To be annoyed with my friend

[Toddlerproblems]

My friend and I both have 2 year olds. We see each other fairly regularly. We live in a very small village and they will go to nursery and school (small, single form classes of about 8 - 10 kids) together. There are few children of the same age living close by. They will both soon start nursery together.

Last week, her DS hit mine hard enough to leave a decent lump on his head with a heavy and solid toy. It was on purpose and for attention.

This is not a one off. Her DS is often aggressive in his behaviour towards my DS. I know they're toddlers and some challenging behaviour is normal, but his behaviour is becoming more frequent and more severe. I don't feel like I can keep my child safe around hers.

The only reason I haven't ended this friendship is because we will see each other at the school gates the whole time our kids are at school and they will be in the same class right up to secondary school, so I need to make it amicable going forward.

*also posted in behaviour, but posted here for traffic.

What does she say when her child hits yours?

And what has she said when you've brought up how you feel about it?

Suggest some adult meet us only. Just say your ds is struggling to be sociable lately. No blame op.. Not a jot.. Even if you want to brandish her ds Damien.

Hi, maybe this child could have some kind of additional needs if displaying challenging behaviour?
what does friend do when her child hurts yours?
I think if your friend seems upset by his behaviour and has been a nice friend to you may be good to cut her some slack as she could be struggling with her child’s current behaviours and to end a friendship because of this could make her feel very isolated

huh? I don’t understand why you are annoyed at your friend? She’s not the one who hit your toddler! Sounds like you don’t understand much about 2 year olds- they are often highly vicious / savage. Don’t be surprised if it’s your tot next who’s biting/ pushing/ biting/ causing you endless embarrassment.

It really depends on how she handles the situation, without knowing that we can't say you are reasonable to be annoyed with her.

If she can’t watch her child (who she knows to frequently lash out) and ensure he doesn’t hurt your child then maybe just meet as adults alone, or do things like go for walks so the kids aren’t playing independently together. Her child will probably grow out of it but he can’t just bash your son around until he does.

@Tandora
No... children aren't savages at the age of 2.

OP. If you don't want your child to be repeatedly assaulted by this other child then you need to end the play dates or say something to the other parent.
I did this. My child was bitten ( broke the skin) by a toddler. This was after several meet-ups with a friend. My child kept been my hit, slapped , bitten, kicked and pushed.
His mum kept apologising and kept making excuses.
I ended the friendship and , though sad, I felt that I couldn't subject my child to any more violence.

Glad I did.

And before anyone says that the other child might have difficulties, no he didn't. He grew up to be a surly adult and I have occasional contact with his mum.

@Dacadactyl her DS is either asked to please don't do that or taken to a separate room for one to one attention (breast fed). When I bring it up she just says sorry and she doesn't know why he does it.

@Pumpkinpatchlookinggood unfortunately, she rarely goes anywhere in an evening (there's not even a proper pub where we live). We met at NCT classes, so weren't friends before kids.

@mummabear1010 I've been cutting the slack for a while (literally months) because of the possibility of additional needs as I'm very aware of how isolated she could become, but it's having an impact on my son and the way he interacts with others etc.

@tandora The behaviour is persistent and not dealt with. The behaviour has become more severe over time as it's not really dealt with. Do you really think it's acceptable for a child to lash out violently and deliberately without any warning signs at all?! Not even a glance before hand?

YANBU

your job is to protect your child so don’t get caught up worrying about her views on the matter.

I’d say you’re not willing to meet with the kids going forwards as hers is a danger to yours

My friend's DD used to wallop my DD at playgroup all the time. My friend was too busy chatting to do anything about it. I told my DD to hit her back. That did the trick after a few instances, but I appreciate not everyone would like the idea.

I've had to cut back on play dates with a couple of families for similar reasons. You could suggest things like toddler groups / classes maybe where they don't have to play together the whole time. Also just make them less frequent for a bit. He may just grow out of it. One of the families I mention having to cut back on play dates with had a toddler who was really aggressive and bit my dd leaving a massive bruise which lasted a week. Now they're 7, he is still mischievous but he would never hit or bite my dd. I'm glad I never ended any friendships over it. That is OTT

It’s a tough one
i asked about additional needs as my son has some difficulties and as a young child he would often get over excited and could hit or grab hold of other children and I know from
experience being judged can really make you feel rubbish when already trying to handle a difficult situation.
I would say if mum is keeping a very close eye on him around others and trying her best I’d try give her some support, I understand you not wanting things to affect your child, have you had a chat with her? I know it’s awkward. Has she sought advice from a health visitor about his behaviours?

