To grow up in poverty and be petrified of TTC#1 in fear of history repeating?

[JadeLyndsey]

Just wondering if anyone has any insight or advice really. I am actually loaded with cold/flu and off work today so I'm sat with a hot water bottle watching rubbish on TV, and proceeded to have lots of thoughts that I usually do whenever I watch a panorama or cost of living crisis type documentary.

I don't know if it's since the current cost of living crisis or if this is something that's coming to light following the death of my (only) parent and now taking on sole care of a disabled sibling, but I'm pretty petrified of starting my own family. Whenever I think about it, I am anxious and worried about doing a bad job or giving them a horrible life compared to previously feeling excited. Someone at work recently announced she is pregnant and honestly it made me sweat and feel a bit nauseous, and my cousin who bought a house at the same time we did is in the process of trying to sell because they can no longer afford it and might need to move to rented and I can see how devastated she and other people I know are at not being able to afford a mortgage on a home they've worked so hard for.

For context, I'm 28, married to DH 32, we've been together 11 years. Home with a (very small [less than 50k] mortgage and great equity, own a car, 2 incomes slightly higher than average. I was the first in my family to get a degree and buy a property.

However, for background, I will always remember my home as a child had pieces of carpets that mismatched in pattern because we couldn't afford new, broken mirrors hung up because they served a practical purpose but again could never afford to replace... Our home was always unclean with lots of animals and my mother smoked profusely, gambled and did drink too. We had a strained relationship where I took on care tasks for both her and my sibling because my mum had significant physical and mental health conditions. She was in psychiatric hospital and care a lot when I was a baby. In later years, she threatened suicide regularly and I found it difficult to manage, but we also relied on food banks, second hand furniture and clothing, and I always remember feeling poor. I remember being chastised as a kid for telling a teacher in school about our circumstances (who arranged a food hamper and referred us to social services) by my mother, and from that point on I never shared our circumstances with anyone else. Childhood was rough for me. I've had counselling for it and feel satisfied that these life events are dealt with.

Since then, I've lived a lovely life with DH (who is also from a poor background but this is because he was one of 7 with two hard working parents who just struggled to make ends meet). We've been on holidays neither of us could have imagined as kids, everything we own and have and do is from our own makings, and I'm so proud of all we've achieved. But I can't shake this feeling that if I were to have a child, they're bound for a nightmare and a childhood of pain and barriers (especially in the current cost of living crisis) and it's really eating away at me.

Our plan has always been to sell our current home and upsize to somewhere out of the city to something more akin to a family home. We hope to do this next year, and the plan was always to TTC then, but I can't help but feel like it's all going to come crashing down.

Any advice? After writing all of this I'm thinking I perhaps may need counselling again haha. DH thinks once we're in our forever home and cost of living crisis begins to wain, I'll start to feel excited again but at the moment I just don't see how... Cost of childcare, a new fixed term mortgage deal could come to an end and potentially double overnight, we'll have to adjust our working hours/reduce to one income to support with caring for a child since we don't have family nearby - I sometimes think I will never escape poverty no matter how hard I've tried and is it fair to bestow this on a child?

Are you sure you really want children?
It's not a requirement in life.

Are the conditions your mother and brother have hereditary?

How would you feel if a DC had similar health conditions?

Thanks for your reply!

Mother died from a rare form of liver cancer, none hereditary. Had BPD, anxiety and depression. I have anxiety but this is otherwise well managed and I function well daily and unmedicated. I am awaiting ADHD assessment.

My sibling has severe autism, GDD, PCOS, gender dysphoria, hypermobility, depression and anxiety. Is on medication for all of the above.

I mean I've been a carer my whole life. I worked formally as a carer to support my studied when at uni, I'm the person that completes PIP forms for people that need them in my family, I now work in health too. So I'm confident I could care for a child with any type of needs. Re. If I want kids, I've always seen a future with children in it. I think I could be a good parent and I would put my absolute everything into being a parent. I guess I just worry they'll grow to hate their life and need therapy for their upbringing in future like I did!

