To insist my DP is harsher with her ex

[TiredManDad]

A long time lurker and reader wanting a bit of advice and a heads up to see if the flavour on here is that I'm being unreasonable.

Quick back story, been with my DP for 3 years and we have a wonderful relationship. We both have kids from previous relationships. We have one of her children full time and the other one 10 days out of 14.

Dp ex partner was very controlling and is older. Since we have got together he has had nails put in our tyres. Threatened us etc etc. Seems to have calmed down a but he only pays 50 per month maintenence as he gets paid a lot cash in hand. Even then he hardly ever pays it on time and we often get the kids dropped off with us without any notice at all on his days.

He is now 17 days late with his measly maintenance. Also yesterday he said he couldn't have his DD ruining our plans because he is ill, yet has been seen out with his GF.

I want my DP to challenge him, tell him we will go through the courts and also to say he's a nasty pathetic excuse for a human being. We are not nasty about him in front of his kids even though he always is about us and his kids find it funny.

I love my DP dearly and I understand she was mentally abused by him so doesn't want to or feel she can stand up to him, but today she has basically had a massive go at me because I have told her she needs to not put up with it and call him out for his behaviour, saying its not worth it and not up to me. I've said I will do it myself but she angrily told me not to, and then to underline matters she has been as nice as pie to him on the phone when he's said he will get his child tomorrow after school now he's feeling better. Arrrgh. Just needed to vent but also ask, AIBU to ask her to challenge and call out his behaviour?

To be clear I'm not bullying or putting her under pressure, I just think she needs to go through the courts to try and get the maintenance she deserves

That is literally the definition of pressuring someone. Seriously. Stop!

If he gets paid cash in hand, he is probably fiddling the books and going through CMS is likely to do nothing other than piss him off and make him pay even less. No registered income (ie cash in hand) = minimum/no CMS money.
Going to court will guarantee times she has to make the child available for him, it does not make him take the child on these dates.
Being tough in this situation on either of these is liable to make things worse by Pissing him off and making him nastier. It is unlikely to get you more money or him to take the child more or be more reliable.

You need to be angry with him, not her.

The two posts already seconded by others really resonated with me for personal reasons. But the reason I'm posting is to say you don't go through the courts for child maintenance. You simply apply to the CMS.
If he earns over £158k (or if he has significant assets) then the CMS issues the maximum assessment it can and the court then acquires jurisdiction to award more than the CMS can).
Assuming he is under that threshold, the CMS will look direct at his HMRC records to determine his declared income and will issue an assessment based on that. You then either accept direct pay or you get the CMS to collect it (and they charge the paying parent a fee and deduct a further fee from the receiving parent).

Unless you can clearly demonstrate undeclared earnings and prove what they are, the CMS's hands are tied. They will base the assessment on what he declares.

The CMS is not fit for purpose and with any cases that don't fit the simple mould they spend months doing nothing and not implementing their own regulations, and giving you the runaround. You tend not to see any sense until you have exhausted their review/reconsideration processes and have been moved onto the CMS Tribunal process.

And it is absolutely correct as pointed out that she can't make him have the DC. As annoying as that is, that's the reality.
Family lawyer here, btw.

You might also want to try talking to her about why she doesn’t go through CMS. There will be a reason. It might be that she’s been there, tried that, and it was pointless. It might be that she doesn’t want to poke the bear. It might be that she’s experienced how useless the CMS were and the effects of poking the bear with that particular stick.

The best thing you can do is expect nothing good from him. except no maintenance. Whatever he bothers to contribute is a bonus. Expect him to not show up and mess everyone around. Expect him to say terrible things to the children.

And support your partner in trying to deal with that, and to support her children despite their father’s inadequacies. Be there to say: ‘it doesn’t matter. We’ll be fine anyway’.

"And support your partner in trying to deal with that, and to support her children despite their father’s inadequacies. Be there to say: ‘it doesn’t matter. We’ll be fine anyway’."

I do constantly and have for three years. I guess sometimes frustration and anger of him 'getting away' with being horrible, controlling still and seemingly able to do as he pleases with no consequences just gets too much for me and I have to say something.

