Things have changed so much , so quickly?!

[doodlywoodlydingdong]

I just had my grown up kids around for dinner, not unusual but it got me thinking how much things have changed in the last 3 years. We are a very typical family. I'm 45 , 4 kids aged 13-25. Between me and my DH we have an income of around £34k but very soon it's going to drop by £4k annually.

Three years ago I would go food shopping and buy pretty much whatever I wanted. If I fancied it, it went into the trolley. Full English breakfast every Saturday, big fat roast dinner with a nice joint every Sunday. Two v cheap foreign holidays a year. I enjoyed making our money stretch as far as it possibly could with holiday bargains etc. Christmas was always glorious with loads of food and some nice gifts. Lots of entertaining. fast forward 3 years.

Today I was stood in the kitchen picking the meat off 6 chicken thighs to feed seven adults and a baby. The roast dinner was totally packed out with veg and spuds. Barely any chicken compared to what I would have served 3-4 years ago. I can't stretch to a joint of pork anymore, a whole chicken is a rare treat. So thighs it is. My kids are eating more and more pasta /noodles based dishes with hot dogs as protein. I have to think twice about what is the most efficient method to cook whatever meal it is to save money on the electric. My dogs are now on the cheapest possible kibble I can find. I was actually relieved when my lovely old cat suddenly died (?!) as I wouldn't have to find the extra money for vets fees as she was knocking on a bit. Thats now £ 18 a month I'm saving on litter and food and I feel like a monster for even typing that.

I use the l local food waste project wherever I can, save every penny I can, but ultimately I'm going to have to give up my mobility car as the money would be much better in my pocket . The trade off is that I will then be house bound and that "freed up " money will be going straight to EON from October .

AIBU to have a feeling of almost grief over all of this? It's been very slow and gradual trickling of price increases etc but suddenly it's taken 6 chicken thighs to push me over the edge and be ridiculously angry and upset about how our money can purchase so much less these days?

OP, I realise that you have had issues to deal with in your life which have not been easy, but...

The lifestyle you describe is one my family (both working full time in the public sector) have never had. We've had literally 4 holidays abroad (a week each) over the last 20 years, always self-catering and simple. Luckily we love UK holidays and I'm not complaining about that. But I think you may have a very skewed idea of what's normal for most people! I nearly always buy cheaper cuts of meat and we have several meat-free days. Eating out is a real rarity.

I'm NOT complaining about my lot - it's fine, and I'm lucky compared to many people. But I think you have lived a privileged life and probably don't realise it!

@LuluBlakey1 Bravo!! Exactly right. We actually did the emigration bit but have come back from Copenhagen after 30 months due to business and family reasons- elderly parent not well etc- difference is chalk and cheese. It has become a hugely overpriced depressing dump in vast swathes of the UK and areas that are still reasonably nice are hugely overpriced due to those that actually have money tending to converge in the same spots not suprisingly

Oh my! I want our rent to be £97 a week 😑 Ours is £1,100 a month 😬

Tabbouleh · Yesterday 19:46
I know no one wants to hear this right now. But as someone not born British, I think British people are going to have to learn to live like the rest of the world.
Less meat
Fewer foreign hols
Fewer pets
Smaller houses
No buying whatever you want

Tabbouleh - I totally agree. I'm amazed at what people seem to think is normal.

I would argue against the OP's point and say - things changed dramatically from the 80s onward. Consumerism and mass tourism has gone bonkers since then, and I guess people who are under 40 are unaware of what life was like then - and it was absolutely fine! Air travel was a special treat (which is needs to be again) and people didn't feel they had to have 'Instagram-worthy' kitchens or every flipping gadget/amenity in their gardens.

It may not be a bad thing if we curb our bonkers obsession with flying around the world several times a year, having meat at every meal and following every passing trend for home decor and fashion.

I'm tired of hearing how voting Labour would solve everything. I suspect this is spouted by those who know nothing about economics.

We have massive inflation for reasons nothing to do with any UK government.

Higher energy prices are one of the main reasons why the rate of inflation is so high. Russia’s invasion of Ukraine has led to more large increases in the price of gas. Since May, the price of gas has doubled. We think those price rises will push inflation even higher over the next few months, to around 13%.

Higher prices for the goods we buy from abroad have also played a big role.

During the Covid pandemic people started to buy more goods. But the people selling these have had problems getting enough of them to sell to customers. That led to higher prices – particularly for goods imported from abroad.

There is also pressure on prices from developments in the UK.
Businesses are charging more for their products because of the higher costs they face. There are more job vacancies than there are people to fill them, as fewer people are seeking work following the pandemic. That means that employers are having to offer higher wages to attract job applicants. And prices for many services have gone up.