I think this anxiety is quite common amongst people who grew up poor. I grew up with a single parent, we lived on a council estate in a rough area and we didn’t have much money. I’ve gone on to do a degree, worked hard, saved money, bought a house etc. My mortgage is nearly paid off, my job and my husband’s job is reasonably safe, but I always have this fear at the back of my mind that I’ll end up back where I was as a child and the recent cost of living crisis has definitely heightened that anxiety. I have 2 teenagers and I’m feeling quite depressed about their future at the moment. I don’t have any good advice to offer OP, but I know exactly where you are coming from.

I’m sorry you had a rough childhood. You sound amazing and like you have really turned your life around. We’ll done on going to therapy and facing things.
from what you say I think you’d make a great parent if that what you decide you want. You don’t have to rush the decision, and when the time is right, you will know.
you’ve come so far by the sound of it. Enjoy yourself for now and don’t overthink it.

I think you'd be a lovely parent too.

I agree with @Doublevodka its common in people who grew up poor. My family was dirt poor growing up, we struggled for absolute basics. I have two professional qualifications, run a successful business, have a small mortgage and significant equity and still think it could disappear in a heartbeat. It’s horrible because it stops you taking risks in your professional life, influences relationships and future plans.

I keep reminding myself I started out with nothing and built a life for myself, worst comes to worst I can do it again.

This will perhaps explain why friends I've spoken to, who didn't grow up poor, have no understanding of the fear I have and view it as irrational. I don't think you can understand unless you've lived it. I think for my friends, their version of reducing their incomes to have kids means they still have a beautiful home but make more packed lunches and do picnics and just do cheaper days out. For me, I see a different kind of poor and I'd have to be dragged back there kicking and screaming. DH and I have done sums and it just seems so bleak, but I do have to remember I am more emotionally available, responsive, responsible and probably more resilient than my own mother could be due to her health (and as a starting point, we actually have carpets throughout and a nice home!) So I know that realistically it would be a very different childhood for my own kids, but I can't help but panic.

How did you navigate those feelings prior to TTC and did they continue to plague you after your children arrived? Once they're out, you can't exactly put them back in again so I guess I'm hoping to resolve these feelings to a degree before we start TTC - though maybe I'll never get there?

The thing is, lots of people grow up poor. You grew up poor and neglected. Growing up poor isn't the worst thing in the world if your parents love you and look after you and prioritise your well-being above smoking and gambling and drinking. A cold house for example isn't ideal, but you can maybe put a warm dressing gown on and snuggle with your mummy in bed. but a cold, dirty house with animal shit all over the place where you have to try and find some breakfast for yourself because your parents are lying in bed hungover until 2pm is another thing entirely. You're not going to be that kind of mum - you're already worrying about being a good parent and you haven't even started TTC yet! You don't have to have children if you don't want to, but your past doesn't have to repeat itself if you do, even if you do find yourself without much money.

It sounds like you are financially in a good position to have a baby (unless there are large debts that you haven't mentioned).

I'd love to try for a second child, but like you, I'm worried that we won't be able to afford it. We have a larger mortgage as we only bought 4 years ago. Looking at what our financial situation might be in the next few years is very concerning. It would have been possible for us, but potential double mortgage payments have really put a spanner in the works. We both work. Household income around 57k.

I would start a spreadsheet and account for all your predicted outgoings. Check what your disposable income would be during maternity leave, during the first years of childcare costs with only 20% tax free childcare discount and then at 3+years when the funded hours start as well. Contact childcare providers if necessary to get an idea of cost.

You might have to save a little now to help cover those childcare costs at the beginning, but past 3 years it really is much more affordable.

So shit that working households have to worry about covering such a basic standard of living. But knowledge is power, so maybe if you look closer at the potential costs you might feel less anxious about it.

