Royal commentator says that African descendants of past kings should pay reparations for slavery

[cocococococococo]

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www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/donald-trump-jr-fordwich-slave-trade-reparations-b2171510.html

Having been born and grown up in Africa, I am sad to say this is 100% true.

Corruption is all pervading , the President is Chief, the Chief owns everything and gives whatever he choose to the people, keeps what’s left for himself.

Thats Africa - other places too.

I genuinely think reparations should be a topic as big in the UK news scene as the cost of living crisis. I genuinely think this.

Naunet · Today 14:07
I think Americans really need to shut their mouths when thinking they have some moral high ground over the British in terms of slavery. Their history of slavery is far, far worse.

Oh Gosh, yes - I don't think they have a leg to stand on!

In some parts of the South...I'm not sure it's even gone away.

I genuinely think reparations should be a topic as big in the UK news scene as the cost of living crisis. I genuinely think this

Why and what would it look like?

No 1 for my husband would go his birth certificate showing his father
His fathers birth certificate showing his father's name
DHs grandfather's birth certificate showing his father's name
DHs great grandfather's record in the slave inventory at the plantation where he was born

You could also show it by going back from his grandmother's name with the same sort of trail.

I don't know if it would work like that for everyone but it is well documented on the island where DHs ancestor's ended up and the oral family history made it easy to find those two lines.

I always thought the argument about reparations wasn't about money for Africa, I thought it was to help development in the West Indies where many descendants of slaves live in poverty.

Just to be clear I didn't mean reparations should go to people who can show a trail, just that it is possible.

If anything is paid I think it should be to develop chances for communities in poor Caribbean countries. The US would be responsible for the descendants of slaves in the US, I don't think that should be down to the UK.

Given that we finished paying 'compensation' to enslavers just in 2015, so everyone who has paid tax till then contributed, I want reparations. The truth is no-one with any vested interest in reparations has the power to enact it but it's something I hope increases in popularity. Pay Up! And not just because it was centuries ago does not matter one jot!

Well it is a matter of historical record that many many countries and peoples have enslaved others, going back to biblical times. Reparations don't make sense as if once country does it then yes all the others should do it too ....

That’s already been discussed. We finished paying the loans that paid reparations in 2015.

They were still sending payments to families of previous slave owners.

What happened centuries ago? Slavery? Slavery has always and still does exist.

Slavery is not one period of history.

Depends on your church. My C of E church are very active in campaigning against present day slavery.

Pay Up! And not just because it was centuries ago does not matter one jot!

Who will be responsible for paying up? The tax payer?

Yeah this. ^ YABU @cocococococococo Everyone is quick enough to blame the Brits alive todays for the sins of their fathers, so why shouldn't everyone else be asked/expected to make reparations too?

Or is this a case of 'only the British - especially the English - should be called into question for anything EVER, forevermore?'

It seems terribly fashionable - and acceptable to bash the white British people - especially the (white) English, but noooooooooooo we must NEVER attack anyone else! Save up all that energy to bash us eh?!

And the tragic thing is, it's OTHER white British people doing it. (Mostly!)

Seriously, it's becoming white noise now.

I’ve travelled to The West Indies also in Africa when it comes to poverty Africa is far worse off . Poverty is relative to each country there is poverty in the US and the UK too

The country, i.e tax payers, shouldn't have to pay reparations. If anyone should it is the descendants of the people who made money from the slave trade. That would however mean the elite - the royal family, the Middletons for example. The descendants of those working in mills - many of whom protested against slavery - bear no guilt.

Much of the Slavery compensation money was spent on building mansions and high living, many/most have been given to the National Trust in lieu of Estate Duty.

I do think the billion pound business that where built on the slave trade need to pay up for the reparations and also need to refund ( with inflation) the money back to the tax payer who paid them off to give up the slaves. Problem solved!

@ancientgran.how is your husband being "paid up" going to help him?

Will Ethiopia and Somalia be paying up? After all, slavery was-and may still be-rife there. That is slavery of Africans by Africans.
Will Arab nations be paying up?
Will China be paying up?
What will happen to mixed race people? Will they be given money which they will then symbolically pay back?