I do get the reasoning that I shouldn't though. I think people are misjudging the situation somewhat in interpreting that I'm being forceful in my insistence. I'm not at all, me and my DP have a close friendship and relationship and talk to each other about everything. We have about this today, we respect each others opinion and I won't push it. I just wanted to see people's views on here.

To make it clear as well we have no issue with having DD 100 per cent of the time, we wouldn't want her to have to go to him. However when we aren't scheduled to have her and she gets dropped off with no communication (especially when it gets back to him.that we have plans) it is that aspect that is frustrating.

I just wish people like him.would get there comeuppance but he never seems to. I guess we go on as we are and just accept he's going to be a c bomb of the highest magnitude while making out to the world he's an amazing person/father.

Honestly I think you're misjudging the situation but I take your points on board.

The door is the last thing I'd want, the main reason I get angry is because of the way he acts and talks to the woman I love still. It's an incredibly difficult situation but I think you're being overly harsh.

We are a team, I too have an abusive ex and we often talk and help each other. I'd suggest as best friends and lovers we do have the right to give our opinions on how we should manage each of our relationships with our ex's.

I do agree that I have no right to demand or insist on anything though, perhaps that was the wrong choice of words. Upshot is, he is a dickhead, I hate that sometimes, but I'm going to have to learn to live with it until that glorious day that we don't have to deal with him again.

I just felt I needed to address the somewhat aggressive tone in your response though.

Thank you.

I thought the CMS may do more background checks once they saw his ridiculously low basic wage but it appears not. What a shame it allows people like him to get away with not paying taxes or maintenance. But eh well, thank you for the advice.

Stop. Just fucking stop. Please please please listen to what people are saying to you. I've been there in this exact position with my ex. It's awful, it doesn't help and it makes things far far worse.

You cannot change what he is like and getting worked up about it only makes things worse. And I tell you know like countless other women can tell you that if he gets paid cash in hand a lot then going through child maintenance is pointless and in fact may end up in his favour with him paying less!

The only way forward is to accept he is useless and not expect anything from him. I know it's shit, I know it's unfair but I promise you it is the best thing to do.

Please for heavens sake listen to what people here are saying

I understand how you'd be annoyed. I'd be wanting my partner to stand up for what's right too. But unfortunately some people aren't like that and they just can't. Maybe that gives her the personality that you love? Or maybe she knows if she starts being awkward, those nails will start appearing in the tyres again and it's just not worth it.
It looks like you'll just have to bite your lip. You have a child living at yours full time anyway, can't you just pretend that the other one lives there full time too, but occasionally and randomly, she sees her father. Rather than thinking she should be at her fathers on fixed days.
However if the children are laughing at or being rude about you at his instigation, your partner should put her foot down and stop that.

Just be grateful you don't have an ex like that. It's exhausting. I can't begin to describe the pit of dread in your stomach when you have to deal with someone like that knowing the wellbeing of your children is at stake every time.

There's been some really helpful posts on here but also some absolute overreactions. Your comment is ill advised and horrible. I am angry because I love her. I manage to wind my neck in 99 per cent of the time. Yesterday I just wanted her to stand up for herself as I have had enough of seeing her treated like absolute shit.

I realise now what I probably already knew (hence why I have 'put up' with his previous behaviour) and will on reflection continue to do what is best for us and her.

Read the title of your post. What does it say? Are you saying you didn't mean it now and will do what your partner wants, rather than what you think best?

You know I came on here for a bit of advice which some have given yet some are just downright nasty. We are incredibly happy in our relationship. I accept I was being unreasonable in a very upsetting and challenging situation.

I have taken advice on board and with self reflection realise I need to support not make a bad situation worse. Try to be kind yeah.

To be clear I'm not bullying or putting her under pressure, I just think she needs to go through the courts to try and get the maintenance she deserves

Every single time I've ''stood up'' to my ex husband over the last 15 there have been consequences. Consequences for my DD and for me.

I say ''ok no problem'' when he cancels contact. I never ask for money beyond the CMS. I de-escalate vs escalate.

A residence order and very prescriptive contact order were put in place 12 years ago. The orders prohibits him from contacting me. Nevertheless he dicks me around EVERY week, frequently cancels contact, frequently wants to change dates/times and I have 1000's of abusive emails from him, the most recent dated yesterday. My DD has been emotionally abused by him countless times because I've said ''no'' or otherwise led him to be displeased. Yes, 12 years of this, 13 if I count from when he left. We have been back to court countless times (always instigated by him).