I think you are worrying unnecessarily to be honest. You are in a good stable position and sound like you have your head screwed on
I think you are still not fully over your childhood but you are not your mother and never were by the sound of it. You have always prioritised others needs and taken responsibility unlike your mother who failed you for various complex reasons ( some or all maybe beyond her control ).
I think you will make a great mum and as for the financial stuff well we are in uncertain times but you sound level headed enough to ride it out . Good luck

The thing is, you never have certainty in life. You can't predict the future. Without wanting to sound bleak, anyone can get ill and anyone can die at any time. You can try to mitigate these things, save, get insurance, have plans in place. But you never have guarantees, none of us do, and we all have to live with that on some level.

I think you sound in a better place than most to have a child. You have financial stability, with options if things get tighter. There are two parents involved. You both have careers. Unless you win the lottery, it probably won't get much better than that in terms of readiness.

You do sound scarred by your upbringing, it sounds chaotic and like there was never any security or stability. But that's not where you are now. Maybe you really could do with a bit more counselling?

@Yemelade @JadeLyndsey I think you have had a name change fail. Just letting you know because it is not obvious that your updates are from you.

I’m a lot older than you, about 25 years. I also grew up in real poverty with not enough to eat and a mentally ill Mother and violent alcoholic stepfather so it was also very chaotic and that is being polite about it all. When my stepfather died I ended caring for my Mother and younger sister, I was only 13.

Many people think they were hard done by as children but I totally get you, you and I have been at the extreme end of childhood adversity. To be honest the fear has never totally left me. It’s suppressed but for instance when lockdown was announced and there were supply issues I remember having to shut myself away and cried so much becuse I was so frightened of not being able to feed my DS and it bought it all flooding back.

Please do have counselling, I have had it now and really regret not doing it when I was around your age but it wasn’t really even talked about back then.

It may take you a while to click with a therapist, pay to see someone, it’s around £50 a session if you try on the NHS the waiting list is huge and they may offer you just six sessions, it is not enough. I have had a few therapists and my current one is the one who I have clicked with give yourself at least a year of therapy. Review your finances and in a year the markets will hopefully have also stabilised.

Childhood shapes us, it has made me very resourceful and amazing with finances. I ended up in a decent career and married a lovely man getting close to 26 years ago. I would say if you let your childhood dominate you then it will rob you of your adult life. Have the therapy, understand that it will always be there but don’t let it define you.

I really wish you the very best.

Morning all,

Thank you for your messages. And yes, name change error lol, OP and this name are one in the same - got scared family who are also parents might see this in my actual name but I doubt they even use this site so not too fussed now in hindsight!

I think I will look back into counselling. Last time I accessed it was directly after my mother passed away, but we ended up focusing on childhood trauma and I eventually ended up feeling guilty for talking about me and my earlier experiences of my mother rather than the relationship that had improved (and I'd then lost as a result of bereavement) as an adult. I see now I have nothing to feel guilty about though, I feel somewhat shameful about my childhood (hence name change and fear people will "find out" what my life was) but actually I have no bearing on how I was raised.

I also have a huge sense of doom sometimes thinking my life is going to end prematurely like my parents, or that even if we move to a nice house something will inevitably go wrong which I know isn't healthy so I definitely do think I need to explore this with a counsellor.

Thanks again for your responses. I actually also lost my grandmother yesterday which came as a shock, she was the only other person close to me that has offered any sort of maternal support other than my MIL, so that's been difficult. I'll explore counselling beyond the grief I and my sibling will need to navigate over the next few weeks!

@ Yemelade
So sorry for the loss of your grandmother. It is v hard to lose those who have in some way been a surrogate mum to us so expect it to destabilise you for a while.
And the description of impending doom resonated so strongly and is something I really struggle with. I have lived in my home for 20 yrs and love it but I constantly think.it is going to be taken away through circumstances beyond my control. My childhood has left me unable to relax and be happy because ny experience is that it wont last. I recommend therapy as I have finally begun to challenge these thought processes somewhat though I have a long way to go.
Anyway I send severe condolences on the loss of your Grandmother and best wishes for the future x

You are not your mother. She clearly had many issues and problems that led to your upbringing being very poor.

