Landlords are hated but

[Parsley1234]

I am a landlord tenants been in situ for over 10 years very happily in a character Victorian terrace rent raises minimum I leave them alone get repairs done in a timely manner however from 2028 I will have to either sell holiday let or leave vacant the property as the modifications are untenable for me. Double glazing adding internal walls to make small rooms smaller etc. We are in a housing crisis this is going to make it worse and for all of you who want to have a go at landlords maybe look at the government housing policy first

I’m a landlord too and repairs and restorations are a PITA but it’s the price you pay for someone else paying towards your nest egg im afraid

Also anecdotally, I previously lived in a old house (mid 1800s) that wasn't listed and had double glazing, tonnes of insulation. It was so damp green mould was sprouting on everything we owned despite having windows open all the time, and constantly felt dank and cold. And that was a C

b.o.o.

h.o.o.

Victorian terraces have to have an additional wall inside to come up to law from 2028

I don't know the details but surely that's just a full replaster on external walls with Kingspan underneath? That won't take much off the size of rooms and while it's expensive you have 6 years to save up.

You may get a big enough increase in energy efficiency just by adding that silver cushioning stuff to your loft insulation. If you do that now you will be saving your tenants a fair bit on energy bills over winter.

Then slowly raise the rent to a fair market rate and use the excess to improve the rest of the insuation as you save up. You'll be done by 2028 and your tenant's money will have directly helped them and the environment.

I think seeing the curtains move in the wind proved the windows were draughty! I also have open fireplaces, so I don't have issues with mould. And it is possible to get sliding, hardwood double glazing.

It is only required to the extent that complying with the EPC doesn't alter any of the listed features and that you are able to get listed building approval for changes.

There is nothing to suggest anywhere that it is going to change any further so the surveyor was probably misinformed.

Older properties with lime render, open fireplaces and little insulation were built that way. They were designed to breathe.

They were badly built, mostly, those northern terraces. No/shallow foundations and single brick walls. Also tend to have problems with the water table because they all have concrete yards and there are generally hundreds in the same area, with the land all concreted over for more than a century. All of that is why they have damp problems.

Those descriptions don't bear even the slightest resemblance to the victorian terraces I am thinking of, and that is half the problem, we can all be talking about completely different types of property. It's a one size fits no one piece of legislation

I do not disagree with you and this is going to cause all sorts of housing hell in an already stretched position.

You are however naive to think that a victorian property cannot be brought up to EPC C. Our property is 1850's so Georgian/Victorian. It is an old farmhouse that had no work done to it before we purchased. We've insulated all internal walls, floor and loft. The windows have been replaced with upvc heritage style and we've fitted an efficient heating system. It has cost us a lot and has taken time, but we are now on par with new build passive houses and have a very efficient and warm property. It just takes time and hard work (we have done it all by hand between the 2 of us)

You don't know that it would be marginal. The impact on the market would depend on how many landlords actually sell. The impact may only be marginal if very few sell but then so will the drop in rental properties and there will be a marginal increase in home owners. There won't be overall fewer properties on the market regardless.

So everyone owning these horrendous old houses should just do nothing and accept no personal responsibility for the damage they're causing to the environment? It's an easy get out but my view is that you should be forced to undertake the work needed to bring them to an acceptable standard within a reasonable time frame, at your own cost.

But a LL also has to redecorate the entire house after the works have taken place (probably new flooring too) and house the tenants while the works are taking place. I have a fund for repairs and always fix things that break asap. However, when the tenants pay £450 a month I'm not making a fortune off them, and will not be able to pass on the thousands that this will cost. Landlords in central London will cover their costs easily: in a midlands town, not so much.

@Eastangular2000 tbh I bought into the whole 'let the building breathe ' shtick until I lived in one. I had neighbours who (fruitlessly as it turned out) spent thousands being all authentic with lime render etc. It made no difference and their houses were still damp. Ime they're just not very good houses. They still cost loads though! Mine sold for £190000 four years ago - the same are going for £250000 now.

I agree. It's a weak argument put forward by those unwilling to invest in their properties.

because your excellent tennants will be able to afford to buy because landlords wont be buying all the properties to let, so the prices will go down

The excellent tenants who are over 60, with poor credit history, and don't actually want to buy? Those tenants?

Stop being so simplistic. Landlords selling just mean that there are less houses to rent and therefore it's harder and more expensive to do so. A lot will turn them into holiday rentals instead so removing them from the market altogether.