No... children aren't savages at the age of 2

sorry what? 😂 the bite marks on my toddlers arm say different I’m afraid. I don’t know a single tot who hasn’t been capable of bashing another over the head with a toy.

@HenryHenrietta we met at NCT style classes. Our friendship is literally based on having kids the same age and living in the same place. There are next to no organised groups locally that we could attend and she doesn't drive. In the past, we lift shared. My DS used to cry getting in the car after he was walloped at the session we attended together.

I strony suspect if I scaled back the playmates, it'd naturally kill the friendship off, rather than me actively ending it.

@dacadactyl In some ways, it's a similar kind of scenario in that this happens the moment her DS is not the centre of attention and she has a conversation or turns the kettle on or whatever.

@onomatopoeiaflea thank you. This is how i feel about it, but was worried I was being a bit too precious

Of course it’s not “acceptable” , but it’s not remotely unusual behaviour for a two year old, and yes they do it sometimes entirely without warning. And two is too young to really get through to them with “consequences” etc. More than likely he’ll grow out of it very soon. I still don’t understand why you are annoyed with your friend. If you don’t want to do play dates anymore then fair enough, but don’t be angry with your friend, it’s not her fault!

@Tandora a 2 yo is old enough to understand the word 'no' or the phrase 'gentle hands' or whatever. And yes, I understand kids bash each other with stuff occasionally. This is absolutely every time we see the child.

@Mummabear1010 I'm sorry you were made to feel that way. It's a difficult. I've worked with older kids for years and have seen how horrid parents can be to one another. I'm keen not to isolate this family, particularly given how few kids live here.

My friend's DS rules the roost and seeks attention, but there are other signs of challenging behaviour. She is openly ignoring issues and trying to minimise them, I guess. It's a difficult balancing act between supporting my friend and protecting my son.

My friend's DD used to wallop my DD at playgroup all the time. My friend was too busy chatting to do anything about it. I told my DD to hit her back. That did the trick after a few instances, but I appreciate not everyone would like the idea

and 1 day your daughter will hit back the wrong person and it will end up worse for her. Bravado is a dangerous thing in these situations, the old dogma of ''stand up to a bully'' is often dangerous advise and legally it puts one in a vulnerable situation.

It leads to people ending up in body bags. I say that as a teacher of self defense-the safest advice is to walk away and only fight back if your life is in genuine danger. As a parent you should have dealt with it,not fueled the fire.

I don’t think 2 is old enough to understand no or gentle hands or any of that stuff but his mother should be within swooping distance if he is a known assailant. The problem is the mother not reacting, the toddler is doing what toddlers do when they get a slight impulse. Toddlers just are not known for their premeditation or impulse control.

That is the biggest leap I have seen in a while on MN 🤣🤣

And two is too young to really get through to them with “consequences

I don't agree with this at all, when my niece was 2 she'd bite people. My mum would pick her up and put her standing in the naughty step putside the door every time she did it. Niece would know at 2 she was being punished and would howl crying. Mum would let her back in after niece calmed down and she was warned 'no biting', niece soon stopped as she knew there would be consequences.

OP yanbu, keep your child away from hers and your friend is unreasonable not to discipline him.

10000% agree with this. I've worked in inner city PRUs and seen how badly this turns out - and trust me, it never leaves you once youve seen it. I want to avoid getting to the point where violence is reciprocated in any way.

2 yo is old enough to understand the word 'no' or the phrase 'gentle hands' or whatever

they might understand the words, but it doesn’t necessarily have any affect on their behaviour. Most two year olds don’t have the emotional maturity to really understand. perhaps the child has additional needs, perhaps your friend is a terrible mum , more than likely it’s just a phase and he will grow out of it pretty soon.

Sounds like you and your friend should avoid each other- you are worried about your toddler, and I’m sure she could do without the mum-judgement.

We’ve gone from a two year old hitting another tot with a toy to people ending up in body bags 🤦🏼‍♀️

This is not good parenting.

@therubbiliser this is my frustration. Mom doesn't swoop or deal with it at all. Though my son at the same age definitely understands 'no' and being removed from the situation for 2 mins of time out. It's solved many other issues in our house.