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Original poster

To be surprised if Camilla wears the Kohinoor Diamond…

86 replies

KohinoorDiamond · 09/09/2022 13:33

The media is speculating if Camilla will wear the Kohinoor diamond as King Charles III’s Queen Consort during the coronation. What do you think?

It is said that the Kohinoor carries a powerful curse, ‘only God or a Woman can wear with impunity’. Ever since the Kohinoor came to Britain, the diamond has only been given to a woman in the royal family (either the Queen, the Queen Consort or the Queen Mother).

’Kohinoor’ was trending on social media soon after the sad news of the Queen of England’s passing. Koh-I-Noor: Why crown jewel is trending in India following Queen Elizabeth II’s death.

The Queen Mother was last to wear the Kohinoor on her crown. Back when she was given the Kohinoor, in 1936, the jewel symbolised her being the British Empress consort of India, because India was the jewel in the British Empire’s crown. She was the last to hold the title, since India gained its independence in 1947 and became a republic. So, a British royal wearing the diamond now in 2022 makes less sense given the title that used to go with the gem no longer exists (but the controversy around the Kohinoor definitely does exist).

Camilla wearing the Kohinoor might send the wrong message to nations claiming the gem and also show an insensitivity to the Kohinoor’s troubling history. The Kohinoor is a diplomatic gem, as well as a crown jewel.

Camilla could wear the Kohinoor, but I’d be surprised if she does given the baggage. Thoughts?

OP posts:
LoveLarry · 09/09/2022 15:49

MarshaMelrose · 09/09/2022 15:39

It's the little Englander syndrome.

To be honest, I don't think it's little Englander because most english people call themselves British. I think its more a hangover of school history and tv programmes, which concentrate mainly on events that took place before the union. So we're sort of used to saying King of England rather than King of Britain.

You might be, I'm not

But then I'm not English Smile

Softplayhooray · 09/09/2022 15:52

What have I just read? Crazy stories about old diamonds from India...that diamond should not be sitting on an old woman's head, it should be sold to help people with energy bills!

TwoLeftSocksWithHoles · 09/09/2022 15:58

I would hazard a guess that if you rub the Kohinoor Diamond three times and then spit on your hand the curse is lifted for you, I think.

Original poster
KohinoorDiamond · 09/09/2022 16:12

Softplayhooray · 09/09/2022 15:52

What have I just read? Crazy stories about old diamonds from India...that diamond should not be sitting on an old woman's head, it should be sold to help people with energy bills!

To be fair, Kohinoor would fetch a lot at auction, but there are 4 other countries claiming they own the diamond (and it was stolen from them). So, if it was up for auction then those countries would claim it wasn’t for us to sell.

OP posts:
Original poster
KohinoorDiamond · 09/09/2022 16:14

TwoLeftSocksWithHoles · 09/09/2022 15:58

I would hazard a guess that if you rub the Kohinoor Diamond three times and then spit on your hand the curse is lifted for you, I think.

Ha!

OP posts:
BloodyHellKen · 09/09/2022 16:19

@KohinoorDiamond I'm not familiar with the Kohinoor diamond and have little interest in it TBH. I assume most people feel the same. If Camilla wants to wear it why not.

I hope this non-issue doesn't become another stick to beat Camilla with.

Hopeforall · 09/09/2022 16:23

MarshaMelrose · 09/09/2022 13:39

Camilla doesn't the type who's that bothered by trappings but Charles did love his grandmother so maybe he'd like her to wear his grandmother's crown. Who knows?

Op do you normally post under the name antelopevalley

Original poster
KohinoorDiamond · 09/09/2022 16:41

BloodyHellKen · 09/09/2022 16:19

@KohinoorDiamond I'm not familiar with the Kohinoor diamond and have little interest in it TBH. I assume most people feel the same. If Camilla wants to wear it why not.

I hope this non-issue doesn't become another stick to beat Camilla with.

The controversy around the Kohinoor diamond dates back to Queen Victoria.

Some of us might have little interest. But other nations that we need on side, such as India, do care because of its symbolic value to them and their histories.

The diamond is a live diplomatic matter as indicated by how ‘Kohinoor’ was trending on Indian social media so soon after the announcement yesterday.

How Camilla responds will be interesting. She may have the perfect solution to the Kohinoor controversy. Waiting to see what happens next…

OP posts:
MarshaMelrose · 09/09/2022 16:47

LoveLarry · 09/09/2022 15:49

You might be, I'm not

But then I'm not English Smile

Show quote history

But you were commenting on someone saying Queen of England. So I was explaining from the point of being English why an English person might say that. Just as a Scottish person refers to historic kings as King of Scotland. Etc. I wasn't insulting you.

Pfft, MN is such hard work.

LoveLarry · 09/09/2022 16:53

MarshaMelrose

You don't need to explain anything to me, thanks all the same

bellac11 · 09/09/2022 16:57

BecauseICan22 · 09/09/2022 13:38

It should be back in India where it belongs. The Raj is a shameful but true part of history and what was relevant than in terms of why and how this diamond was given is not relevant today.

We have just celebrated 75 years of Indian independence this August gone. I'm UK born but my parents are both from India and both recall partition well. I have dual heritage and see it from both sides.

And where do you think it was before India had it?

I think people lack information about the disputes of ownership about things like this, it was stolen, stolen, stolen, stolen and stolen again.

Rightfully it should go to the descendants of the bloke that originally plucked it from the rocks, no?

