To be worried about the lack of understanding around how many calories children need?

[MandalayFray]

I’ve seen a few posts over the last few weeks that have really concerned me around how adults, and parents at that, genuinely seem to have no idea how much food or how many calories the average child needs.

On the pizza thread the other day people were saying 2 slices of pizza and a few nuggets was more than enough for a teenage boy, that they couldn’t eat more than that as a grown woman.

Failing to understand that yes, because the average teenage boy need almost double the daily calories compared to an adult woman.

The average teen boy needs between 2,800-3,000 calories a day, moderately active ones 3,000-3,300 a day, very active ones 3,500-4,000. So no a 500 calorie dinner wouldn’t cut the mustard.

Same again today on a soup thread, apparently half a tin is MORE than enough for a child. The recommended calorie intake for a 4-5 year old is 1,400 calories! So no, a 200 calorie lunch is most definitely not ‘more’ than enough.

I know this site is known for ‘disordered’ eating posts at times but this is genuinely confusing me, do people not look into how many calories they should be feeding their kids as a baseline?

And yes before people start, I know they could be eating an entire pack of aunt Bessie’s pancakes for breakfast and a whole hog roast at tea, and yes I know your kids might be tube fed and need 5 calories a meal. But if we look at averages this doesn’t stack up with many posters views on here.

Those examples are ridiculous.

Nobody is going to serve a quarter of a small pizza to a teenager, or give a small child a half a tin of soup and then nothing else all day.

Children vary greatly in appetite. My children (aged 12 and 10) wouldn't have been able to eat the 2 slices of pizza, nuggets and chips. They both have such tiny appetites (no idea why as my DH and I eat like horses!). My children are both very slim but seem to have loads of energy and are healthy.

This is anecdotal but my 15.5 year old definitely needs 3000 calories and from what I have seen amongst his friends they all have the same eating habits. So admittedly they nearly all walk to and from school about 3 miles in total, play football at lunch and then go to the Park after school and play football again. Plus, in his close group of friends of 6 boys, they are all 5ft 9 minimum but my son is 5ft 11 and 2 friends are 6ft. In outer circle of friends I've met one shorter boy who was about 5ft4 and is heavier than all of them but not fat, stocky. My DS and friends are mainly beanpoles. I think the OP is right that it is a silly comment to question why a teen would need more than a 40 year old 5ft6 woman! In my opinion DS is living the lucky years of the pasta dinners and a big mac meal plus wrap on the side, chocolate and crisps but the metabolic rate of a gerbil! That's not something most 40 year olds get to live like!

YANBU.

I'm on a WW group and people post photos of what they eat, and even on a diet for some people it's so beige and carby with no veg at all.

With the example of pizza and chicken nuggets in the other thread, if you served it with celery sticks and cherry tomatoes you could easily get two portions of veg in and make it a more satisfying plate of food.

I have no idea how many calories my 13 yo consumes (which I don't think is at all unusual, I don't think most families calorie count, do they?).
I know he eats a lot, but that it's what he needs at the moment as he growing almost visibly.
Thankfully he is following footballers on Insta who are all about nourishing your body so he eats well (was not always the case).

40% of 11 yr olds in England are obese or overweight. I haven’t yet found figures for teens.

researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/SN03336/SN03336.pdf

Judging by the number of obese kids I see, I don't think lack of calories is something to worry about.

Honestly, I know kids are getting bigger but not those that I know. I've had three people tell me DS looks like a young Mick Jagger as he is wirey but muscular arms, his friends are 'all' the same . I know that all have homecooked meals but I also know they often get Sainsburys meal deal straight after school. I have had them all here often and they empty the cupboards so I have to have biscuits and crisps in as simply don't havve time or money if x6 to shop for high protein snacks when I'm working and not there. DS loves hummus but I don't buy 6 pots to ensure his friends are covered. We live in Brighton so people where I live do tend to walk everywhere I think this is a big factor. Once in the summer the boys had walked to the beach, swam and kayak and around the city, that day was 33000 steps but obviously its usually more like 10000.

