Page 8 | To think that very few people can manage £4200 energy bills

Butterflyfluff · 2022-08-09T09:54:39+00:00

https://news.sky.com/story/energy-bills-forecast-to-rise-even-higher-than-previously-thought-12668906 This simply isn’t manageable for the majority of people. Where’s this going to end?

CravenRaven · 09/08/2022 13:28

FourTeaFallOut · 09/08/2022 13:26

Here's the Cornwall Insight forecast for fellow geeks anyone interested.

F8ck me - Q2 2023 is even higher than £4200!

likeminded · 09/08/2022 13:31

RudsyFarmer · 09/08/2022 12:05

I think there's a large swathe of middle England who are going to be the new working poor. We don't get any top.ups or benefits. Are taxed heavily and are also supporting the economy. Once that money is tied up in paying bills recession is going to really bite.

This. Plus we will be taxed even more to pay for everyone who refuses to pay the increase in prices. Middle income already subsidises a huge swathe of the country, at some point they will just give up too.

dreamingbohemian · 09/08/2022 13:31

jcyclops · 09/08/2022 13:22

You want a non-ideological reason.

If we nationalise the energy suppliers, then instead of the experts at Centrica, BP, Shell etc. negotiating for supplies of gas, LNG and oil products with the Americans, Arabs and Russians we will have Johnson, Truss, Sunak, Starmer, Reeves and Rayner and their Sir Humphrey's doing the job! Do you think they could do any better? It would also cost about £300bn to nationalise just the three companies mentioned, and I can't begin to imagine the problems trying to nationalise the Spanish, German and French owned suppliers.

The government was forced to nationalise Bulb in November 2021 after it collapsed and there were no suitable offers to take on the business. This has already cost £1.7 billion leading to an increase in domestic bills for all of us.

Show quote history

Thank you for answering my question!

I'm not entirely convinced by this though, surely it's not the Cabinet negotiating directly, they will hire the people who currently do the negotiating to do the same thing at the new nationalised company.
Also why should I be so pleased with the job the current negotiators are doing if energy bills are going up this much?

France is this year totally nationalising EdF

ClottedCreamAndStrawberries · 09/08/2022 13:32

I think that anyone who can, should go to solar power now. We’ve just got 14 panels and a battery. It’s £265 a month for 5 years and our electricity is now £40pcm, so £305pcm in total. This is a 4 bed house with electricity in the garage. Our justification was, we could either pay the extortionate rates to British Gas or pay it to the solar company and then get free/low cost electricity when the panels are paid off. It genuinely seemed like a no-brainer.

70billionthnamechange · 09/08/2022 13:32

There's also the side from our business point of view. I have to let go of staff as my bills are so high. They then won't be able to afford anything as they won't have a fucking job. I'm livid that I have to do this to people of go bankrupt

tuesdayblues1 · 09/08/2022 13:33

spanishsummers · 09/08/2022 11:10

Also what do they mean by war pushing up prices? They mean that energy is harder to get so the owners of it are overcharging and profiteering, surely? Nothing else explains why British Gas and Shell, for example, are now reporting such humongous and unprecedented profits.

I arrange the energy contracts for my work, a guy from a brokers told me that BP are charging (example prices only) £10 per unit to the wholesalers, but then the wholesales are paying them a further £20 per unit in order to absolutely secure/ringfence their supply. Every other wholesaler is also doing this which means that us/the consumer have to pay sky rocket fees otherwise the energy firms will go bust as they have massively overpaid.

It's absolutely appalling but I don't see where it ends

WinterMusings · 09/08/2022 13:34

StrychnineInTheSandwiches · 09/08/2022 12:03

If there wasn’t a price cap, what do you think would happen? Without a price cap your bills would be even higher - many retail suppliers are actually making a loss as they’re not recovering the costs of buying energy from customers at the mo.

Well it's not much of a 'cap' if they they increase it every three months, is it?

@StrychnineInTheSandwiches

I think you maybe still don't understand??

if they don't increase it, the remaining suppliers will go bust, they can't supply at a loss!

it's the generators making the profit, not the suppliers.

MidnightMeltdown · 09/08/2022 13:34

PeloAddict · 09/08/2022 12:30

Everything has gone up
My food shop is more £60 now than £40
Gas and electric
Petrol

I don't have any more money! My wages haven't increased except for min wage small amount
I physically can't get extra money from my wage because there's nothing to spare

This is the real problem. Wages are far too low for the cost of living, while the likes of Amazon are making outrageous profits. Minimum wage should be at least 30k by now. Many, many people are working for peanuts.

