The state pension is HOW MUCH???

[BeatieBourke]

Call me stupid (fair) but I've just realised how much the state pension is. £800 odd a month (£185.15pw).

As a non-means tested benefit. For EVERYONE.

I'm generally of the opinion that benefits are too low and too punitive. I usually advocate for universalism. I understand that people have worked their whole lives and paid in, and deserve a retirement. And that having pensioners in poverty does no favours to the economy or other welfare services.

But £800 a month / £9k a year for EVERYONE?? So a widower in rented accommodation with no other income or savings, £800pm. A wealthy 68 year old who's earned a 6 figure salary, has a huge property portfolio and investments coming out of their ears that pay a fortune out in dividends, £800pm. Seriously?

I understand that no party, least of all the Tories (because tory voters as a population are older) will ever go after pensions because it would be unpopular (and older people vote more generally). But in a time when the country is supposedly facing a financial "black hole" and everything else has already been cut to the bone for the last 12 years, why the hell are we paying out state benefits to millionaires?

Maybe if pensions were means tested (with a fairly high and tapering threshold) there'd be enough to pay pensions for women at 65, and more for people who haven't built up huge assets, can't afford to live, heat their homes or eat a hot meal every day in their later years. I can see the (cynical) political sense in it, but no economic sense whatsoever.

AIBU?

But they can go out to work.

We should be looking at reducing childcare costs right down to a minimal amount so everyone (that can) goes out to work rather than providing more benefits.

It relates to the disparity of income between young people and old people.

I Daniel Blake doesn't cover income disparity between working age and pensioners though?

It covers a young single mum struggling to earn money, and an older unemployed man in a similar boat. Both are working age, and both are struggling to earn money/access working age benefits.

👏🏼 👏🏼 👏🏼

You would think were a different species the way they go on about us pensioners.
“43 years working life, paying NI and tax, with a lot of those years paying tax at 40% you bet I’m enjoying my state pension” says my dh and I totally agree with him.
I worked with women who paid the “small stamp” instead of full “stamp”(contribution) I never did, I opted to pay full contributions right from starting work. Some women thought I was wasting my money paying it. Their husbands pension would see them ok, they could claim on his contributions or so they thought. I knew different, I’m older than dh by six years and worked it out that if I was to do the same I’d be 72 by that time. So paid in full. OK I had a bit less in my pay packet than others but it’s paid off now.

@TheNosehasit You seem to think that because there are many working age people living in poverty, we should strip back the small amount that pensioners get.

A genuinely progressive approach would be to say instead that working age benefits, wages, and the minimum wage should go up. There are ways of achieving that which don't involve stripping money from pensioners.

Stop racing to the bottom - in the long run it only makes life worse for ordinary people.

Why should I not get something I've paid decades of national insurance for?

It's not racing to the bottom. We're already at the bottom. Who do you want to give money to?

Give me your income and your assets and I'll tell you why.

You don’t necessarily chose to opt out if in a private scheme. I was a teacher and we were opted out automatically without any choice - in fact many teachers are not aware that they are opted out. So I get £143 a week with the full qualifying years and pay tax on it through my teachers pension.

On top of the £185 per week? With your house paid off?

Boohoo

Would that be the income and assets they’ve worked fucking hard for?

I would have stayed in if I could and have paid the very minimal extra NI. I lost far more from state pension than any NI saved. But I had zero choice.

No, it is definitely racing to the bottom.

Do you think working age people's conditions will improve if pensioners are made poorer? They won't.

Just like eroding public sector T&Cs doesn't do anything to improve private sector T&Cs. If anything, the private sector conditions get worse as competition for staff gets easier. As a whole, workers end up worse and worse off as more and more benefits get chipped away, never to be replaced....

There is always further down to go, and it appears you want to go there.

Apparently those of us who have worked for decades and paid NI, taxes and into a private pension should be happily not accepting state pension and also as from another thread not accepting state funded social care or NHS treatment so others can get it all for free! You know the old 'Greater Good' story....

They can include income and assets their partners earned, they can include perks of the job........

Fifties with two teenagers and a husband. Terraced house worth about £95000 plus an annual income of £34k. And some savings of £25k. A small private pension - mine will pay out about £6k a year my husbands about £3.5 k when we both reach 67.
As I said I am cashing in private pensions and spending them and spending all our savings if state pensions become means tested. The state can fully support us and I will claim any benefit possible.

You sound lovely. Knock yourself out.

I'm in my late 50s. I've paid tax and national insurance for nearly 40 years. My pension has been pushed back from when I would have expected to receive it when I started work to 67.

I've saved hard all my life to hopefully be reasonably comfortable in old age, making sacrifices along the way. And some of you think I should give up my pension for doing so? While my friend who has holidayed in 5 star hotels in Dubai, bought designer clothes and handbags and basically spent every penny she's earned should get get an old age pension and I won't?

You're having a laugh. You really are.

But you did benefit from paying lower NI if you were contracted out. I think the theory always was you would get the equivalent from the benefit to your private pension or probably more. Pension scandals probably means some don't but I don't know how you'd work it out. It would probably mean getting an actuary to compare all the figures. I think my SERPS S2P is about £40 a week, no idea how that would compare to what I'd get if I'd been in a private pension and paying lower NI.

No, this will not be on top of the £185, the state pension will be reduced to £143 because she was opted out , she will have the private pension she paid into but not the full state pension. I am the same because I have an NHS private pension. I have now realised why my state pension is less than the figures being quoted on this thread

You can already claim every benefit.

High earners pay not NI and get no more than people on a low income

Aren’t you forgetting something?

Employers also pay NI and at a higher rate.

No we can't. Our savings level is too high.