For taking DS out when he's supposed to be at school?

[penny4books]

First off, I want to say I'm in no way letting DS get away with his behaviour.

DS is 14, and in year 9. Last year, He was excluded for taking a knife into school, and is now attending a PRU. He later told me he'd get angry and voices would then tell him to do things, he's currently on the waiting list for CAHMS but it could take years and I don't have the money to go private unfortunately.

He came home from school yesterday and was in a bad mood so went to his room to calm down and so we know to leave him alone. DPs children were around yesterday and SS(13) went into his room to talk to him about a game, but because DS didn't want to speak to anyone and SS wouldn't leave him alone, he threw his book at him. SS came and told us and I went to talk to DS, he told me he didn't mean to, he got angry and couldn't help it etc, he did later apologise to SS. I did take his phone off him though.

Today, I've kept him off school as everyday he seems to have a bad day and it's causing problems with his behaviour as at home, he's mostly well behaved at weekends and during holidays so I suspect he's struggling to cope at the PRU, as he was at his old school. I do suspect he could be autistic but again, he needs a diagnosis which could take years so I can't send him to an SEN school. Today's plan is to take him out to town so I can talk to him, he doesn't have any devices so being at home won't be ‘fun’ for him but DP has said I'm BU by doing this so I should stay at home with him all day.

AIBU?

I feel really sorry for this kid because I've been a disruptive undiagnosed autistic teenager with incipient severe mental illness. His school life has been massively disrupted because he's had to move to a PRU, which may well bring with it all kinds of shame and resentment on top of whatever stresses are involved in day to day life at that school, coming right after the stress of struggling at the mainstream school. It sounds like his home life isn't much fun for him either and I wonder at what point that was disrupted by the blending of families. The only secure place he has is his bedroom, so of course he lashed out at a step-sibling who came in and wouldn't let him be. I'm not excusing it all, I just feel bad for him because I know how stressful it is in that kind of situation.

OP I would suggest you get back onto CAMHS, they should have a crisis team. Hearing voices is a sign that things are seriously awry. Take him to A&E if things escalate because that speeds a referral.

If you SS knows that your son is struggling why didn't he leave his room when asked to? I think all of you as a family need to talk about this and come up with strategies. I can envisage I will be victim blaming but it isn't, it's about keeping the whole family safe around a child who is lashing out. The priority has to be that AND getting your son the support he needs.

I managed to get an EHCP for my son before diagnosis, an incorrect school environment is often a catalyst for behaviours at home. A PRU is a challenging place for any child, especially if the child has anxiety / neurodiversity issues.

Ignore people saying about it being GCSE year and school being the priority. It isn't. If you are not safe and well you can't learn. His mental health must come first.

If going into town will allow you to focus on each other , then that is what you do. Ignore the naysayers. You have to meet your child's needs. You don't need to look for permission, especially on AIBU where parents mostly won't understand your situation.

It will get better. My son went through similar. Now his mental health is resolved he is the most caring, kind, non violent teenager. He had long periods of time out of school but is now back in education with his head in the right place.

Have to agree with lifeturnsonadime. Health first, education second. He needs proper help with his mental health.

Unfortunately this is extremely hard to access. If the PRU is part of the problem then he should be at home. Adults are signed off due to mental health all the time. While we tell kids to suck it up.

Pull him out and home Ed for a year if you can.

Whatever you do don’t deregister and EHE. Whilst I agree DS’s mental health has to be the priority deregistering and EHE is the wrong way to go. Parents often find it easier to get support when on the roll of a setting even if they can’t attend. Crudely they are someone’s ‘problem’. Whereas when EHE it is easier for professionals to sweep DC’s needs under the carpet. If you EHE the LA will say you are providing a suitable education thereby relieving them of their duties.

If OP’s DS can’t attend due to his SEN &/or MH the LA have a statutory duty to provide alternative education - that education doesn’t have to be what people see as a traditional education, it has to be whatever meets DS’s needs.

Remaining on the roll of a setting even if they can’t attend also provides evidence for an EHCP which can provide therapies and other provision to improve DS’s MH and better meet his needs. You can get an EHCP when EHE but many parents find it harder.

I expect the PRU is a very difficult environment for him, so I’m not surprised his behaviour is still an issue.

