Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Royal commentator says that African descendants of past kings should pay reparations for slavery

184 replies

cocococococococo · 21/09/2022 06:38

😳
www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/donald-trump-jr-fordwich-slave-trade-reparations-b2171510.html

OP posts:
TomPinch · 21/09/2022 07:44

ShirtingForkBalls · 21/09/2022 07:27

How would it work? In practice?

Simple.

  1. Money gets paid to government of country x.
  1. President of country x (probably the descendent of slavers) siphons off the money.
  1. It gets laundered back to Canary Wharf and gets spent on Kensington High St by said president and his family.
ChagSameachDoreen · 21/09/2022 07:45

Should pay, or be paid?

thecatsthecats · 21/09/2022 07:47

It's a ridiculous suggestion, but it is at least a bit more focused than other ridiculous reparation suggestions.

One percenters have been abusing the common man since time immemorial. It makes more sense to target them rather than simply say the British or Dutch were responsible. Because 99% of the British or Dutch etc were subject to the exploitation of the same people profiting from slavery, and they didn't have any power to stop it.

oakleaffy · 21/09/2022 07:53

MbatataOwl · 21/09/2022 07:36

We need to concentrate on slavery that is happening today.
In the UK we have people held as domestic slaves and sex slaves. I can't understand why by people insist on harping on about past slavery when right now it's happening, we can see it but yet no body cares. It's mind blowing.

Absolutely agree.
Slaves held in cannabis 'Farms' without access to fresh air or outdoors for months on end, Held on Trawlers to fish, nail bars, restaurants and sex work...
I had no idea how prevalent it was, until seeing an exhibition visiting Bristol, where they had an exhibition about Modern Day slavery.

People are still being beaten by their captors.

sst1234 · 21/09/2022 07:59

Why not start with the corrupt African leaders of today by making them give up their looted trillions back to the people they looted them from, just in the last 60 years. Wouldn’t that be a noble idea.

But oh no, that’s not progressive enough right? Maybe someone will come along and say it’s even racist.

MindYourBeeswax · 21/09/2022 08:07

Will the descendants of African chiefs who sold their people to slavers have to pay out as well?

I have found out that Joan down the road from me is a descendant of a Black and Tan who killed one of my ancestors in Ireland? Should I be expecting a big pay out from her too?

What about Derek whose ancestor murdered Jenny's ancestor. is Jenny ready for a pay out?

It is bollocks to think that anyone or any collection of people can pay for something that happened in the past. TOTAL BOLLOCKS.

I do hope though that if some gobshite nation-probably the UK-pays out in any way that the history of some of these African nations be looked at too. They don't have glorious pre=lasparian societies either. Pol Pot, Idi Amin spring to mind. Shocking isn't it to discover that every nation on earth will have done something wrong at some point.

How is money going to make it all better? No fucker need bother apologising for anything my ancestor might or might have or not done.

There is plenty of shite going on now all around the world and not one fucking nation-including African nations-has the right to throw the first stone.

Sorry for something that happened hundreds of years ago. Balls. It's a narrative that needs to stop.

MindYourBeeswax · 21/09/2022 08:08

TomPinch · 21/09/2022 07:44

Simple.

  1. Money gets paid to government of country x.
  1. President of country x (probably the descendent of slavers) siphons off the money.
  1. It gets laundered back to Canary Wharf and gets spent on Kensington High St by said president and his family.
Show quote history

This.

Crazykatie · 21/09/2022 08:13

There is no difference between reparations for slavery and that for indigenous populations around the world. There is hardly any country that has not exploited and slaughtered it’s neighbours or enslave others in the past.

IT IS STILL HAPPENING TODAY we are all benefiting from exploitation in our daily lives

hattie43 · 21/09/2022 08:15

It's all very strange , paying reparations today by people who didn't do anything to people nothing happened to .
It's historic and it'd be far better to abolish slavery today .

Glitteratitar · 21/09/2022 08:16

It’s a tough one because if you pay reparations for slavery, where does it stop? Will England start paying reparations for other atrocities it has been involved in?

That said, the effects of slavery are still felt in the US today, with the high level of poverty amongst African Americans being directly linked to the end of slavery. So it’s difficult to just ignore that and say slavery happened in the past.

MsPincher · 21/09/2022 08:18

TomPinch · 21/09/2022 07:22

It is a fair response to the claim that the descendents of those who profited should pay.

It will also cause offence, but it's no less true for that.

It's a classic illustration of why there is no right not to be offended.

Show quote history

This. Many black and mixed race people from the Caribbean are descendants of both slaves and slave owners. Are they responsible for what their slave owner ancestors did?

MsPincher · 21/09/2022 08:20

Glitteratitar · 21/09/2022 08:16

It’s a tough one because if you pay reparations for slavery, where does it stop? Will England start paying reparations for other atrocities it has been involved in?

That said, the effects of slavery are still felt in the US today, with the high level of poverty amongst African Americans being directly linked to the end of slavery. So it’s difficult to just ignore that and say slavery happened in the past.

Will everyone else pay reparations for all the things they’ve done too? To all the long dead victims?

Glitteratitar · 21/09/2022 08:23

MsPincher · 21/09/2022 08:20

Will everyone else pay reparations for all the things they’ve done too? To all the long dead victims?

Show quote history

Did you read the first paragraph? Where I made that same point?

midgetastic · 21/09/2022 08:25

Glitteratitar · 21/09/2022 08:16

It’s a tough one because if you pay reparations for slavery, where does it stop? Will England start paying reparations for other atrocities it has been involved in?

