To be sick of this "all old people vote Tory" narrative

[WatchoRulo]

There really is no nuance to any debate when people make ill informed claims of this type.

Anecdotally from my friends and family - the only Tory voters are the younger people.

Factually - it's very obviously the case that not everyone over, say, 60 suddenly starts voting Tory.

Also - like the "old people without degrees all voted for Brexit", these claims are based on a statistical extrapolation, often from a very small sample size and are also based entirely on what people who were asked told the researchers. This "data" is from the very same polling organisations that failed to predict the outcome of the referendum, yet somehow some people have accepted their guesses as immutable truths and "facts".

We have a crap FPTP electoral system which means most people don't get what they vote for.

It's a secret ballot - the only way to know for certain the detailed demographics of who votes for what would be to check who actually voted for whom.

I am really fed up of the narrative that as a boomer (aged 60, still working and paying tax and NI by the way) I have deliberately shat on younger people all my life (why would I - I have a teenage DD).

I have personally never voted Tory and consider it vanishingly unlikely I ever would, and I recognise that I've had some lucky breaks from when I was born, but I haven't deliberately stolen from young people.

You should perhaps recall that Cameron made it perfectly clear we would leave the SM and CU and so did T.May, sure you can find leavers who spouted staying in but they did so to calm remainers fears, not because it was possible.

Staying in the SM was NEVER an option as it means staying with FOM.

Brexit was always going to lead to economic hardship, cutting yourself off from the worlds largest, most successful and closest trading bloc is and always will be madness.
We only have to see the increased tensions between Russia, China and the USA that Europe needs increased cooperation and trade not less.

Revisionism is alive and well on this thread.

lol So Blair was anti EU ? really?
You need to educate yourself.
Here's a link to Blair's 1983 election leaflet -
irishelectionliterature.com/2011/08/29/1983-election-leaflet-for-tony-blair/
"we'll negotiate a withdrawal from the EEC which has drained our natural resources and destroyed jobs"

Lol i didn't realise people aren't allowed to change their minds? he was 30 in 1983 and had just become an MP.

Perhaps you should look again at Blairs various speeches on the EU from the 90's to the present day? there are dozens, all pro EU

From the PSA

Tony Blair came to office in 1997 as the self-proclaimed “most pro-European British Prime Minister ever” with the ambition of placing the United Kingdom “at the heart of Europe”
Speeches to the 1994, 1995 and 1996 Labour party conferences marked Blair out as enthusiastic about European integration. After almost two decades of Conservative rule, the UK’s relationship with the European Union had deteriorated substantially with the UK constituting an increasingly sulky presence in the EU during the second Major administration (1992-1997). The rows which marked the ratification of the Maastricht Treaty are often cited as marking the starting point of the Tory civil war on ‘Europe’

I think you might need to educate yourself that one speech does not define any politician, for example Boris Johnson made numerous pro EU speeches as Lord Mayor.

Those may have been his views 40 years ago @WatchoRulo, but he and the world have changed in that time. Here's a more recent article about Blair, Britain and the EU. www.politico.eu/list/brexit-40-troublemakers-ranking/tony-blair/

I was told on Twitter that " I just want to punch every 65 year old in the face" was just a joke and lighten up...

I'm in an older age group and proud to have never voted tory and voted remain. This doesn't change the fact though that this age group are much more likely to vote tory/support (still ffs) brexit than younger people. I'm not offended by this knowledge, it's just a fact. Older people are more likely to vote at all than young people.

That is wrong but i'd love to know why a young Uni student would vote Tory (taking family wealth or background out the equation).

They've utterly fucked this country over the last 13 years for the next generations. Voting for them in 2010 is another matter to voting for them if there was an election tomorrow.

They vote Tory because they have heard political discussions at dinner since they were old enough to listen. Then they all vote Labour for 10 years, because your heart must be in the right/fair place, and then they quietly come back to the tories when they see advantage being taken.

I’m not convinced by young people voting Tory in any numbers. Even Clavinova (she of copy and paste fame) reckons her kids don’t.