You are living a fantasy if you think the court can or will do anything about men like this.

Please support her rather than make her life more difficult than it already is. Yes it is hard to watch, hard to live with, but there is nothing she can do. You have no idea the life of misery of having to deal with an ex partner like this is.

Why do you think you know better than your partner? She's the one who's been through this. She's the one who has kids with him. She's dealing with it in her way in order to protect herself and her kids.

Now you barge in, wanting to do it YOUR way, and bullying your partner because you think she doesn't know what she's doing. I'm not surprised she is angry at you. You are being a bully and making her life way harder than it has to be.

Step back and support your partner, or just leave her alone.

@TiredManDad YANBU to be upset. Do you live together and how often do you have your dc? This man sounds deranged and dangerous if he’s slashing tyres and upsetting your DP (dc will sense the upset). From what you’ve written, it isn’t a great environment for dc to be in if they’re at risk of a deranged man.

However, I can also understand why your DP is reluctant to speak out. She left an abusive relationship after all.

OP I think that reading your more recent posts you came on here to vent. You didn't mean it to come across like it did. You've just boiled over in frustration. I hope you understand why everyone has piled onto you. Because if you'd really meant what you'd initially said then that is awful for your DP, who is already having to deal with him and doesn't need it from you too.
It's ok for it all to get too much. We are all human. Just make sure you don't reflect that back onto your poor DP and that you carry on supporting her. And remember to ALWAYS grey rock with the abusive ex.

Honestly my heart bleeds for you. It is a terrible situation. My ex whom I have the kids with was not my abusive ex, and I've never experienced someone so terrible as him.

Me and my ex really work together for my kids and it really is smooth and clockwork which in some ways highlights his behaviour even more.

It just seems so, so unfair that someone can be as nasty, spiteful, unreasonable and vindictive as he is with what seems like no consequence. And that isn't just me, my DP says the same too but she states it is the way it has to be. One thing we will never do is use the kids as pawns but he does. That is difficult too. When you have thr kids calling their mum a slag after they've been with him or saying that she's forcing their dad to pay us money he doesn't have (while he's taking his girlfriend abroad for the weekend) it's very difficult not to say anything bad about him but we don't, we just tell them thats not the case and don't poison them against him because, as much of a shit as he is, he's still their dad you know.

It's a terrible situation at times but we just need to be grateful that our interactions with him remain minimal and will one day be pretty much none existent. Its just so hard dealing with someone SO unreasonable who seems to be untouchable. You have my sympathy for a rubbish situation.

This 100 per cent. It got too much yesterday. I am her best friend and we talk about anything. Yesterday I overstepped the boundaries and also posted on here angry. Which was better than going home and venting. Got back home, made Greek food, did hike work with my SD and then we all went for a nice dog walk under the stars (it was freezing) and the world didn't seem so bad anymore.

It's just so annoying when someone as terrible as him not only gets no consequences, we have to actively support the children and almost lie on his behalf in order to protect them. It's what we do best and why we are the safespace for the kids, but my gosh when you see someone treat the person you love like that it makes it incredibly tough.

Thank you for being understanding.

I want my DP to challenge him, tell him we will go through the courts and also to say he's a nasty pathetic excuse for a human being

Why? What purpose does it serve? Why will this make you feel better?

The courts can't help you. But I dare say a solicitor will take your money. Who loses in that case?

Sure, he's a nasty pathetic excuse for a human being but how will it help if he's told that? Do you think it will change him? Do you think he'll suddenly go 'oh, I didn't realise that' and make the necessary changes?

My ex has been a nasty arsehold for the last 13 years. Only person who ends upset if it's pointed out to him is me. So I just ignore him.

He'll hopefully get his comeuppance when the kids are older and they see him for what he is.

She's right. It's not worth it and there is no court order that can resolve any of the issues you have so that's pointless too. If he works for cash CMS can't help you either. Ether to go with the assumption you have the dc full time and receive no money and build your life around that and anything you do get is a bonus. There is nothing to be gained by challenging a man like this, it's exactly what he wants!