AIBU to not understand why we have not done something about Putin?

[Dalint]

I know that it's a nuclear power, but we wouldn't really need to go nuclear? Just take him out?

Is it Putin's war or Russia's war?

Why have we not assassinated him?

Most governments in the world including the super powers.

there is eleven candidates who could take over,one of them is as bad as putin,the other ten are hard core brutal brutal men. old school kgb brought up the hard way.

they don’t look at now, they need to look at what happens when they do it, and the threat to world peace is worse if one of these men take it.

take some time to read about it op. Mumsnet is not the place for research

Here's someone else shot and killed by his own people
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Collins_(Irish_leader)

You need to know where to look as we are fed propaganda.

Yeah, you can't really just go around shooting heads of state you don't like. It causes problems.

Plus, our still current (although clinging on by his grubby little fingertips it's true) PM owes him for his job and the robust London housing market.

Re the nukes, maybe worth remembering that the only country that's used nuclear weapons on civilian populations is the USA. That's the main reason Russia has them at all, just to put the threat level in context.

Give us all the scenarios and realistic retaliatory actions?

From Russia's POV, the West is as much "rogue" as we think they are, so expect Western leaders to be targeted in response.

Aside, do like like Cold War spy novels?

Because it's illegal.

If western governments start to assassinate other world leaders willy nilly, we are as bad as them and it ends in even more conflict.

I am sure there will have been many attempts on Putin's life by private individuals or groups but of course these will not be publicised by Russia.

Hmmm are you some conspiracy theorist.

anyway, you can’t just assassinate putin, you need to look at the repurcussjons of doing so, the potential retaliation of such an act against the West, of who would likely take over, what their policies are, what they may do and assess the risk

right now this is constrained mainly to Ukraine in terms of physical war with economic repercussions much wider, and as bad as this is, it could get muc much worse if one of his brutal generals takes his place.

Saddam wasn't assassinated. He was tried by a tribunal established under Iraqi law and executed after that trial found him guilty.

Hitler killed himself rather than face capture, trial and execution.

Gaddafi's death is disputed at best, but happened during open hostilities and was likely at the hands of Libyans.

There are a few reasons not to do this sort of thing:

First, we cant say we want a rules-based international system, but then break those rules when it suits us. You may as well just throw the whole thing out the window.

Second, Putin is not an island. He still enjoys massive support, though it seems to be reducing thanks to the war. Make him a martyr murdered by the West and then what? His supporters will enjoy a massive mandate and justification to follow in his footsteps. It's really important to remember that there is an honest belief among many Russians that the West wants to destroy Russia, which is why so many Western actions are seen by Russians as a direct threat.

Third, the overall history of Western-driven regime change is hardly a happy one. The West couldn't kill Castro, how do you think it would go against a famously paranoid and well-protected president with significant resources? And what would happen after it failed?

If Putin dies by foul means or even natural death then it also leaves a power vacuum in Russia. God only knows whilst 11 brutal men fight for power.

It is never the individual people who cause the misery (no matter how shitty they are) - is the the environment and circumstances that allow such people to have such power. That's what needs changing: and we cannot change Russia, despite the last 40 years of trying. Plus, you try to do that and watch many of the large and powerful non-democracies come to their defence. 'Just' China and Russia alone is a force that would wipe us out.

We (the West) are not powerful and not the majority. We are a weakening collection of people. Our power is in the past. Democracy is dying - unless something extraordinary happens to shock it back to life.

Also look at what happens in countries where a strong leader has been assassinated or deposed. Iraq is not a success, Libya is a basket case, attempts to get rid of Assad have destroyed Syria.

After Tito died (of natural causes)Yugoslavia ultimately fragmented and the result was genocide.

I agree with a PP what happens after Putin is a bigger worry than what Putin will do next.

The best solution is the one that has been staring Europe in the face for the last 20 years: end reliance on energy produced by regimes who have shown scant interest in a rules-based system. If we'd started rebuilding the nuclear fleet 20 years ago and electrifying heat; if we hadn't gone cold on the cheapest renewables, if Germany and Italy et al hadn't gone all in on Russian gas, if the UK had got real about energy efficiency years ago....

Better to have done it long ago. Still would have been far preferable to do it after the invasion of Crimea as a clear signal of Russia's intent. But still the best thing possible to do now.

I think the phrase we “should do something” is one of the most dangerous going.

Unless you have some idea of what to do, that there are ways in which it is do-able, and - crucially - what happens next and why it’s an improvement, then it’s all just wishing for a unicorn.

And if the answer to “well, what do you think, roughly, should be done and why?” is “I don’t know I’m not an expert”, then maybe it’s just worth pausing and thinking why the “experts” aren’t making moves.

Micheal Collins was killed during a civil war.

1. He was never actually the president or taoiseach so was never a leader of the state though he played a key role in the Irish war of independence.
2. ireland at the time was by no means a superpower and did have any place on the world wide stage. There was no real impact for his death outside of Ireland. It is different with putin because as others have said the next in command are not stable men

Past experience might help you people not poke your nose into other people's business. Hasn't worked out so well has it over the last few hundred years? Remember Iraq? Have you people literally learned nothing?

Who's to say the person who takes over would be any better? They might be worse and they would have to do some sort of show of power after we trespassed on their soil and illegally assassinated their president. Then Russia's allies would have to stand behind them and all of a sudden we're at war with Russia AND China.

Who is to say they would be worse?

I'm always really intrigued by posts like this - who, specifically, do you think should go and do this?

There's a tremendous amount of Russian money in the UK, and the West is heavily reliant on Russia not just on energy but essential elements like helium, argon and neon which are needed in production of technology such as microchips. Pissing off Russia would be utterly disastrous for us.

Putin has close relationships with Western politicians, for example Trump was basically a puppet of Putin.

I'd do it! 😂

Conversely, I think Trump disagreed with our reliance on Russia.

It's pretty self evident that it would be worse.

Either the West murders Putin and someone else from within the current Russian government takes control or we install a puppet leader loyal to the West.

If the former then the replacement is hardly going to be welcoming and open to the region that saw fit to murder their previous leader. If the later you risk civil war between old and new.

In both instances you're not getting easy access to the Russian natural resources we so desperately crave and you risk provoking other leaders such as President Jinping or King Salman, into taking more aggressive stances against the West, creating even more problems.

Because this is the real world and not some crappy action film?

No but seriously, I am genuinely interested.

When you say 'we', who is the 'we' you're thinking of? So, the government sees this thread and is like 'right, she's onto something with this, no more Putin, lovely' ... then what?

The Russians will probably take him out themselves when the time is right for them. They've done it before several times.