Inflation is at the same rate as it was when I was buying my first house, and that was a struggle, as high inflation doesn't help borrowers.

The UK has been spoiled by years in which crashing oil prices flattered the inflation figures. Some bounceback was always likely in late 2017, and the upward trend has been exacerbated by the decision of the Opec cartel to cut production.

Voting Labour won't fix global issues like this ^^ and it is disingenous to suggest it can.

I don't believe Labour have the answers either ,
Maybe it's time for government to work together a bit more for the good of people
Not holding my breath.

You are misinformed. Inflation is caused by the government putting more money into circulation. It's mainly a result of measures taken due to covid. Oil prices have a minor effect only. Massive inflation is therefore almost entirely due to the actions of the Tory government.

The solution is for the government to spend money to get the economy going, preferably by investing in useful things such as infrastructure, housing etc. Tax cuts can only have a small effect and don't benefit the poor as much as the rich. Most poor people pay very little tax anyway.

After the war the NHS was invented and huge house building programmes . That was a labour government. That is what we need now, not more austerity and tax cuts for the rich.

There is no monopoly on understanding economics, there are people on both left and right who do, and people on both left and right who don't.

Johnson for example does not understand economics - that is why he dismissed concerns about inflation when everyone could see it coming. Truss does not understand economics - that is why she is talking rollocks about being 'positive' as a tool to avert recession. In my view Corbyn did not understand economics.

I think both Starmer and Osborne do/did understand economics.

So then the choice is after you have understood it, what do you want to do about it.

We are not corks bobbing in the economic sea, we are ships with some directional options. Yes if the storm gets too strong many ships sink but having a well-maintained ship, a decent captain, a plan and a trained crew make all the difference.

I would prefer a Labour approach to the economy because I am a social democrat and my political preference is to build a strong society that way.

Too many people confuse economics with politics. I accept economic realities and am not in favour by Tory political choices.

I agree that before the 1980s we did not have the level of consumerism which we have now. Things improved in the 80s and I think people thought it would always be like that from now on. But maybe the last 30/35 years have been a blip and we are now resetting back to a more sustainable level. Obviously I'm not happy about that and would prefer living like we've done for the past few decades. But maybe the party is over.

I remember the 70s. My parents both worked as teachers (my dad head of dept) so we should have had a nice, comfortable life style. Houses were the only thing which were cheaper. Mum definitely worried about the price of food in the shops, could only run one car, dad had to use a moped to get to work. We made our own yoghurts as bought yoghurts were considered a luxury too far. No foreign holidays until we had a 3 day bus trip to Paris when I was 11yo. My dad saved for a VCR which was the equivalent of a month's wages. No take aways apart from chippy, no Starbucks, rarely had a meal out, my mum made our clothes. Hand me down everythings and few toys. I think this may be our new normal for the next few years.

Right now, the way I see it at least, is that the key difference between the left and the right is that the left appear to have a serious politician as their leader and the right appear to want idiots in charge. Regardless of your leanings, Johnson and his cabinet have been jokes - and not very funny ones, at that.

If the right had credible leadership in the cabinet then it's fiscal philosophy may hold more weight. But instead we have "phone your GP for money off your bills" Truss as the front runner.

@SnackSizeRaisin You are misinformed.

Really?
The information I flagged up was gleaned from the Guardian and the Bank of England.

It is a complex issue.

The implication of the ‘money printing’ story is usually that when governments and central banks create more money, they are simply throwing newly printed notes into the economy. But the reality of how QE* works is rather different. Firstly, there’s the minor point that QE doesn’t involve the central bank printing any new notes, but rather the creation of central bank reserves (the money that commercial banks hold in their accounts at the central bank).

*Quantitative Easing

Secondly, and more importantly, there is the fact that these central bank reserves are not handed out for free, but are exchanged in return for government bonds. These bonds are extremely ‘money like’, in that they are highly liquid and can be easily exchanged for money. In essence, this means the central bank is simply swapping one form of public debt (or ‘money’) for another, which in itself creates no new purchasing power overall. The difference between these two forms of public debt collapses when interest rates are low, as they have been over the past decade. What is happening is essentially the state deciding to have more of its debt held in the form of central bank reserves rather than bonds. And this isn’t the state imposing its will on the private sector; those holding government bonds have volunteered to exchange them for ’cash’.

This is not to say that QE has no impact. The main way QE affects the economy is through the ‘portfolio rebalancing’ channel. The central bank typically buys bonds from institutional investors like pension funds who, rather than spending the money they’ve received, will look to invest it elsewhere. This increases demand for other assets like housing, and has fuelled inflated house prices, but it has little impact on the consumer price inflation that politicians are more worried about. Eventually some of this money may trickle down into the real economy, but to blame inflation on this process specifically is blind to the more obvious causes of inflation, such as supply shocks and surging energy prices.

