Landlord chasing rent - AIBU?

[missverstaendnis]

I am feeling rather upset after receiving an email last night from my landlord informing me that my rent was overdue for payment (due on the 1st) and to make arrangements ASAP for payment.

For background. For the last 5 years of living in this house my rent has been on a monthly standing order for the 1st of the month. This has ALWAYS been paid, have never been late to pay rent EVER.
Fast forward to this month as the 1st falls on a Saturday, DDs/ Standing Orders get paid out following working day (tomorrow, the 3rd).
I have never wasted a thought on this nor has it ever been raised as an issue.

Called the landlord to inform of this to which I was told her needs to pay his own outgoing on the 1st and that rent needs to be paid on a 1st of each month. I wasn't believed that payment will automatically go out Monday morning.

So I have cancelled my standing order and made a transfer last night to him.
Now it looks like it was too late to actually cancel the standing order from leaving my account tonight, so I will be catapulted into my overdraft.

Who is being unreasonable here -
landlord for requesting payment on a weekend and chasing me on it on a Saturday night with a harsh email,
or me for not monitoring that the 1st fell on a non-banking day and not cancelling the standing order sooner to arrange for the transfer on the morning of the 1st?

I am paid in the last WORKING day of the month. If that a Saturday or Sunday then It goes in on the Friday.

ALL 'banking business' that is set up for the first ; Mortgage, CTAX, BT, Vodaphone, Electric, Oil, water, TV licence, Car, Car Insurance.. comes out on the NEXT working day.

If YOUR LL specifically requested Standing Order then he is a complete arse and I would suspect he is in financial trouble . Two reasons for this.

1. If he can't cover 1 non banking day (Sunday) when NO direct debits go out . It means he has absolutely no financial cushion should he need emergency maintenance on your home.

1. Who the hell monitors their rental income and hassles a tenant of five years standing BEFORE the rent is late. (It wasn't late until 00.01 on Sunday morning.

You are most definitely NOT bu OP. !
Also do not let him keep your money. Your overdraft will cost you money that you shouldn't be having to pay for.

I do pay some bills on the 1st. Gardener, DD allowance, etc. But these are manual transfers .

If this is what he wants then he should have said so. You are not responsible for either the banking system or his lack of knowledge of the banking system. !

Ignore pp's getting shitty.

Your LL is a dick.

I wouldn't have bent over backwards in this situation, you're right a LL/tenant relationship is a two way street.

You've been an excellent tenant caring for his property.

Such a shame you couldn't get a mortgage based on your rent payments.

I'm in the same situation it is the pits.

YANBU, the standing order is set up correctly, the bank default is the next working day (as is mine). If you have to do this manually then it's open to error as in forgetting etc.

You've set up a perfectly acceptable and widely used method of paying your rent.

I would do nothing except explain you e set up a SO, you however don't run the bank.

Just suppose the 1st fell on Easter Monday that would mean you'd have to pay on the 28th March?

How do you know the landlord is greedy?

Your landlord is a fool if he sets up his direct debits on 1st month. He almost certainly doesn't.

I would have ignored the email until Monday.

YANBU but don't give another thought about it (beyond asking for the money back ASAP).

Why? Are landlords not allowed to be affected by cost of living crisis, personal issues, unavoidable increased expenditure etc?

I don't think the landlord is being reasonable but disliking and assuming they've got unlimited funds because they're a landlord is ridiculous .

I think he is sounding very unreasonable. Does anyones direct debits go out on the weekend in the UK? Mine certainly don’t.
What happens when the first falls around a bank holiday? Perhaps he should ask for rent to be paid prior to the 1st. His financial stresses aren’t your issue.
Also ensure he sends the extra payment back, he can’t just have two lots of rent.

I’m a LL and it’s super greedy to expect payment early when no bills should be going out on a weekend anyway!

Honestly my experience as a LL tells me when you get a good long term tenant who pays, doesn’t smash up your property and generally isn’t a bother, you pick your battles and a weekend payment date isn’t one of them

Why? Are landlords not allowed to be affected by cost of living crisis, personal issues, unavoidable increased expenditure etc?.

It is a business agreement 🤝 so yes it is important that the landlord has a cash flow for unexpected breakdowns.

Imagine your employer had no cash flow behind the business.

OP I'd be worried about his reaction, could he have issues with addiction or whatnot?

My friends LL was texting in the days before the rent was due for an early payment, he was gambling and not paying his mortgage.

Thankfully she had made arrangements to move when she heard the house was being repossessed.

His attitude is really off-putting.

OP I'd be worried about his reaction, could he have issues with addiction or whatnot?