I can probably answer my own question there and that answer will be no, they won't!

Am I going to get some payment for the Elizabethan takeover of Ireland?
Will English people be compensated for the William the Conqueror's Burnt Earth Policy?
Will the Jewish people of medieval Europe be able to get payment for their treatment too?
Will I be compensated by Africa for the slaves they took from Ireland?
Will men who were conscripted into armies be paid? After all, they were often sent to death against their will.
Will Italy pay for the atrocities committed by the Roman Empire?
Will Norse countries pay out for the damage caused by Vikings?

Insert your own possible claim here.

Don't worry if one doesn't immediately occur-it could be a Christmas family parlour game in which you all brainstorm in order to come up with something.

If we accept that money makes past wrongs right, then why can't we all claim?

It is all absolute bollocks and, as for all these documents that @ancientgran refers to-I would bet my first born that if this madness goes ahead, it will be accompanied by a booming market in forgeries.

There is nothing to pay for. Nothing. Yes, that's right. Nothing

For all those who feel such white guilt, that they want to feel pain, sell your house and send the money to an African charity. Somehow though, I think that won't be done. A cheaper alternative is to get a hair shirt and wear it every day as a symbol of all the shame that you feel on behalf of your ancestors. That won't be done either.

I always find is hilarious how working class people are quick to defend these millionaires who are living of slave money. Firstly you are victims in this too. You ancestors tax money was paid to them to give up the slaves. Secondly these would never go out their way to defend you the way you are defending them.

The slave owners where paid off with tax payer money that they continued to receive until 2016.

Fun, little known, fact: compensation was paid when slavery officially ended in the British empire -- to the slave owners. The records of these payments exist. Many went to families that continue to form part of the UK establishment (at least one of the Camerons - not sure if David or Samantha or both - have ancestors on this list).

I can't for the life of me see anything wrong with asking the present generations of these families to cough up for, say, a fund to mitigate educational disadvantages for Black kids now in the UK. Of course there are constructive ways to redistribute some of the ill-gotten gains of the era of slavery. They just won't be pursued because - see above - the same establishment is still in charge.

Don Lemon isn't very smart, alas. But his prissy interlocutor is wrong; the holding facilities for slaves on the West African coast were typically provided by the European buyers. If African kings' descendants ought to pay reparations, then so ought the descendants of the Europeans who profited.

At one point the average time of a slave's survival after arrival on a plantation in the Caribbean was seven years - and I'm not even sure that is the lowest number across the different islands. They were worked to death, and that was on their European owners, no matter what had led to their enslavement.

The thing that this thread shows the most clearly is that teaching on the history of the Transatlantic slave trade continues to be woefully inadequate. It wasn't just another slave trade. It dwarfs the others, and it dwarfs 'modern slavery'. Nobody is openly embarking 25,000 people a year for sale at market today, while arguing that it's OK because they don't have souls or some such.

It has been argued, convincingly, that Transatlantic slavery created the conditions for industrialization - it made the modern world. Europeans didn't get richer than the rest just by 'work ethic' or similar. Useful reading on this point:

press.princeton.edu/books/paperback/9780691090108/the-great-divergence

I don't normally feel ashamed of being European - it's not like I can help it - but some of the posts on here make me embarrassed to be so.

@ThreeLocusts Sell your house. Give the money you have set aside for your children-from paying college fees to swimming club fees to a black educational charity.

You'll feel better, it will ease your shame or is it that you don't want to put your hand in your own pocket?

If you're daft enough to want to pay for complex historical matters-a stupid idea in the first place-fill your boots.

I don't accept the idea because it is stupid and exonerates guilty African nations from blame.

African nations definitely shouldn’t be paid when it comes to reparations. Many of them gained for the practice themselves this is conversation should be had only with the America’s and Europe.

What about Lancashire people who did without-in the cotton years-to fight American slavery?

Go and have a look at their descendants now. They're not booming! White working-class males in this group are seriously disadvantaged. They have no privileges.