shocked that giving birth lying down is for doctor's benefit?

[Pepsipepsi]

I've not given it too much thought before now but just came across a video saying that giving birth kneeling/standing/squatting are better birth positions than laying on back, as it opens up the hips and gravity helps.

So I Google why reclining is such a common childbirth position. And the answer basically is because it helps the medical staff see what's going on but can contribute to more pain, contractions stopping, and a longer labour. (Also some theories about how Kings used to want watch childbirth and lying down then became popular if it was seen good enough for the Royals. Could be a urban legend!)

I've read a few women's experiences agreeing with the above theory, and it's just made me feel upset and angry. Why are women suffering for medical staff convenience?
Why are we not giving women more birthing options?

Voting = YANBU giving birth using gravity makes more sense
YABU = modern medical science has come a long way and lying down is fine

I knew this when I gave birth to my 1st child, over 30 years ago.
And I still remember the evil (woman) midwife telling me to go over onto my back, as 'it would be easier'. Only later I Thought 'yes, easier for YOU'.

I have birthed twice on my back and once on a birth stool... stool was SO much easier.

I had it in my birth plan and confirmed with the OB that I could have the stool for my second, they promised I could and then refused once I was in labour because 'its a faff to go get it' and 'we dont like moving equiptment' (its a tiny foot or so high stool with a toilet seat top, hardly a 'hassle' ffs).

They also refused to do an episiotime and I tore horrifically (1 doctor and 3 midwives took 4 HOURS to piece me back together because the layers of tears had ripped so bad they wouldnt even streach back together again).

I quiried it afterwards and OB confirmed that legaly its MY choice not the midwifes and it shouldnt have been denied an episiotime and he also varified I was suppose to have the stool.

I insisted on the birth center for my 3rd and made sure DH knew to make sure I had the stool, I was actually crowning when the midwife yanked me of the bed onto the stool... still was refused an episiotomie though (although luckily didnt need one that time, I think a lot of that could be down to the stool as the head just sort of 'fell' out instead of sticking).

Had dc1 in 2018, very long labour and was laid on my back strapped to monitors unable to move at all during labour as I was high risk and they wanted to monitor baby constantly. Therefore it was so painful I had an epidural and gave birth on my back.

Had dc2 this year, not high risk. Very quick labour (2hours from first contraction to baby being here) was asked to lay flat on my back so they could check how dialted I was when we arrived at the hospital, but I physically couldn't. I managed to get on the bed but was on my side, less than 5 minutes later DC was born so i gave birth in that position but not really through choice, and I was much more mobile during the labour in general.

So you’ve watched a video and read some US sources and have decided to make a tit of yourself but thinking this is common practice here?

how odd

I saw an amazing post on Twitter showing a reenactment of a forceps upright birth, I think the mum had previous trauma and was very reluctant to to be in lithomy position unless absolutely no other options, I’ll see if I can find it

I’ve given birth twice and both times, I’ve been encouraged to go into the position I’m most comfortable in. For my first (over 9 years ago), the midwife kept telling me that being on my knees was easier but I had to lie on my back in the end. For my second child, I gave birth at the birth centre in the pool so kneeling down was the easiest thing to do and even though she was 3.8kg, I had no tears or anything. It was very smooth and the midwife had a sort of mirror she was using to check what was going on.

I do think it seems to be much more common in America where nearly everyone has an epidural and gives birth on their back. My eldest is 16 and I and my midwives were well aware of the benefits of being upright/on all fours/squatting etc. It used to make me cross when I used to watch One Born Every Minute and see women lying on their backs screaming and nobody was telling them to change position.

My children are 24 and 20, it was very much encouraged to move around a lot and stay "upright".

Most deliveries are by midwives not doctors.

I dont understand women who 'push for hours', if they where in the pushing stage that length of time would kill the baby (once the baby and cord has dropped it starts to cut off oxygen) which must mean they are pushing BEFORE baby decends to crowning which will cause swelling on the cervix lip and is counter intuitive.

I alway knew baby was imminant when theres suddenly a thwump and a heads in your vagina.

Did take a bit of pushing to get them out of the hole, I have massive headed babies and quite a small little hole if I do say so myself lol.

For quick births, yes, standing up is great. Once exhaustion kicks in... How long can you hold a squat for?

My local hospital has a policy of 1 midwife if you are on your back and two if you’re stood. Unfortunately they were short staffed when I was in labour and the midwife tried to make me lie down during a very quick labour and I just roared at her and pushed him out. I knew he would get stuck if I lay down as it had happened with my first and was set in my mind not to go through that again.