You are starting from a very solid position and are doing the right thing by thinking about it.

So long as you can feed, clothe and love your child you're winning.

Ignore all these surveys that tell you it costs X amounts of £s to bring up a child, if anyone considered that it would never happen!

I think this is just a wobble.

Well done on your achievements too - you should be very proud of yourselves.

It's so comforting to know that I'm not alone in this. That doom feeling and ability to unwind has been there for me for the longest time too. No matter what I achieve, or like when I got a promotion at work recently, straight away I think "this will all come crashing down"

We all have unique experiences of course but this isn't really something that I see all that much in others so I'm glad I posted here. Even with my husband sometimes I'll come out with something that I think he may relate to, but actually he looks at me like I've got 3 heads and then hugs me to say he's sorry my childhood was like that. It is a bit worrying though that sometimes I don't always see that some experiences are not the norm for everyone, like when we first got a flat together and started running low on milk and washing up liquid and shampoo but didn't get paid for another few days, and he was like "did you buy more stuff?" And I had actually just watered everything down. He was pretty disgusted and was like "why did you do that? That's so weird, we get paid soon" But to me that was just a normal thing to do. And then I began being obsessed with saving money, and then feeling guilty for buying anything that was more expensive than Asda. There's been a lot to unlearn over the years! Even things like nutrition. But getting there!

it is exhausting living with the impending doom thing in my experience. I tend to jump to the worst case scenario in every situation and I regret wasting so many years struggling to be positive.
For example I love christmas but every year when I put my tree up in the home I love I think to myself this will be the last christmas in this house. By this time next year it will all be taken away!
I have had nearly 20 years here but I still keep scanning right move in case I need to start again somewhere else. I always try to have a back up plan for every situation and eventuality just in case. it really is exhausting !
Sorry to indulge my neuroses on your thread but it helps to get it out and ,as you say , realise you are not alone.

I grew up in a big nice house but because my parents overstretched themselves massively we were always skint. The pipes burst one winter because they refused to put the heating on, and I remember being cold a lot. I also remember going food shopping and the embarrassment of cards bouncing. It's not in the same ballpark of what you went through OP but it's made me very anxious about money. I am borderline obsessive about budgeting and panic regularly about the future despite not ever being as reckless as they were. But what I can tell you is that where children are concerned you don't need to worry- mine always come first, and I've gone without many a time to make sure they have everything they need. You aren't your mother, so history won't repeat itself.

You mention that you are sole carer for your carer.
Is your sister living with you or is she living in a specialist environment or does she live independently with you keeping an eye out for her?
Is her living situation sorted just for now or is it sorted for life?
Being a sole carer is a large responsibility for anyone & can be a source of great anxiety.

I grew up in a chaotic house with no money, a mother who abused me and who couldn't cope with the number of children she had. She damaged me every way possible to the point where I decided thst there was no way I was having children because I didn't want to end up,like her and didn't want to endure any form of,poverty again as long as I lived and we all know children cost money....I was wasnt prepared to spend money I earned on another person.

I have kept that view throughout my life and I'm now pretty stable financially but resent being the one who has to support my father and ,y brother financially because I'm the only one who can.

You're young, you are not at an age where time is running out. If you really want children - and despite what some people might tell you, it's not fair to bring them into the world without financial security as we know - you can easily wait a few years and then try.

It's also ok to decide that you don't want them because of what it would do to your current lifestyle.

Hi,
Thanks for your reply. This is a bit of a complicated one to reply to. Yes, it is stressful being their carer even though they should, on paper, feel and be well supported.

