To be sad at how entitled society seems to be becoming?

[ForestPeace]

Mumsnet is a force for good, so I’m not meaning to point at it specifically, though I suppose in some ways the views found here are a reflection of society as a whole. I’m just struck sometimes by how entitled and self-centred society has become. It seems people are so ready to look at how something is affecting them, and don’t seem to see beyond that viewpoint. Some examples might be ‘ I can’t have the bank holiday I want, because of the Royal Family’ ( I’m not talking about people missing medical and other appointments here, but people saying they’re going to ‘trapped indoors’ etc). Other things such as ‘this shop/restaurant did something wrong so I want somebody sacked’. ‘ This friend offended me, so I’m ending the relationship’. I’ve been reflecting recently on the Queen ( though I am not a Royalist), and feeling that somehow our society has lost sight of values like consideration for others, flexibility, compromise, acceptance that things don’t always go well, forgiveness, awareness that we may feel hard done by, but there’s probably someone else worse off, and so on. Of course, it is a generalisation to say society is like this, and hopefully the majority of people still hold these values, but I feel sad to see so much self-centredness and eager to blame creeping in just about everywhere you look it seems sometimes. Wondered if anyone felt like this?

[Andante57]

I think you're right about social media - it's so easy to be awful whilst hidden by anonymity. I am not sure there is a solution to that problem that doesn't involve making it worse by introducing censorship

Yes, anonymity means people can be as awful as they want.
However I’ve read about cases where anonymity was rumbled - I’m thinking about a historian who wrote terrible reviews on Amazon for books written by a rival historian who he, the review writer, was jealous of.
Somehow he was exposed and he must have felt a complete idiot.
Im not very techie so I don’t know how easy it is to discover people’s real identities.

[SummerWinterSummerWinter]

@lailamaria

'this friend offended me so i'm ending the relationship' good honestly good why should i have people in my personal life who make me miserable or go against something i believe in - coworker different story, personal friend nah cannot be bothered.

"why should I have people in my life who go against something I believe in"

This seems pretty extreme to me. You're basically saying you have no tolerance for any friends who have differing views to yours? Won't that mean your circle narrows and you limit the type of world outlook you come across? And if you only have friends who think identically to you, you reduce your tolerance for other people/assume that your way is the absolute acceptable way?

For people that make you miserable, yes of course, cut them loose, that's a different thing.

[Freedomfighters]

@MarshaBradyo

Who is angrier than ever?

I don’t see it irl, or maybe you mean on mn

People in general. On here. On other social media. In real life.

[MarshaBradyo]

@Freedomfighters

People in general. On here. On other social media. In real life.

I suppose we all experience our own lives and realities

I see threads on here where people seem to inhabit a very angry rl but I don’t get the same irl. It’s hard to compare as we’ll all be different.

[Freedomfighters]

this friend offended me so i'm ending the relationship' good honestly good why should i have people in my personal life who make me miserable or go against something i believe in - coworker different story, personal friend nah cannot be bothered.

You don't have friends who have different opinions to you? Seems like a narrow and soulless way to live.

[microbius]

The fish rots from the head. Look at the leaders we have had in the last ten years. Self-entitled twats, absolutely immoral, antagonising and splitting society and building their success on how much hatred they could stir. Johnson built his success on driving more division re:Brexit. Truss says I will govern as a conservative, not I will unite the nation. I am very despirited, yes. There seems to be no common moral ground, no project one can believe in, no patience. We are facing multiple massive crises simultaneously. But it is not because people became entitled. The whole country, starting with its politicians, their policies, ethics (pushing boats back?) is not working. Why would anyone be polite, patient, not self-serving, when none of these qualities seem to be evident in the ruling party and its policies, and what they made of our society?

[microbius]

in short, my answer is; this is political not personal

[Freedomfighters]

@microbius

The fish rots from the head. Look at the leaders we have had in the last ten years. Self-entitled twats, absolutely immoral, antagonising and splitting society and building their success on how much hatred they could stir. Johnson built his success on driving more division re:Brexit. Truss says I will govern as a conservative, not I will unite the nation. I am very despirited, yes. There seems to be no common moral ground, no project one can believe in, no patience. We are facing multiple massive crises simultaneously. But it is not because people became entitled. The whole country, starting with its politicians, their policies, ethics (pushing boats back?) is not working. Why would anyone be polite, patient, not self-serving, when none of these qualities seem to be evident in the ruling party and its policies, and what they made of our society?

The rot set in with Tony Blair.

[antelopevalley]

The rot actually set in with Margaret Thatcher. That was the decade of greed is good.

[Freedomfighters]

@antelopevalley

The rot actually set in with Margaret Thatcher. That was the decade of greed is good.

Well we're all entitled to a different opinion on that.

[Seymour5]

@ComtesseDeSpair

When was this time? If you’re referring to a time before you were alive, how do you know?

It was certainly during my lifetime from the early fifties. There was lots that wasn’t right, women are thankfully now far more equal, and society has moved forward hugely in our acceptance of minority groups. However, basic standards of consideration for others has gone backwards. Just ask some of the very elderly.

[Bankcockbabe]

I think since Lockdown1 - there is a huge insurgence in assholeishness.