That said, the effects of slavery are still felt in the US today, with the high level of poverty amongst African Americans being directly linked to the end of slavery. So it’s difficult to just ignore that and say slavery happened in the past.

Those problems apply to the UK also

The focus should be on recognising those problems exist , understanding why and fixing them going forward

good education - the good schools and teachers are not attracted to the poorer areas, job opportunities, role models , investment uplifting the infrastructure where poor people predominantly live , reducing the police bias

Glitteratitar · 21/09/2022 08:27

midgetastic · 21/09/2022 08:25

Those problems apply to the UK also

The focus should be on recognising those problems exist , understanding why and fixing them going forward

good education - the good schools and teachers are not attracted to the poorer areas, job opportunities, role models , investment uplifting the infrastructure where poor people predominantly live , reducing the police bias

Show quote history

That’s exactly it - you need more investment in those areas. Some could argue that’s akin to reparations though.

MrsDanversGlidesAgain · 21/09/2022 08:29

MindYourBeeswax · 21/09/2022 08:07

Will the descendants of African chiefs who sold their people to slavers have to pay out as well?

I have found out that Joan down the road from me is a descendant of a Black and Tan who killed one of my ancestors in Ireland? Should I be expecting a big pay out from her too?

What about Derek whose ancestor murdered Jenny's ancestor. is Jenny ready for a pay out?

It is bollocks to think that anyone or any collection of people can pay for something that happened in the past. TOTAL BOLLOCKS.

I do hope though that if some gobshite nation-probably the UK-pays out in any way that the history of some of these African nations be looked at too. They don't have glorious pre=lasparian societies either. Pol Pot, Idi Amin spring to mind. Shocking isn't it to discover that every nation on earth will have done something wrong at some point.

How is money going to make it all better? No fucker need bother apologising for anything my ancestor might or might have or not done.

There is plenty of shite going on now all around the world and not one fucking nation-including African nations-has the right to throw the first stone.

Sorry for something that happened hundreds of years ago. Balls. It's a narrative that needs to stop.

Henry Louis Gates Jr has a very interesting programme about the empires of Africa - probably on YT. The episode about the role of the kingdom in slavery goes into the subject in some detail, and this was before the arrival of the Europeans, who tapped into a lucrative and well establised market.

historynewsnetwork.org/article/125861

TwoLeftSocksWithHoles · 21/09/2022 08:32

Sausagenbacon · 21/09/2022 06:59

The Arabs were also a key part of slave trading, while we're at it.

And the Romans, they certainly seem to be keeping a low profile over it at the moment.
And they built a wall to keep people out.

MrsDanversGlidesAgain · 21/09/2022 08:36

And where's this money coming from and who decides who gets it? bureaucratic nightmare doesn't even begin to start to describe that one.

MrsDanversGlidesAgain · 21/09/2022 08:36

Role of the kingdom of Angola, I should have said.

MbatataOwl · 21/09/2022 08:39

People are still being beaten by their captors

In the UK there have been cases here of maids kept as slaves, abused and sometimes even murdered by people with diplomatic immunity.
The police very, very, very rarely do anything.

ChardonnaysBeastlyCat · 21/09/2022 08:41

Should Turkey pay reparation to Ukraine? Many of the women in the harems of the Ottoman rulers were slaves from Ukraine.

Trainbear · 21/09/2022 08:46

The World Cup is taking place in an Arabian nation this year/next year. Much has been said about Arabian countries attitudes to homosexuality. Protests are planned. The role of Arab merchants in slavery is and was much bigger. Will black players and anti racist protesters be protesting about Arabian rulers leading the enslavement of blacks in Africa?

DevilsVineBlues · 21/09/2022 08:47

BUT why should people today pay for something done 200 plus years ago?

I think the theory is that, the mass removal of large numbers of healthy young people from countries 200 years ago meant those people were not available to advance that country in a way that might have happened if they were left alone. i.e. infrastructure was not built, no one received health care or education, standard of living stagnated etc.

Instead those people were used to generate income or provide manpower to other counties who were able to advance their own infrastructure. By doing so, they were able to 'get ahead' and continue to benefit from that advanced start today. e.g. most people in those countries do receive some form of health care, education etc. Most of those counties established universities providing advanced education allowing for further innovation and development etc. Most people living in those countries are benefitting from that head start in all sorts of indirect ways.

Reparation is a complex issue and I am not arguing for it, because it's beyond my knowledge and ability to understand all the aspects. But, it's also more than just money as a way to say sorry. It's about how those actions decided the future/current states of those countries involved.

ConnectFortyFour · 21/09/2022 08:47

My grandpa was always very proud of his ancestors who were senior naval establishment figures who were famous then (not now). This was always regarded as embarrassing by younger members of the family who assumed they were colonial baddies.

after his death I looked into some of the family history and found they had been heavily involved in anti slavery measures both in terms of policy and policing the high seas. Some family members died when their ships went down.

Do I get some money?

oakleaffy · 21/09/2022 08:51

MbatataOwl · 21/09/2022 08:39

People are still being beaten by their captors

In the UK there have been cases here of maids kept as slaves, abused and sometimes even murdered by people with diplomatic immunity.
The police very, very, very rarely do anything.

Terrifying.
Also Kuwait..Filipino maid killed by her Syrian female captor.