I will say now: I am a stepparent, so I’m not quick to jump on them, or blended families.

But I am 🧐 that your boyfriend’s teen was involved in the incident with no consequence, and your boyfriend is sticking his oar in on how you prefer to handle it.

Was his son told to leave your son alone? When you say he wouldn’t leave him alone - do you mean he persisted after your son told him to go?

Is your boyfriend actually a good person to bounce ideas off (just as you’re doing here) or does he like to enforce his way regardless of your ideas?

I wouldn't have been able to talk to him after school if he went as he isn't himself when he gets home and he likes to be on his own in his room. He even refuses to come down for dinner sometimes. I will get onto cahms again.

SS comes over every Tuesday and then eow, DS told me he asked SS to leave him alone but he continued talking to him, SS denies that he was asked but I do believe DS. DP isn't that supportive around DS and has said he thinks DS is just misbehaving for attention, although I don't think this. We argue a lot about DS.

There is just zero reason why you can't chat at home. If he needs background noise put the radio on.

Depends on if home is a cause of stress, which it clearly can be given what happened.

SS should not be allowed to go into DS's room without express permission. He should be knocking and waiting for an invitation to come in. DP can keep his opinions about DS to himself, at least until he has taught his own son about respecting people's boundaries!

When a teenager (or adult for that matter) is feeling angry / overwhelmed and struggling to control their temper, the first piece of advice is always to walk away from the situation and go somewhere safe. That option wasn't available for DS because SS was already encroaching on DS's safe space. While this doesn't excuse him throwing a book, it is worth thinking about what exactly you would have wanted DS to do in that situation. Should he have (for instance) shouted you for help, or come to find you? You need to give him a couple of good choices rather than just punishing him for bad choices.

Also agree with lifeturnsonadime - health has to come first. Something is (seriously) not working for your DS at the moment and YWNBU to try to have him in a good environment (whatever that means for you) whereby you can talk to one another. Do keep on at CAMHS.

Re. your SS - it sounds like a bit of a storm in a teacup, but also as if he doesn't fully understand how much your DS needed to be left alone. It doesn't have to be that big a deal, hopefully your DP can just handle it - in time your DS might apologise but for now his MH has to be the priority. best of luck with it

Your stepson sounds like at PITA. I’d be telling him not to speak to your son at all until things improve. This will hopefully reduce conflict and make life at home easier for your son. I’m not a violent person, but to be honest I’d feel like throwing a book at someone if I’d told them repeatedly to leave me alone and they wouldn’t.

Unfortunately, it’s not surprising that your son dislikes the PRU. Being sent to a PRU is meant to be a punishment and a last resort at that. But he needs to face the consequences of his actions, and keeping him off school when he’s not unwell is setting a bad precedent imo.

Obviously, it’s important to acknowledge his mental health issues and potential autism in this situation. It’s good you’re getting him help and I hope he receives it soon. However, it does sound like he’s using it as a bit of an excuse (i.e ‘the voices are telling me to do stuff’). I could be wrong though.

But he needs to face the consequences of his actions, and keeping him off school when he’s not unwell is setting a bad precedent imo.

He is unwell. Hearing voices is not what happens to a well person.

For your ds to end up in a PRU, the behaviour issues are clearly long standing. Sometimes people confuse 'voices' with thoughts and expressing what they are thinking out loud. Regardless, I would not be keeping him off school because he has had a bad day. I would be sending him into school. I might pick him up after school and take him for a coffee and a chat or I might set aside time for this at the weekend. I would also be thinking about a new house rule that ss does not go into his room in this way. If he has taken himself to his room, he should be left alone.

i don't understand why he isn't at school on a school day! Lack of proper boundaries and structure may well be a part of why your DS is so badly behaved

I don't understand why you play down mental health in children.

Perhaps if his needs were being met he'd be well enough to attend school.

Really not sure how some posters are slagging of the step son here

The OP has a child who took a KNIFE into school, attends a PRU, is violent at home (throwing the book) and yet it’s the other boys fault for wanting to chat to his step brother!?

