How to cope with chaotic parents as an adult

[Needathickskin]

Would be grateful for any insight or advice, please, from anyone who grew up in a similar environment.

Grew up in a chaotic home with parents who had a stormy, occasionally violent, relationship - albeit still together. Life all focused on father's small business which was not successful, made very little money, but was always the focus of everything, came first to the detriment of everything and everyone else.
Home dirty and uncared for but father always promising great riches (never happened).
Always blaming others/situation for things not turning out as they should.

Fast forward, my siblings and I have all moved on in life, all seeking a financially stable environment and making a very different life to that we have grown up with. We all acknowledge it was a difficult and unhappy childhood.
However, parents have not moved on; Dad still works for himself (mid 70s) and is increasingly making poor financial and lifestyle decisions. Nothing has changed.

This is causing great worry for my siblings and I - we have our own family responsibilities. There is also the issue that the decisions being taken are poor commercially and will have lasting negative impact. There is also the worry that we will have to pick up the pieces.

It also adds to the tremendous feeling of shame I have about my childhood. It wasn't good and the decision making is still just as cr@p.

We have tried to address this in writing calmly and logically to father but it has fallen on deaf ears.
They want to do what they want to do.

Speaking to each sibling, I realise that our childhood caused us each great sadness and trauma which we have carried through to our forties. It's really sad.
But I am also really angry to see my parents carry on regardless just as they did during our unhappy childhood, without any regard for our adult perspectives, let alone worries for them.
it's like watching a slow motion car crash, again and again. Such poor decision making.

I guess the logical answer is to stand back, accept that they are grown adults and won't change, and to focus on our own lives instead. However; it's the kind of family where there is the expectation to pitch in, 'help out' - but I'm really tired of enabling poor behaviour especially when I have my own children and husband to look after.

I work in a family business and struggle with it. Do you have financial or business ties to your parents?

Thankfully none of us have financial ties to the business now - however, the issue will be of commercial leases are taken out, what happens in future.

we have each individually given of our time and energy before and it has just been sucked into a black hole.

I've stood back from my chaotic parents OP. My heart goes out to you. There's not much you can do - they won't change.

I've just read your last paragraph OP. Boundaries need to be put in place to preserve your sanity. Enabling is no good for anyone.

Are they tech savvy op? Any grumbling send links to outside help /assistance...
Bite your tongue. Step back.

it's the kind of family where there is the expectation to pitch in, 'help out'

Does that only work one way? With you expected to bail out your parents after the business attempt fails? Your parents sound like they are acting like the children and expect you to parent them.
How much solidarity would there be between your siblings if you suggested sticking together and not bailing them out this time? It would be easier to do if you all stuck together. If not, do it for yourself and your own family.

@Thelnebriati all siblings have worked hard to not be financial burdens to our parents. There has been no assistance with eg getting a mortgage. We've all done that ourselves.

There has always been the expectation that we can and should help them out, mostly with unpaid labour. Which has been ok to a point, but we all have our own lives and responsibilities.

Yes I thought that would be the case. Remember the saying 'put your own oxygen mask on first' and don't think twice about establishing boundaries.

This is very insightful.

When you are brought up in chaos by immature parents you become over responsible to survive, end up parenting them at the expense of your own development whilst they still hold the 'authority' of being parents. The process of individuation doesn't happen. You end up stuck in these roles that have been forced on you and it can be lifelong.

My mother had two children by age 15, but still decided to have another one at 20. She never grew up (seems to be stuck as a little girl) but has continued a lifetime of bad choices, umpteen affairs causing us a childhood of chaos and neglect. I took on the role of fixer, tried to steer her away from bad decisions. Didn't make any difference. She cannot see anything wrong with her behaviour and is manipulative as hell.

Your dad seems to have a similar mindset. Child making adult decisions. You have tried to steer him right but he is going to continue down the path to possible disaster. There is nothing you can do about this but you can alter your mindset. You are not responsible for his choices, nor the mess he creates. He is an adult. Asked for pitching in, sod that! Where do you get to be your own person, who has the authority to decide?