Christ alive I’m seen some stretches on MN but this one really reaches for the stars

There is no evidence that this LL is short of cash or a multi-millionaire. 5ere is no evidence that he/she will fully maintain the property as required and respomd as issues arise or not.

All we have here is an email from a LL saying the rent wasn’t paid on time. We have concluded that this wasn’t reasonable and if the payment date falls at the weekend, the payment arrives next day….as has actually happened for OP before. However, all we have is one unreasonable email…to extrapolate to the LL has financial problems or is otherwise a crap LL, or that all LLs are crap is a leap too far from this one little piece of evidence.

I totally agree that LLs need to know when they’ve got good tenants who pay the rent on time, dont wreck the property snd communicate when needed. Beyond those things, it often isn’t worth fighting battles, although it’s also worth realising that these are basic expectations that should be taken s a given for all tenants….but sadly aren’t. When a tenant makes a minor error (and in this case OP hasn’t done that) then a bit of forbearance is important and goes a long way to promoting good relations. If there’s one payment late by a day, that could be ignored. The fact a tenant requires 4 emails and a phone call in order to respond, could be ignored, the fact that there is rather more scuffing to the walls ir damage to the carpet than might be considered normal wear and tear could be ignored, as could rather annoying call-outs for things that they could have sorted themselves such as a lightbulb or something simply not being plugged in. But along the same lines, a bit of forbearance the other way should be possible too….and most tenants are fine with this. So when a LL want to pop round to do some maintenance or to repair something, at a time that isn’t wholly convenient, a tenant might agree anyway. Towards the end if a tenancy if a LL has been a good landlord and now would like to show a prospective tenant round before the existing one moves out, the tenant might agree. If a LL makes an error like the one this LL has made, the tenant could just politely point out that previously on many occasions the pay date has fallen on a weekend and payment been received the next working day, without any problem, without deciding they are the devil himself.

So my point is, it really helps if LLs and tenants are prepared to show a bit of forbearance to each other. Of course the basic things like paying rent and maintains the property fully and allowing quiet enjoyment without interference are absolutely vital and without these, the relationship isn’t going to work. But especially in relationships that can last several years, a little but if seeing the other party is a human being and that things don’t always run smoothly or work out perfectly and a little but of flexibility goes a long way.

This incident is annoying for the OP. It is the LLs error. OP has been a good tenant and so this rankles. But it is likely to be an honest error and not one that means the LL is terrible or the rental agreement cannot work into the future. Op can point out the fact that pay day has often fallen on weekends before and laymen’s arrived on Monday without problem. The LL will likely accept this and might apologise too. And then just move on….it’s one of those little blips that happens in life all the time, and we can choose to dwell on them and make us bitter, or shrug and move on and forget them.

UPDATE.
I was lucky, the SO payment didn't go out over night, the cancellation was effective after all.
I am so relieved to not have to contact LL awkwardly to ask for payment back. However, next inspection is due next month and already dreading the face to face interaction. He's always been highly strung - I don't think addiction or gambling is the root cause but have a feeling that cash flow might be an issue as I had a few warning signs in terms of odd messages in the last year when it came to repairs.
I am a people pleaser and I like to live in a nice home so even when there was some water damage caused by a slow leak that didn't get fixed properly for ages, I offered to sand down and re-paint walls myself. LL dropped off the cheapest paint possible (dripping non coating mess) and actually never even thanked me. Many other examples too. I don't know what more I could do to not be treated like I shouldn't be here. It's not like I live here for free or as a favour but as mentioned before there is nothing else available and my kids go to school locally so would be a pain to move further out, never mind the actual cost of a move and having to re-decorate another house.

That's good news about the second payment. Your landlord seems to need every penny of the income he gets from your rent, and that is colouring all of his actions. It sounds like things are generally ok although not brilliant. Why not stay as you are but keep an eye out for other places to live in case something better comes along?

I really hope a lot of landlords do to be honest as they're a big part of the problems we have in this country

If 'a lot' of landlords go bust, you realise that means less available rental homes in an already under-supplied market, which would lead to further increases to rent payments?

That wouldn't be great for tenants.

The government are a big part of the problems we have in this country, not Landlords.

Our contracts have always stated on or after because of this exact situation. Yanbu.

As a LL, you are definitely NBU. It’s insanity to have a mortgage or other monthly payments dependent on rental income due to go out the next day (I allow a week). And to chase you before the rent was actually late 😳.
What with the survey and other things it does sound to me as if he might be struggling, so I would definitely be keeping an eye out for an alternative option if possible. As others have said, tenants like you are like gold dust and he’d be very foolish to force you out.
I have had to refix recently and what with the higher rates and the changes to tax relief on mortgages, being a landlord is definitely making less financial sense than it used to, especially if you are a good one as I try to be (ie not charge the top rent you can, do repairs promptly etc).
The PP who said that it would be a good thing if lots of landlords went under is bonkers - who wants a rental market where there are too few unscrupulous landlords squeezing their tenants for the last pip? Sorry to derail the thread but in summary, YADNBU!