About 15% of teenagers are overweight and about 5% have eating disorders. So the vast majority are of a normal weight. And yet on MN a lot of posters seem to think all children are teetering on the edge of obesity. I find the pathologising of normal teenage boy appetite quite worrying.

I agree with @MrsTerryPratchett that there is a massive issue with orthorexia on MN.

The vast majority of teenagers are not overweight or obese

The majority, but not a vast majority, and it soon might be the minority who are slim.

40% of children are overweight by Y6 at school - 2021 figures.

Figures from Diabetes UK. Obesity levels shot up during the pandemic.

www.diabetes.org.uk/about_us/news/new-figures-show-record-increase-childhood-obesity-pandemic

To lump calorie numbers on growing and developing teens I don't think is helpful. I've got 3 teen DS including twins and they all eat very different amounts and change the amounts they eat almost month to month. Using your eyes and seeing how slim/full of energy/reaching for snacks they are is key rather than a calorie number. One tends to get a bit heavier than the others which was a slightly tricky dynamic - he's not as sporty, though he does do sport, and he wanted to eat as much as the others. At age 16 he understands and moderates himself better now.

(Fwiw in our house half a tin of soup plus bread is standard for a lunch! Plus fruit, yoghurt etc.)

If you live in a non deprived area, you won’t see it. Just look at the data though.

Nailed it in one.

@Clymene ... actually 40% of children are overweight or obese..it's really quite a lot.
You assertion that vast majority are not overweight is inaccurate

Point out that parents are consistently feeding their children empty calories in the form of beige foods and you'll be shot down for not understanding that feeding your kids nutritious meals is expensive. Or "it's a treat once a week" (and wondering if feeding them crap is a treat then what on earth do they do to them as a punishment).
Giving your children good health is pretty much the most important job a parent has, and yet so few seem to give a shit about it.

Can I just offer a different perspective - half a tin of soup would be too much to give to my toddler precisely because it is so low in calories. It would fill her up and then she wouldn't eat anything else for lunch, and she needs more calories than that. So it's not always about bottom line calorie counts, as someone upthread said. Calorie density matters too.

Yep that might be the OP

but I am not referring to the OP, I’m referring to a comment made from another poster about half a tin alone being more than enough for a child and no wonder there is an obesity issue!

That poster mentioned teenagers specifically

not ‘children’

You know year 6 isn’t a teenager right?

around 15% of teens in the UK are overweight and obese

definitely not a majority

plus who said anything about bread and butter?

pretty much everyone! As that is what was being talked about. I don't think there was a single poster who expected the CHILD Not to have bread & butter with the soup.

A few posters said they didn't (allergies, low carb etc) but no one was suggesting the child didn't.

I think your post is you thinking you know more than anyone (everyone) else. It's not all about 'calorie numbers' it's about where they come from.

Of course it’s not all about the numbers

but when people are stating a meal with hardly any calories is ‘more’ than enough when it’s less than 1/7th of that persons recommended daily intake it’s a bit silly do you not think?

Unless they’re eating massive meals at the other points of the day (unlikely) then it’s not more than enough.

Without being offensive this is area dependent in the UK and there are maps that indicate quite a big divide on the difference. It is quite obvious that if you live in these regions of the country your reference will be based on 'all kids are overweight!' which is just not the case.

About 15% of teenagers are overweight and about 5% have eating disorders.

It's worth mentioning that anorexia is the most fatal MH issue. And yes, obesity is fatal, but very very slowly. Making food a battleground and focus isn't a good idea.

The message isn't about calories or weight, it's about health. Now DD (11) often cooks for herself there is ALWAYS a vegetable. Off her own bat. I used to joke about scurvy and rickets rather than weight.

I hardly ever see overweight teenagers where I live if anything with my DD who is only 11 it seems a vast majority of girls are very thin.