Even if everyone sells up and it brings house prices down, it doesn't mean people that wouldn't be eligible for a mortgage currently will suddenly be able to get one and buy somewhere. In fact it could be harder as banks tend to tighten up lending criteria

You don't seem to understand how it works. Buy to let mortgages are not paid off, they are interest only, which means the debt is serviced, nothing else, so is a cost to the business. Tenants are not 'paying off' landlords mortgages in any way shape or form. And any capital gain is subject to cgtax, which seriously depletes any capital gain, plus the cost of buying is subject to additional stamp duty. These are reasons why there are few new investors coming into the market. Unfortunately our incompetent government has not taken into account the results of their legislation, (legislation which was planned not piecemeal) and has not replaced the rental properties that have depleted the market. Good for those of us left at the moment because we have seen in the south east at least, an increase in rents, but this is unsustainable in the long term for tenants.

And those tenants toward the bottom of the market are really struggling to find anywhere. Unfortunately I can't afford to rent to those people. They don't pass my affordability criteria, and don't have enough capital to sustain the rent in the event of an interruption in their income.

The housing market in the SE is utterly fucked, to be honest i think the only solution is a massive building social housing push. There is a horrific lack of council housing in my area meaning that the private rental houses are so in demand its unreal. Especially small, affordable ones.

I own a teeny studio flat. 5 years ago i advertised for a new tenant and i took the advert down after 2 hours as I'd already had 40+ messages expressing interest.

My flat will be nearly impossible to get to a C - things like ground source heatpumps and solar panels are a no go because its a flat, and i don't own the building. It already has double glazing, etc. I can upgrade the heating relatively easily with the tenant in situ but adding floor insulation will be impossible whilst she is living there and has it filled with her furniture.

So that means i either hope she moves out before 2028 (unlikely as shes very settled and now pays under market rent), or i end up giving her notice and once the flat is empty i can do all the various bits of work to try and get it up to the magic C rating.

So what benefit is that to my tenant? She'll have to go through the upheaval of moving, finding a new place, etc in an area where its already super difficult to find anywhere and where rental prices have rocketed.

And what if despite doing all the things recommended i cant get it up to a C? Well, the plan has always been that once dc reaches late teens/early 20s they could live there rent free, just covering bills. So worse case scenario is that flat sits empty (or dh uses it as a wfh office space) for a couple of years till dc want to leave home and move in.

So, in an area where there's already a massive shortage of houses/flats these rules may mean that a flat ends up sitting unused for a few years till my dc grow up.

Its easy to blame landlords, but actually everyone should be screaming at the government for not building enough houses/flats. The only reason rents are so darn high is that demand far outstrips supply.

Acceptable standard for who? As I said the environmental impact of producing and installing 20 UPVC windows is far greater than the impact of not changing the windows, the impact of ripping out a perfectly functional heating system to install a new one which is marginally better consumes a huge amount of initial energy in production. As I said I don't particularly like a double glazed house because I like a cooler environment personally therefore single glazing suits me and I am not ramping up my heating to compensate so why should I have to do something environmentally damaging to meet an arbitrary standard.

There are too many holiday rentals too in some towns and there should be leglisation to control that too as it has a massive impact on house prices.

Even if everyone sells up and it brings house prices down, it doesn't mean people that wouldn't be eligible for a mortgage currently will suddenly be able to get one and buy somewhere. In fact it could be harder as banks tend to tighten up lending criteria

Some people will be able to buy though.

Yes we are talking about different types of houses!

So a property that can't be energy sufficient should be good enough for a home owner but not for a tenant? Why? Surely we are all the same and all want a nicely isolating home to reduce bills. Why are rules different?

It's all well to say all should be to that standard but how many home owners have £10k plus to make them so, in addition to preparing for increase in costs?

Landlords come in all shape and forms. Some will have own in full, be retired and maybe pay no tax or very little on it so that most of the rental income goes in their pockets. For some, it might just pay their retirement saving tax payers funding pension credit etc...

Others might still have a large mortgage to pay in addition to paying 40% of rental income in tax if not 50%.

The reality is that landlords are selling because the business is not profitable at all yet very stressful and risky. It might be good for first time owner but why is it good for them with a poorer EPC but not for the people who were happy there renting and whose life is going to be one very stressful by trying to find somewhere else to live? It's just reading the satisfaction of one group for another.

Only read the first page but woe, alot of hostility.

Op, we have a great landlord and property, in which we have lived for 6 years now.

I very much hope he doesn't have to sell.

Or people who don't necessarily agree that putting UPVC in an 1850s building is investing! It is also different upgrading a property which is pretty much unmodernised like it sounds like your was and having to rip out perfectly good things and replace them just for the sake of a small marginal gain.

My wife & I are landlords too; just the one property as a result of us getting together and both having our own at that time.

We charge a below market rent for our tenants, as they are good tenants and have been living there for a few years now; we also do all maintenance promptly when notified.

However, we too will be selling up before 2028 due to the EPC regulations; our rental property is very nice and in a good state of repair (probably better than our own home to be honest); yet the cost of getting it up to an EPC C grade is estimated to be between £13,400 and £38,270 (official estimate, not my guesstimate). We cannot afford this so will sell the property; where we live available rental properties are scarce and this will lead to one less being available.