They were previously living with my parent and were cared for by them. I've now supported them to move into supported accommodation. They live in their own apartment with X3 support staff on site at all times and 20 hours minimum support every week for Outings/shopping/help in their home to keep it clean. We did this because I have my own life with my husband, and I wanted to make sure they had a long term plan in place to live well and independently. They've been there just under a year now, though there continues to be teething problems. One of which is they won't engage with the support so are living in really disgusting conditions. Like McDonald's bags piled to the ceiling, no floor space due to plates and food items strewn around, dirty underwear (including sanitary wear) left all over - I mention these because I'm not anal about cleanliness and this isn't a case of my sibling not meeting my exacting standards, but to illustrate how truly horrible these conditions are. I spent the first few months when they moved going there every weekend to encourage and persuade them to work with the support workers, and remind my sibling that I too have my own life and can't spend every weekend on them for my own health and wellbeing/is an unsustainable routine. This still hasn't improved, despite me calling meetings with the support manager and emphasizing the importance of keeping a clean and tidy home (they also struggle with their mental health - but no wonder when they refuse to shower or do any housework, I'd be depressed in a home and body that stinks too!). The support manager has also outlined that as they are regulated by CQC, if a surprise inspection ever took place from regulators, they may say the money my sibling pays for support is not being used appropriately to support them which means my sibling will be moved to alternative accommodation which may be in shared facilities. In response to this, they said "I can just live with my sister" and I had to quite harshly say that this would never be an option.

They also have a lot of issues with money, as my sibling used to be given an allowance from my parent whereas because I'm not closeby and living with them (and they need their independence) they have access to their own bank card in order to go food shopping etc with support workers, which has resulted in hundreds spent on online games and takeaways. They won't get a passport because these are gendered (sibling has gender dysphoria hence they/them pronouns, and this is alongside their health conditions) and they have no other forms of ID in order for us to be able to open a separate bank account. They won't receive support from their support team for finances as they were previously financially exploited, but also is extremely impulsive and will then try calling me at 3am when I have work the next day to say they've had a notification from their bank that they have bills due out but they've already spent all their money. We've tried so many different things, calling everyday to check they aren't overspending, I've suggested I confiscate the card and give them cash to use (they won't do this as only eat Tesco ready meals and there isn't a Tesco closeby so need to order these online), there are just no resolutions.

Our local authority no longer offer ongoing support from a named social worker either, so I've rang the duty social worker in excess of a dozen times in the last 6 months to ask for help. I've also asked if they can take over as financial appointee, though their response so far is that "you are a competent, able and appropriate adult who can continue to provide financial assistance to your sibling" but what they aren't getting is that I can't and it's really impacting on my stress. They can offer me no advice or support, though did tell me if I told them I had financially exploited my sibling they would be able to initiate financial appointeeship via council quicker. It's been about 2 months since I told them I cannot provide any further support and I called again 2 weeks ago for an update - they hope to see us in January. In the meantime, I've looked into gohenry, mi-spend, hyperjar as these all seemed like a means in which to set up a bank card or account without needing ID, however we've not been able to progress with any of these due to issues with creating accounts.

It's a huge thing that causes me stress most days!

@MenopauseSucks that last post was supposed to be in reply to you, apologies! Still getting the hang of this!

Gosh, the planning for every eventuality is also very relatable!! The whole time I was at uni, I spent hours every week job hunting and updating my CV in case I failed and needed to find a job quickly in order to pay the rent etc - growing up poor means you have no fall backs. I remember peers having cars, driving lessons and their rent paid for by parents. One friend took a year out of studies and her parents paid for everything in that year out, which is great because she was probably too unwell to be studying really and lovely that she had parents able and wanting to help, but as a person without any financial support or freedom it means my options were always limited and the only person I could ever rely on was myself! I'm possibly overly independent these days and don't accept any help from anyone, so whilst it's been a survival response up until now, it's not always the healthiest personality trait nowadays!

Hi,
Yes you're right, I think it's reasonable to say I won't be the mother my own mother was to me, but she also started off fit and healthy and had a career and then things just went south. I guess that's what I'm worried about, that motherhood changes me and I struggle to cope like my mother did but I would hope with the insight and knowledge I have now that this would be avoided!