeletons were what everybody there lacked,
And his hostess said, That's right, but you'd better not mention bathrooms to Emily, who you will sit by at lunch,
Because her grandmother was scalded to death in the shower shortly after complaining that there was no kick in the punch,
And his host said, Oh yes, and steer away from education when you talk to the Senator,
Because somebody said his seventeen-year-old nephew would have to burn down the schoolhouse to get out of the third grade and his nephew overheard them and did burn down the schoolhouse, including the music teacher and the janitor,
And his hostess said, Oh yes, and if you talk about love and marriage to Mrs. Musker don't be surprised her eye sort of wanders,
Because her daughter is the one who had the divorce suit with thirty-seven co-responders,
And his host said, Oh yes, and you'd better know that the war is Florence's mania,
Because her cousin-in-law was the man who sank the Lusitania,
And Mr. Barcalow said, Well, can I talk about sports
And his hostess said, Well maybe you'd better not because Louise's sister, the queer one, was asked to resign from the club because she went out to play moonlight tennis in shorts, and Mr. Barcalow said That's not so terrible is it, everybody wears shorts and his hostess said, Yes, but she forgot the shorts,
So Mr. Barcalow said Well then, what about the weather,
And his host said Well, that's what we used to discuss when we got together,
But it has recently become a pleasure we must defer
Because Jane's Aunt Julia is here from California and she seems to think every remark about the weather is a personal affront to her,
So Mr. Barcalow said, The hell with you all, and went upstairs and packed,
And that was the last that was ever heard of Mr. Barcalow and his tact.

Xenia · 06/11/2022 14:18

I am an old poster and since about 1995 or 6 when I started posting things on line I have just about never once asked for anything to be removed as I believe in freedom of speech, even freedom to say horrible things about me as long as the law is not broken. I think my gen z and milliennial children are similar as that is our family values - freedom and being tough and stoic and liking to have debates and hear other views.

dd thanks for the quote which was nice to read.
I think avoiding talking about politics, religion and money - the 3 areas traditionally people in the UK were taught to avoid in polite conversation/dinners remains quite wise with work colleagues as people have very different views.

Blossomtoes · 06/11/2022 14:51

To be fair @Xenia, I’ve noticed that and I really respect you for it because you’ve really had some stick on here at various times. You strike me as being a pretty even tempered and grounded woman. We’re at completely different ends of the political spectrum but I can envision having a glass of wine with you and enjoying the experience.

Xenia · 06/11/2022 15:16

Blossom, that is what it should be like and indeed what the "liberal left" rather than "woke left" have always been - wanting freedom, different ideas, individual liberty etc.

wingsandstrings · 06/11/2022 15:22

hhhmmm, yes, I have found all those things to be true of the Gen Zs I manage. The most annoying one is complaining bitterly if they perceive they are being given too much work or work that doesn't exactly fit into their job description . . . . but then also complaining bitterly that they aren't progressing fast enough up the career ladder. But why would I promote them fast when I haven't seen them seek out any responsibility, or engage in anything outside of their narrow job description? They haven't shown interest or ambition or desire to learn about the sector. I gave a Gen Z in my team the other day an opportunity I would have bitten my manager's hand off when I was in her position of starting out - to attend a meeting of really senior and wise people talking about a challenging area of her work. She'd meet influential people and learn a lot, I thought she'd be delighted. It was in normal working hours. But she didn't want to because she felt she had 'enough on'. But then she approached me a few days later about how she could progress in the team . . . . I was baffled. On the other hand, I have found my Gen Z team members bring an emotional literacy to the team, and also an emphasis on inclusion and diversity that is very valuable. So, like every generation, strengths and weaknesses.

Bangolads · 06/11/2022 17:59

People in their twenties are knobs, especially their early twenties. I was and I’m sure most of you were. They can also be lovely too. However I do think this generation has higher expectations about their individual rights. This is a good thing and a bad thing. In business I have noticed they don’t respect the opinion of people who have decades more experience.

luxxlisbon · 06/11/2022 18:52

This is just the same short of shit people always say about the younger generations.
They are lazy, entitled, don’t respect their, listen to music older generations don’t get. It’s literally rehashed to the ‘youth of today’.
Spoiler alter it wasn’t true then, it’s not true now.