Maybe now you are as 'misinformed' as I am ? (Sarcasm)

Price rises have many causes. Issuing more currency units is one cause.
If there were crop failures, the price of food would increase. Is that inflation? Technically, no.

Energy prices were rising months before Russia's special military operation in Ukraine so there are clearly other factors, but what has really kicked them into overdrive is the sanctions the US and EU have imposed. The war itself has not increased energy prices.

Covid did not affect prices. Governmental responses (i.e. lockdown, splashing cash etc) to covid is what caused the majority of disruption.

I feel for you OP.

the blame largely lies with this useless government and those who voted them in.

Energy prices were rising months before Russia's special military operation in Ukraine so there are clearly other factors, but what has really kicked them into overdrive is the sanctions the US and EU have imposed. The war itself has not increased energy prices.

Yup. In fact, I suspect the war alone would have dropped prices - as Russia spent money on war it would have upped gas/oil supplies to replace that money and thus the prices would have dropped down.

But the sanctions have prevented that, so that Russia will not increase production of a product that sanctions prevent it being paid for as it wishes.

None of which means I think we shouldn't have imposed sanctions. The world feels so complex that I'd hate to unpick the truth from the propoganda of both sides. All I know for sure is that war, however it comes, is always rich men sending poor men to die for them.

Anyway, I think the op has described perfectly what other people said about the “working poor” and why people get so angry. There would be millions who would love a 5 bed for that cost. The issue is that take home is the equivalent of a 45k salary. That would make you very comfortable indeed paying for a token rent and getting all the top ups. The problem comes when the children start to leave and all the top-ups start to go. Whilst the children are at home that’s a very comfortable life indeed.

There are working families who don’t clear that a month and can’t afford half of what the op states - that is the issue.

I have no skin in the game and it’s not jealousy, wouldn’t want to rely on the state in a month of Sundays. I have a good income and everything else before the jealousy card is wheeled out. I can see why the “squeezed middle” and those who earn just above the cut off are getting very, very angry in society. Pay lots in, get nothing out and can’t even afford the most basic of luxuries let alone foreign holidays.

I do wonder if the £10 a day thread might be good for you OP. Not vast amounts of cash but I do surveys etc. and make enough over the year to pay for Christmas. If it’s less than 1k a year you don’t need to tell Hmrc/ register as self employed.

Eh?

The depressing message for me on this thread is that most of you are more upset that a disabled woman with a spouse who works 50 hours a week was having an ok life previously.
‘Well we could never afford Sunday roasts so why should you?’
This is the mentality which will destroy us all. There are people like Rishi Sunak etc living in this country with unimaginable wealth. They are the ones making everything harder but you guys are punching down instead of up.
There is enough money for everyone to have a decent life if it was shared more equally.
Stop voting out of hatred for others, terrified if they have a few crumbs more than you. Start voting out of compassion, believing that everyone deserves a decent quality of life. Then we’ll all be happier and better off.

This.

OP states that she is about to lose £4,000 per year when her third dc leaves for uni. Presumably, she has previously lost £4,000 per year each time her two older dc got too old for her to claim for them so is already £8,000 per year down. That would cause a huge impact on most people’s lifestyle.

There is enough money for everyone to have a decent life if it was shared more equally

There always has been, but its never happened and its never going to happen. So maybe stop dreaming about a communist utopia and deal with the real world.
And the reality is that OP had a lifestyle most of the world coutld only dream of, and now she's feeling the pinch a little, and has to get on with it, same as everyone else.

Cousmrism and expectations have sky rocketed in that last 30/40 years. I grew up in the 70s/80s and there were no foreign holidays, takeaways, daily coffees, new cars, clothes, latest gadgets you name there was none of what is expected today. Life was very different then and people worked hard to get by. There was also not the level of benefits that are available today. No easy answer but people need to be prepared to work and live within their needs it is as simple as that.

Consumerism

This is exactly how I feel about this thread…

I feel your pain OP. I have lunch this week courtesy of Olio. I'm posting out a treasured item today as I have sold it. I feel so sad but I need the money more than a sentimental item (even though it is beautiful 😢)
And things are only going to get worse.

Hi op. I understand your reasons for not wanting to get a lodger and I am so sorry you went through that. I wonder if you might be able to explore it from a different perspective though - eg a female student, or woman on the understanding that guests would need to be limited? Or, an overseas student who needs a host family? My friend had to move away from home at the age of 16 to study (she was a dancer) and the school housed her with a local family.

Work - I'm sure you are working through the options on other boards. Have you considered something like virtual pa/admin work or proofreading?

You have an MA - could you tutor in anything.

But yanbu to feel like this. The country is a shitshow.