Equally there are plenty of us who have been voting Labour since we were 18 - that’s 51 years for me - and would rather drink a bottle of bleach than vote Tory.

@EffortlessDesmond that trend is changing if you look at current analysis. It may change back if the Tories stop being incompetent and corrupt, but the past 13 years will take a while to be erased from the collective memory.

There's also going to be an issue with turnout, with habitual Tory voters deciding not to vote at all. You'd be surprised how angry people in my true blue constituency are with this government.

I think it’s a case of not all old people vote Tory, but all people who vote Tory are old 😬

that’s only half a joke. And yes, I actually did study political History.

I think some young people may have voted for them based on the Tory policy of Self ID and LGBTQ+ Inclusion which is quite popular amongst younger folk.

With one exception, all the friends I have in the UK vote Labour and always have done and are Remainers.

Also detest the mindless Boomers label.

Advantage being taken as in they think if you earn £5m from US investments, a tax rate 22% is good for the Uk and especially for them?

My DD paid an effective tax of 80% on her back dated nhs pay rise last year.

I think some young people may have voted for them based on the Tory policy of Self ID and LGBTQ+ Inclusion which is quite popular amongst younger folk

TBH the UK has some very inclusive policies under the Tories, they introduced gay marriage, anyone can self ID and get the legal certificates required via one of the many gender clinics they ve opened.

No, i think its more to do with opportunities i.e the lack of them... low wages and for many low aspiration, they are also sick to death of being told "we did it" by an older generation who (in many cases) had good annual pay rises, pensions, cheap housing, cheap rents via council housing, no tuition fees or the requirement to have degrees and jobs for life.

13 years is plenty long enough to show us all that Conservatism works and it doesn't, the country is a mess, stuff that used to work.. e.g. nhs, education, investment and road mtce... no longer does.

I'm 62 and if I could access a time machine the first thing I would do is set it to 3 years hence in 2026 punch myself in the face whilst screeching that's for effing Brexit even though I voted Remain.

UKIP would have had far more seats in the 2015 election when they were at their strongest if we had proportional representation. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2015-32601281

Proportional representation is fairer but I do find the idea that it would lead to only good things naive. They would have had 83 seats.

Instead they now have 355 seats.

😂

I don't think any party should be in power too long. Labour were toast by 2010 and I don't think their 13 years were anywhere near as bad as to what the Tories have done to the country.

Even if you don't want to vote for the opposition, or don't want them back in, nobody can want this to continue.

But the pressure from UKIP led to the referendum. Had they been given a proportionate number of seats earlier they'd have shown themselves up in Parliament as well and in their constituencies. Easy for Farage to spout from the sidelines.

Parliament has to be representative

@LimpetPool PR does carry the risk of having extremist parties in Parliament - but they tend to show themselves up as incompetent, fragment and then disappear over time, to be replaced by others. The huge advantage of PR is that you nearly always get coalition governments, which helps curb the extremes. Yes, UKIP would have had 83 seats in 2015. Looking at their behaviour since, it wouldn't have lasted. If they'd been in government, the government would likely have fallen.

@User135644 I could not agree with you more.

I work with the elderly and I have met some of the most amazing people.

I’ve yet to meet any older tory voters! (6 years down the line!!)

^totally this

Really?
I know our own personal experiences don't change the stats but I'm surprised you haven't met any old Tory voters.
I visited a care home just after the referendum and met with the manager. She said they'd made the vote a bit of a trip out for the residents and they'd all voted Leave. This is despite (or maybe because) half their carers being from the EU. She said she felt so bad for her staff, pushing the residents down in their wheelchairs having to listen to them grumbling about too many foreigners. She said they all vote Tory as well. I do live in a very Tory area of the country though.

Sorry, I forgot the 2.5 years working in a nursing home about 15 miles away in a very tory area. I think most of the residents (and staff) may have voted tory in 2019.

Ive been working closer to home since 2019 and not came across any tory voters since.

that must have been so awful for those staff members and as much as opinions should have been allowed, careless insensitivity should not