I am NC with my mother and tbh am grateful I have dodged the bullet for her elder care. I didn't really have a childhood, I was a mini housewife, childminder and therapist by age 12. She doesn't get anymore of my life.

we have each individually given of our time and energy before and it has just been sucked into a black hole.

Ha, been there done that. It's so exhausting isn't it? Really really feel for you as so hard to step back when it's your own family, you have my utmost sympathy xx

@Dacquoise yes, all siblings are 'fixers' - good at solving practical problems and swallowing down feelings of unworthiness, shame and disappointment.

If your siblings are fixers, they literally receive a 'fix' by fixing things for your parents. Thats a hard thing to face up to and give up.

I feel its only fair to warn you that breaking out of the expected patterns of behaviour will cause massive disruption for the family, and you can end up being the black sheep/scapegoat without actually doing anything wrong.

And that is exactly why you need to separate from this. Absolutely empathise with the feelings of shame, it's taken ten years of therapy to put the shame where it belongs. Back on my parents and my mother in particular. Not saying you need to go NC (my mother is a scapegoater so departed for my own sanity) but perhaps some therapy to work through the crap you have experienced would be a better use of your energies. Your childhood has effectively been stolen. I feel angry for you.

I suspected when I read your OP that likely none of you had ever learned how to say No - and that's not a dig. My mother's family would be exactly the same as yours and the expectation was that family help family no matter what. Dad's side of the family were more stable in that regard, but uncommunicative so nothing learned there!

I'd never learned how to phrase the word 'no' until I was well into my twenties. Before that I'd always do whatever it was that mum needed or wanted (and some of those things were ludicrous!) at whatever the cost was to me.

As they get older it's gotten more and more worse, I'm afraid. Because now they are old so you need to do X or Y because they are too old or because they might drop dead soon. I, thankfully have stepped right back from that dynamic and learned how to decline doing a 'favour'.

@Thelnebriati I would say that I am the scapegoat in the family. I'm the eldest and have been the most vocally angry at their behaviour And I am utterly fed up at my anger being dismissed as me 'going funny' .

I am NC with my Mum and LC with my Dad.

The turning point for me was seeing how cr@p my parents were as grandparents. Despite living just an hour's drive away, even after the Covid enforced separation they had no interest in spending time with my children (their grandchildren). I invited my mum to stay for a few days but she spent most of the time in her room watching tv, no interest in doing bathtime or reading stories. I lost my temper, slapped her out of utter frustration (bad, I know) when she goaded me by saying 'what? Did you expect me to come here and do everything for you?'

I didn't ask for help (I never ask for help); I just wanted her to be a grandmother.

she was a bad mother and a really poor grandmother; was only ever interested in getting photos or videos, never actually spending time with my children.

I am glad to be away from the drama but I'm aware, via my siblings (who are all really struggling too) that the ongoing business situation is just ...ongoing and getting worse.

@Needathickskin , have you looked at the Stately Homes thread in Relationships? A lot of supportive, non judgemental survivors of dysfunctional families. There's obviously a lot to unpick with your situation. I think you really need to be taking care of yourself, not worrying about your dad. Fear, obligation and guilt are the triumvirate of feelings associated with toxic parents. Some validation might be helpful to you. 💐

Good catch, I think this is the latest thread; www.mumsnet.com/talk/relationships/4660201-november-2022-well-we-took-you-to-stately-homes

@Needathickskin I was also the scapegoat, and something that's really uncomfortable to deal with is if the scapegoat leaves, the family often crashes and goes through a bad patch. So if you do manage to put some boundaries in place, there will be dramatics. They'll probably try to hoover you back in, they may denounce you.
Its not your fault. They shouldn't need a scapegoat to prop them up.

Another thing worth looking at is the Karpman Drama Triangle - Victim, Persecutor, Rescuer. Once you get the hang of reading the situation you can work out how to manage it with the goal of getting off the merry go round.
Your parents play the Victim role, demand you help, and if you refuse you'll be assigned the role of Persecutor.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karpman_drama_triangle