Even if it’s not been an issue for the LL in the past, it obviously is now! They may have managed with late payments because they had an overdraft or more in their account and not noticed or not said anything for fear of damaging the relationship.
LL are also under a lot of pressure with mortgage rates and other expenses. They don’t get the same tax breaks as a few years ago so your LL might genuinely be feeling the pinch.
i would definitely make sure your money is there on time. Not worth the hassle especially if it affects you getting another property in the future.
i would also apologise, say you didn’t realise, you’ve changed the SO and that you hope you haven’t caused the LL and inconvenience!

Your landlord ‘ clearly it’s never been a issue before and it’s probably only a issue now because she needed money ? Be wary of his /her financial situation . Anyway just stop the SO and pay directly on the first each month . It will go in straight away even on a Sunday .

A tenant who always pays the rent on time for several years is ideal.

Speaking as a landlord, a landlord should have the capacity to run the ship for a day or two because of the delays in the banking system, there were no grounds to think anything was untoward with you.

It suggests that the landlord is running a very, very tight ship, and the increases in interest rates may well be a problem for the landlord going forward.
Bear in mind that BTL mortgages are likely to be renewed at rates of 6% plus, which is a far cry from the 2% to 3% that has been charged over the last few years. This further illustrates the short-sightedness of the landlord throwing their toys out of the pram. The last thing the landlord would want is for you to move and to be saddled with a void period

People on this thread are conflating standing orders and direct debits which work differently.

Direct debits are taken by the company and are not taken early if the date lands on a weekend or bank holiday, they will go the next working day.

However, standing orders are sent from the account holder to the recipient and are still sent on weekends.

I personally think you are BU. Something as important as rent should always be paid a couple of days early so it arrives in the recipients account on time. He is being an arse about it but he’s not in the wrong.

You are unreasonable to accommodate his bullshit. I’d have ignored his first message, if he’s not aware of the basics of how standing orders work then he doesn’t deserve to run a property business. Amateurish behaviour, he can get fucked, after 5 years of reliable tenancy he should be kissing your arse.

This happened to me at my last rented property. Landlady said I hadn't paid the rent when it was also due on the 1st. It happened to be a bank holiday that month so wasn't paid until the next day. By the time she rang the money was already in her bank account! Stupidly, I then changed the date of the SO to the 29th which was fine until February when the same thing happened again!. Yes, she rang again saying I hadn't paid it when the bank had paid it out on the 1st and it was already in her account. I changed the date again to the 21st because every month has a 21st. This still doesn't account for days when the 21st is a bank holiday though as Easter is a moveable feast of course.

Thankfully, I have now changed landlords and have now got a fantastic landlord. The rent here is also due on the 1st and when it went out on the 2nd (because 1st was New Year's Day) waited for the call. Of course, new landlord has a brain and understood what had happened. Therefore they didn't bother to enquire.

My previous landlady was always trying to find fault and was hoping I had defaulted so she could complain. Only made herself look stupid of course (which she was).

Decent landlords know this can happen and if it bothers them, they can stipulate a date in the lease which will suit them better. If they don't know it can happen they shouldn't be landlords. You are NOT being unreasonable; your landlord is.

I honestly wouldn’t worry, don’t change anything going forward unless you really want to! I had this problem when it was the weekend of the queens funeral.

my rent payment was on the 18th sep (a Sunday) mine has always gone out standing order, no problems about situations with any other weekend payments etc, it naturally went out next working day (20th) and I had a phonecall of the estate agents accusing me of not paying my rent!! Baring in mind they rang me on the 20th! Didn’t even think to check first if it had been paid🙄

I double checked my account and stated it left my account on the 20th due to the bank holiday (queens funeral) and they went to double check the system and then apologised saying it had been received on there end!

although, I have been given a section 21 as family want to sell up and they seem to be looking for any slight thing at the minute🤷‍♀️ If I was you I’d ask for your payment to be sent back into your account (unless you can afford for them to keep it towards the month after)

its common sense that if it lands on a weekend/bank holiday it goes out next working day. YANBU!x

That's a very naive thing to say. Cash flow problems sometimes don't advertise themselves in advance. He is as entitled as the next person to have blips in his income.

If you’ve paid this way for five years then why would you worry I would have just left it, it sounds more like your landlord maybe in financial difficulties which are not your responsibility.