People being rude, and condescending for any reason - and this transcends all barriers of society. It is all classes, and creeds of people

I work in a phone based customer service role for an upmarket brand, and nowdays a bigger amount of people are entitled/blamey/rude/patronising/shouty. More than happy to help people deal with a problem, normally of their own stupid making, however I will not take attitude

They get put on a long hold, then disconnected. It is called the 'asshole line'...and were people like that belong, after a good period on hold - they either ring back all sheepish, or even angrier, so they go for round two. As our manager says - we don't get paid enough to deal with this scurge.

This is a big brand in the UK too, so beware when you are giving it big guns to customer service staff on the blower

It is very common in call centres, so prepare for a long hold and to be cut off when you are taking your issue out on the wrong person - S'all I am saying haha

[Xenia]

What can I give, not what can I take is always a good starting point. There have been some changes. Some very old people think it is a matter of shame to claim benefits for example. That view point is much less common today. however lots of people day in day out are fundamentally good.

[Bankcockbabe]

OH and victim blaming is HUGE
Get abused - somehow you must have brought that on yourself

It is like people are too scared to see the world for the monsterous place it is, and like to make excuses for it, and blame the victim

[pointythings]

The issue of friends with different opinions is one of the difficult ones imo. I have friends across a spectrum of beliefs, politics and ethical positions. We accept our disagreements because we like each other and have more in common than divides us.

But I couldn't be friends with someone who believes gay sex or abortion should be illegal, I couldn't be friends with someone who is racist or xenophobic. I have ended a friendship over the latter because the person in question said some horrifically xenophobic things about EU immigrants, knowing full well that I am one of those. 'Oh but I don't mean you' doesn't cut it in that situation. Some people just don't show their true colours until you've known them for a while and it's perfectly OK to walk away. As long as you do it politely.

[Konfetka]

@Freedomfighters "Cultural Christian", I like that, thank you. My upbringing was rabidly fanatically hell and brimstone -type Christian, but I've not thrown the baby out with the bath water.

@pointythings Christianity is exceptional in its teachings:
Turn the other cheek
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you
Love is patient, love is kind...

[Shortandfurry301]

I am probably going to get flamed for saying this but I think we are so invested - for the best of reasons - in making sure that our children are self confident, happy, fulfilled etc that we are not bringing them up to think of others enough and of their place in the world in relation to others. It's all about them! And I don't think that this is doing them any good tbh. We have quite an individualistic society in modern day Britain and I think other European countries, which take more of a collective approach to child rearing, have happier children.

[Bankcockbabe]

And people are willing to stamp each other to death over a difference of opinion or the SMALLEST (apparent) slight these days

I mean online bullying is disgusting and look at what has happened with JK Rowling (despite the haters giving her an idea for her next book) - it just goes to show

Society has actually gone backwards as people appear more intolerant

[Bankcockbabe]

I this board is a perfect example of intolerance.

People will happily kick to death, a person who is asking for help - but then claim to be part of the 'tolerant left'

[Luredbyapomegranate]

It’s a very fractious time - 2 years of lockdown, recession coming, brexit, war in Ukraine, global destabilisation, climate crisis, a collapsing NHS and welfare state, a battered education system, an ever widening gap between rich and poor, impossible property prices, untrustworthy politics, no opposition.. and now the queen is dead

All of this grinds people down and makes them angry, afraid and mean spirited. It feels like post war relative peace and prosperity we’ve got used to might be a thing of the past.

So it’s no wonder really

[Luredbyapomegranate]

Oh yeah, and the polarisation of social media discourse, and the pressure of life lived online..

[VanillaImpulse]

Yes I agree and the food bank thread definitely showed how entitled people are becoming and that excuses are made for it

[pointythings]

@Konfetka I am as atheist as anything and those are tenets I also live by. Not because they are Christian tenets but because they make sense.

I don't actually have an issue with Christianity as a faith, just with many of its practitioners who seem to have that plank in their eye so that they don't realise they're not very good at it.

[SummerWinterSummerWinter]

@pointythings

The issue of friends with different opinions is one of the difficult ones imo. I have friends across a spectrum of beliefs, politics and ethical positions. We accept our disagreements because we like each other and have more in common than divides us.

But I couldn't be friends with someone who believes gay sex or abortion should be illegal, I couldn't be friends with someone who is racist or xenophobic. I have ended a friendship over the latter because the person in question said some horrifically xenophobic things about EU immigrants, knowing full well that I am one of those. 'Oh but I don't mean you' doesn't cut it in that situation. Some people just don't show their true colours until you've known them for a while and it's perfectly OK to walk away. As long as you do it politely.

That's a good point - I guess maybe the line is where the views are actively harmful? But then I guess different people have differing views about where that line lies. Tricky!

[timeofillusion]

@DoingJustFine

Honestly - and I know this will light the touch-paper - I think things went wrong when families stopped going to church. Church services are built around showing compassion for others' suffering, trying to be a kind and helpful person, and giving thanks for everything you've got.

When I was attending church regularly I definitely spent more time trying to be a decent person. Since I've stopped going I've reverted to my basic, selfish self. 😂

I do attend church regularly and I try to be a better person (apart from when posting on Mumsnet - it really does bring out my worst side) but our clergy are the most selfish people I know. I wonder sometimes if they've ever read the Bible. They put themselves first all the time, it's all me, me, me without any consideration for others (or for God which appals me) so I'm not surprised that fewer people are going to traditional church services and I think that does impact on society because it should be the one place where good values are taught and stressed.