MorrisZapp · 09/09/2022 16:59

Well you've got that wrong. Everybody knows the Koh Ih Noor is a restaurant in Glasgow.

bellac11 · 09/09/2022 16:59

motherstongue · 09/09/2022 15:22

Sorry to be a pedant but it really boils my urine when The Queen is offhandedly called “The Queen of ENGLAND”. She was not “The Queen of ENGLAND” she was “Elizabeth II, by the Grace of God, of the United Kingdom of GREAT BRITAIN and NORTHERN IRELAND and of Her other Realms and Territories Queen, Head of the Commonwealth, Defender of the Faith.”
I FEEL MUCH BETTER NOW, Sorry to derail

She wasnt Elizabeth II of Scotland though, she was Elizabeth the first.

ProfessorLayton1 · 09/09/2022 17:07

Good old excuse regarding who does the diamond belongs to?
One thing for sure, it does not belong to this country.
The claiming countries may sell it in auction and split the money.
They may decide to keep the diamond on rotation.
Give it back..

MarshaMelrose · 09/09/2022 17:17

I don't know who it belongs to but according to the Solicitir General of India, it doesn't belong to them.

(In 2016) The Solicitor General of India had made the announcement before the Supreme Court of India due to public interest litigation by a campaign group.[71] He said "It was given voluntarily by Ranjit Singh to the British as compensation for help in the Sikh Wars. The Koh-i-Noor is not a stolen object."

Original poster
KohinoorDiamond · 09/09/2022 17:24

bellac11 · 09/09/2022 16:57

And where do you think it was before India had it?

I think people lack information about the disputes of ownership about things like this, it was stolen, stolen, stolen, stolen and stolen again.

Rightfully it should go to the descendants of the bloke that originally plucked it from the rocks, no?

Show quote history

A stolen gem has no place on the crown because the crown is supposed to represent justice and fairness.

For Camilla to wear the kohinoor at the coronation risks overshadowing the coronation itself, especially in nations like India (who we need on side).

OP posts:
IdiotCreatures · 09/09/2022 17:26

Sell it and split the proceeds between the claimants.
Done
Problem solved.
Diplomacy achieved.
I feel a career change coming on.

ProfessorLayton1 · 09/09/2022 17:32

MarshaMelrose · 09/09/2022 17:17

I don't know who it belongs to but according to the Solicitir General of India, it doesn't belong to them.

(In 2016) The Solicitor General of India had made the announcement before the Supreme Court of India due to public interest litigation by a campaign group.[71] He said "It was given voluntarily by Ranjit Singh to the British as compensation for help in the Sikh Wars. The Koh-i-Noor is not a stolen object."

Treaty between a 11 year old child without his queen mother and Lord Dalhousie?

Original poster
KohinoorDiamond · 09/09/2022 17:37

MarshaMelrose · 09/09/2022 17:17

I don't know who it belongs to but according to the Solicitir General of India, it doesn't belong to them.

(In 2016) The Solicitor General of India had made the announcement before the Supreme Court of India due to public interest litigation by a campaign group.[71] He said "It was given voluntarily by Ranjit Singh to the British as compensation for help in the Sikh Wars. The Koh-i-Noor is not a stolen object."

Yeah, that 2016 Indian Solicitor General who said that made an absolute fool of himself because Ranjit Singh had been dead for 10 years when the diamond was taken from his young son in 1849.

“It was also wildly inaccurate. Maharajah Ranjit Singh, who once wore the uncut Koh-i-Noor on his bicep, died in 1839. Almost a decade later, the Koh-i-Noor was taken by the British, by force, from a frightened little boy, his son.” - Read the whole article.

Of course, everyone who wants to make a case to keep the kohinoor cite the wildly inaccurate statement by the the 2016 Indian solicitor general.

Modi Govt's Statement On India Giving The Kohinoor To The British Is 'Strikingly Unhistoric', Says William Dalrymple

There’s a very accessible history book about this. “Kohinoor: The History of the World’s Most Infamous Diamond” by William Dalrymple and Anita Anand.

OP posts:
KassandraOfSparta · 09/09/2022 17:39

MarshaMelrose · 09/09/2022 13:39

Camilla doesn't the type who's that bothered by trappings but Charles did love his grandmother so maybe he'd like her to wear his grandmother's crown. Who knows?

She also doesn't seem the type to pay any attention to a "curse".

Toddlerteaplease · 09/09/2022 17:41

I think she'll wear the Queen mothers crown.

MarshaMelrose · 09/09/2022 17:42

ProfessorLayton1 · 09/09/2022 17:32

Treaty between a 11 year old child without his queen mother and Lord Dalhousie?

Show quote history

I don't know all the ins and outs of what happened in 1849, although you might. Wouldn't the Solicitor General have taken all the facts into his judgement? He did after all read all the papers given him by the campaign groups so would seem to have more background knowledge than you and I.

Original poster
KohinoorDiamond · 09/09/2022 17:42

KassandraOfSparta · 09/09/2022 17:39

She also doesn't seem the type to pay any attention to a "curse".

Show quote history

Love your name. Reminds me of Kassandra of Troy (no one beloved her ‘curse’ either. That worked out well…).

OP posts:
MarshaMelrose · 09/09/2022 17:43

There’s a very accessible history book about this. “Kohinoor: The History of the World’s Most Infamous Diamond” by William Dalrymple and Anita Anand.

Yeah, I'm not reading that. It's just not that interesting.

MarshaMelrose · 09/09/2022 17:45

KohinoorDiamond · 09/09/2022 17:42

Love your name. Reminds me of Kassandra of Troy (no one beloved her ‘curse’ either. That worked out well…).

Show quote history

But the curse isn't on women, is it? It's just on men. Or is that something else I got wrong?

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