Tadpoll · 07/11/2022 06:22

WellWhoWouldHaveThought · 06/11/2022 10:02

The element that worries me most is the total intolerance to listening to views that are different from theirs. Cancelling people. The lack of debate, discussion and learning to see the other side

This is also the part I despair about. Being an adult is also about being able to have conversations and hearing other people’s opinions, not shutting someone down like a toddler having a tantrum and ‘cancelling’ them.

but gen z seem to think they’re entitled to feel permanently happy with everything and the moment something goes ‘wrong’ it’s a mega drama
Oh I agree with this. The amount of teenagers we get come in to hospital saying they’re not happy all the time. No one is happy all the time.

We have had a number of students who cannot handle any form of constructive feedback, if you tell them they’re doing something not quite right then immediately you’re bullying them. Oh and everyone is ‘stressed’.

I genuinely think this is a symptom of the world they have grown up in though.

As someone said up-thread, social media is a massive social experiment and we are perhaps starting to see the outcome.

ancientgran · 07/11/2022 11:41

luxxlisbon · 06/11/2022 18:52

This is just the same short of shit people always say about the younger generations.
They are lazy, entitled, don’t respect their, listen to music older generations don’t get. It’s literally rehashed to the ‘youth of today’.
Spoiler alter it wasn’t true then, it’s not true now.

So true.

Pertinentowl · 07/11/2022 16:55

Not sure. I watched my mum train up lots and lots of young uns and she’s not at all an easy going person. Things had to be right. We had to fish out all the carrots out of soup once because we cut them the wrong size. Scarily high standard. And generally, barring a few cases the investment really paid off. But we are in such a small country that even if the person left the company the training positively impacts the whole community and it gets passed on.

The older ones, if you will excuse me, have no idea that they have privilege either through race or gender or both. And if they managed to claw their way up they see no reason why others can’t pull themselves up by their bootstraps. There’s a lack of empathy there and a bit of enjoyment of peoples misery. Isn’t this going to be the first generation poorer than their parents since the Great Depression? Has there been such a worldwide change from Covid since World War Two and the Spanish flu?

I think a lot of those younger kids wouldn’t have been hired back in the day anyway, race and gender wise. So some of them come into the workplace a bit more scarred.

PsychologistAngelaKaranja · 09/11/2022 23:01

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AppleCottageBrownie · 12/05/2023 15:21

I hate managing them so much I'm looking for another job!

crazyaboutcats · 12/05/2023 15:37

My first Gen X assistant couldn't get to work before 10:30am and then could only be productive until early afternoon so I could only expect 4 hours of work minus lunch break but he was really easy to get along with and respectful.

My second is punctual and productive but constantly corrects me to the point our line manager had to step in. He thinks he knows more and better, and that he is my equal even though we work in a highly structured hierarchal field.

He also looks through me in a way that makes me feel very uncomfortable. It's like he's constantly trying to suss me out, what he can get from me, if or how he can get one over on me.

Bouledeneige · 18/05/2023 21:22

Just been discussing this with a friend who is facing the same issues in her team. Of course some of her gen z's are fab. But the worst examples:

  • expecting a pay rise and promotion within a month of starting - you haven't even paid back the cost of the advert yet!
  • unwilling to imagine that in any job and at any level you have things to learn
  • focus on their own feelings and no appreciation of their impact on other people
  • short on motivation and hard work and pitching in for the good of the team
  • unable to work under pressure.

One even threatened to quit because they were given a deadline - for an event that had to happen by a set date!

Not all people by any means but markably different to preceding generations. My friend and I gave a lot of years of management.

A580Hojas · 18/05/2023 21:39

I was at a meeting of all staff (11 in number) at my employers today. Age range 20 to early 60s with most employees being in their 30s. The youngest employee, who works part time and is part time in college, actually fell asleep. He put his arms on the desk and his head on his arms and fell asleep for a good 20 minutes/half an hour. I hope the boss has a word with him. None of the rest of us could have got away with that.

LaMaG · 18/05/2023 21:47

I bumped into a man who used to be my manager in a hotel in 1990s when I was a student. We were reminiscing about the team at the time and he was saying how difficult staff are these days. He said himself and colleagues have often said we were the best they ever had. I thought it was nice to hear at first but then a thought crept in that makes me so angry now - if we were so great why did you treat us like dirt??? Pay was shocking even for its time, they changed shifts, messed people around, openly gave out to anyone who made a mistake. They weren't bullies or anything just high standards and we worked our asses off. And my generation felt taken advantage of so probably raised our kids to not put up with that crap, but somehow overdid it and raised entitled brats. But we wouldn't have felt the need to empower the youth so much if those employers hadn't been such fxxxers. So now I don't feel a bit sorry for the hotel industry, they are reaping what they sowed 30 years earlier.

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