I think women are encouraged more often to move into more effective birthing positions.
Definitely plus it is easier for medical staff IMO.
Shyness, confidence, obesity, epidural, too much medication stops women changing positions.
Lying down doesn't make sense.
I stood and walked as much as I could in active Labour.
DD required intervention so I had to go on my back but still upright.
DS was born on my knees.

I kept being told to get into different positions that required putting weight on my legs, but when I was feeling my contractions in my hips and top of my legs that wasn't gonna happen! Told them to aid off and I'll stay on my back thank you very much! Was great for me as I didn't have to move after birth to have baby on my chest or for stitches!

mobile.twitter.com/sheena_byrom/status/1346573964009762820/photo/1

Here it is... upright birth with ventouse, shows even if intervention is required you don’t necessarily have to be flat on your back in stirrups

I was on my back with my first purely for medical reasons but I found it comfortable. There was a lot of talk at the time of positions beneficial for mum. I was practically forced off my back with my second to help things progress. My children are almost 12 and 16 so it’s not a new development.

Yup, simple gravity really. And emergency C sections are so common along with terrible births, and I only know about it because I became very interested when it happened to me.

If I have a baby again I'm going to be walking and squatting and I hope it will go much more smoothly.

The C section and emergency aspect around birth hindered breastfeeding for me as well, and given breastfeeding is so beneficial health-wise to mum and baby it all means a knock-on effect of ill health for both if the birth doesn't go smoothly. There's also the vaginal canal bacteria and the way the baby gets a kind of massage on exit, it all works towards a healthier mum and healthier baby.

Now why wouldn't a "health service" advocate strongly for this? How could they not know?

I gave birth 8 years ago and I don't think things have moved along. I remember going to the delivery suite and the bed was mid air. The midwife was fabulous but she kept insisting I get on the bed.

I stood up and pushed he was out 30mins later!

I was on the chair next to the bed until the mooing started (precipitous labour, but I'd had morphine and was still in denial of labour as the pain was in the wrong place). 2 midwives helped me onto my knees on the bed as I didn't want to be on my back. I did have to go onto my back after a few minutes because of shoulder dystocia, so the consultant could get an arm up there😅but I can see that would have been tricky with me on my knees 😂

The thing that gets me is active pushing. I assume other women experienced differently, but my body pushed while I tried to hold her in while asking for more morphine. Does anyone know the stats on active vs involuntary pushing? Active pushing is all I've ever seen on tv, whereas the involuntary pushing seemed very different. Less exhausting, but also no control at all. I can only describe it as being like food poisoning diarrhoea feeling!

I think care varies region to region, and consultant led to midwife led. I was expecting a full laid down on my back labour for continous monitoring (vbac), but they oddly didn't bother with monitoring at all. The nhs birth course recommended mobility pacing the room, birth balls, not on the back.

I’ve put you are being unreasonable because in my experience maternity care has come on a lot since then and we are given options. My youngest is 12 weeks and in my room there was a birthing stool, some rope thing you could hang from, the bed moved so you could go on all fours. Birth balls birthing peanuts birth pools etc all quite common these days and you can do as you wish unless medical intervention is required in which case it’s probably sensible that doctors can see properly

I gave birth on my knees both times, my first came really quick, the midwife checked me over after I said I needed to push and was like “right on your knees!” my dd came nice and quick. I found it to be a good position, especially as I was able to move around if I needed to and I felt completely in control.

I was encouraged to get into a position I was comfortable with. I think at one stage they did suggest kneeling specifically but I was far too tired so lying on back was best for me. V quick labour, no pain relief, no tears.

@Blessedbethefruitz I couldn’t control my pushing, my body automatically did it and I just went with the flow!
The only time I had to force myself to push was with my second and it was the last push to get him out as he started to breathe while his head way half way out, it was incredibly difficult to bare down without a contraction!

With my first I was at home on the floor with a paramedic behind holding ne in a sitting position.

Midwife just about flat on her stomach in front of me.

2nd in hospital on the floor on all fours.

Couldn't get onto the bed so midwife again on the floor with me!

Oldest nearly 30!

Well it depends on the situation. You shouldn’t obviously lie on your back for no reason if it’s not what you want. But I’ve never heard of that happening. Midwives support you in choosing the best position for yourself and what’s working and is comfortable. You can even put preferred positions on your birth plan.
But if there are difficulties - in my case some bleeding and the need to wear a monitor to keep track of baby’s heartbeat - it’s not for the ‘doctor’s or midwives’’ benefit, it’s for your benefit that the doctor and/or midwives can do their jobs as best they can by having the clearest view and the ability to use any additional equipment easily.
I think this is a weird non issue to be debating to be honest if you’re giving birth in the UK in the 21st century.