Seriously what kind of messed up thinking comes up with it being DSS at fault here. You can be as annoying as you like but it’s never an excuse to lash out. And I’d bet money if these were biologically related children and DSS was a girl there would be uproar on here for the ‘assault at home’

OP- you don’t need a diagnosis for an ECHP why haven’t you explored this?

Fo be fair, your son is clearly VERY troubled and you seem very laid back about things, I’m also not sure why you’ve not looked into private help for him. If he is hearing voices and taking weapons into school you need to pull your finger out

If anything children with mental health issues need boundaries even more than those who aren’t struggling

so not sure why you have taken issue with what that poster has said

Because I have a child who has been through something similar to the OPs DS.

I did try to enforce boundaries with my child and the situation escalated and it resulted in suicide attempts.

The child is referred to CAMHS which is woefully underfunded. He is lashing out and says he is hearing voices. Sending him to what is most likely an unsuitable environment (a PRU is not a good place for vulnerable children), could harm him.

But we also don’t know whether his is a vulnerable child.

he took a knife to school

its equally likely he is a wannabe gangster who has made up the voices to get out of trouble

until the OP gets him assessed no one knows.

Perhaps believe the child and his mother.

You want to put him (and her family) at harm while she has to wait upward of 2 years for an assessment?

I know that its been mentioned but why is SS(13) being allowed to go into DS's room at all.

DS has removed himself to get out of the way/calm down/chill whatever and clearly doesn't want company.

So why was SS allowed to pester him. and even if he wasn't (rmemeber this is DS's call as to whether he was being pestered), he was still in DS's space.

This was only ever going to end one way.

This is what I was thinking. He got his phone taken off him. Why are so many still thinking he should have more consequences piled on. I would have a chat with him about not reacting violently, however I would definitely be holding DSS equally responsible. If he is told he is unwelcome in a space, he must respect that and leave. He is entitled not to be subject to violence, but DS is entitled to have a bit of space to relax and process things.

I don't see why you couldn't have a chat, or go for a coffee after school.

He should have gone to school. If you keep him off every time there’s an ‘incident’ you’ll be having incidents daily before you know it.

My ds is autistic.

The issues here are 2 fold.

1. The pru isn't meeting his needs so a meeting must be called - an autistic pupil won't manage in a class of pupils with differing needs because the noise etc will be too much. So many fail in semh placements because they are placed there.

1. Your da has been punished for doing what he's been taught to do "safe space" to calm down and his step brother not respecting this. That is a no no in my book. You've basically taught him that his safe space isn't safe and he has to accept that. Why? Your DO needs to understand this pdq along with your SS. His one way of managing his emotions has been evaded yet he was still them expected to manage his emotions. It's like amputating someone's leg and still expecting them to walk and punishing them for not being actually able to.

I think your DP should have disciplined his son for bugging your DS when he clearly wanted to be left alone.

Frankly this feels a bit like bullying at school - when others nag you little by little until you snap - and then you're the one in trouble for snapping (and no teacher ever sees, notice or bothers to stop the nagging before you do). I'd keep an eye out to see if this is a pattern with SS because if so it needs to be reigned in.

Not saying your DS behaved well, but as someone who was bullied in school, it annoys me so much to see bullies get away with this kind of behaviour.

So considering your DS was punished and SS wasn't, I see no reason to extend the punishment of DS and no reason why you shouldn't treat him.

Maybe I wouldn't have kept him off school but that was your decision, not DS asking, he's done nothing wrong in that regard.

So I would take him to the coffeeshop - not to "placate him" as others have suggested but to have a chat in a different environment and away from your DP and SS.

Really not sure how some posters are slagging of the step son here

Considering OP's son's background, I think he did well to ask his stepbrother to leave the room. It shows that he has awareness of how he was feeling and how it might escalate if not controlled.

It's not clear if SS knew not to talk to his stepbrother but if he did, then that's basically winding him up on purpose. He didn't deserve having a book thrown at him but OP's son said he asked his stepbrother to leave first. I know it's tempting to assume that the child without behaviour issues is telling the truth but what if OP's son is telling the truth this time ? OP's son deserves a punishment for physically lashing out but his stepbrother also deserves a punishment for not giving his brother space when he asked.

Clearly the adults have decided that OP's ss is telling the truth but based on what I know about sibling relationships, can she be 100% sure ?