FartOutLoudDay · 09/08/2022 13:35

doodlywoodlydingdong · 09/08/2022 13:14

I live in a 5 bed council house. Only two left at home and one is going to university this year. So I'm hoping that will reduce my bills. Is catch 22 though. My house was adapted for me to sit my disabilities. I can't afford to pay the gas and electric increases. So I definitely can't afford to downsize (removal costs, carpet, decorating etc) . I'm lucky (?!) my mobility scheme lease ends in November so I can hand it back and use the £80ish a week to cover costs. But it means I'll be totally house bound and reliant on online shopping 100% which in turn will cost more than lidl/Aldi/local food project and make it even LESS likely that I can afford to down size in the future. Add in that I'm still on income support and will soon be swapped over to UC and that makes my financial situation even worse.

£486 a month just for ELECTRICITY!! My rent is only £398 🤷🏼‍♀️😲

I was going to post same as above. Many councils incentivise moving out of bigger homes to smaller ones. Have you spoken to your local housing team about them supporting a move? They would ordinarily bite your hand off to get a 5-bed back in circulation.

Rosehugger · 09/08/2022 13:36

Mamamia7962 · 09/08/2022 13:26

Rosehugger - Have you gone on to another fixed rate deal? We were paying £129 a month for gas/electric on a fixed rate deal which finished in April 2022. We are now on the variable rate and it has gone up to £169 a month, so only a £40 difference. With that increase we are £300 in credit. Three adults in a 3 bedroom house.

No, I've never been on a fixed rate. It's based on actual annual consumption for 5 people in 4 bed semi detached house. The fixed rates offered last October were far more than I'm paying now.

WinterMusings · 09/08/2022 13:37

Manekinek0 · 09/08/2022 12:03

The shit will hit the fan this autumn and winter. If we have a cold winter then I dread to think how many people will die. And how many house fires from candles and deaths from carbon monoxide poisoning will we see.

Yes. It's going to cause a lot of other problems. Hopefully there will be campaign explaining the dangers of candles/using outside fire pit type things inside & other dangers. Hopefully schools will get involved in making the children aware of the dangers of such things.

obviously that doesn't help with the actual problem, but will hopefully stop some avoidable house fires etc.

Rosehugger · 09/08/2022 13:37

This is the real problem. Wages are far too low for the cost of living, while the likes of Amazon are making outrageous profits

Amazon are actually better payers than most.

vickibee · 09/08/2022 13:38

The electricity prices need to be unlinked to gas prices. Most electricity is not generated from gas. This would help bring down bills for business and residential customers

Itisasecret · 09/08/2022 13:40

doodlywoodlydingdong · 09/08/2022 13:14

I live in a 5 bed council house. Only two left at home and one is going to university this year. So I'm hoping that will reduce my bills. Is catch 22 though. My house was adapted for me to sit my disabilities. I can't afford to pay the gas and electric increases. So I definitely can't afford to downsize (removal costs, carpet, decorating etc) . I'm lucky (?!) my mobility scheme lease ends in November so I can hand it back and use the £80ish a week to cover costs. But it means I'll be totally house bound and reliant on online shopping 100% which in turn will cost more than lidl/Aldi/local food project and make it even LESS likely that I can afford to down size in the future. Add in that I'm still on income support and will soon be swapped over to UC and that makes my financial situation even worse.

£486 a month just for ELECTRICITY!! My rent is only £398 🤷🏼‍♀️😲

Less than £400 pcm to rent a 5 bed social house which is under occupied. Inadvertently you’ve highlighted the major underlying issue here. Most families would be looking and £2000k for that size house (outside of London). Yet they will “earn too much” for support.

It’s the squeezed middle who are going to be much worse off this winter. Earn just enough to pay extortionate tax, no govt support and an absolute fortune in rent or mortgage.

tuesdayblues1 · 09/08/2022 13:41

Lansonmaid · 09/08/2022 13:12

I think there will be a lot more house fires as people open up disused fireplaces and burn any old stuff in them to keep warm. If you have a fireplace that is. I think we will be using a lot more wood this year.
The energy crisis has been compounded by the country being way too reliant on foreign gas imports, should have replaced our aging nuclear power plants a lot earlier

Show quote history

we have 2 multi stove fires in our 4 bed house. We have a good supply of wood to use up but already I'm thinking of buying smokeless coal to store and burn low during the night. I think we're going to be making far better use of them this/next year than we ever have before.

Branster · 09/08/2022 13:43

Thank you very much @Liebig

PickAChew · 09/08/2022 13:46

ChilliPB · 09/08/2022 11:42

@spanishsummers part of the reason wholesale gas prices have increased is because Putin reduced gas supply to Europe.

What a lot of people don’t understand is that the suppliers - that sell you your energy, aren’t the ones making profit. Lots of them will be making a loss (although a minority are making profits, but their profits are limited by the price cap) and it’s expected more will go bust this year. It’s the producers that are making the billions in profit that grab headlines.

Show quote history

This needs repeating more often @ChilliPB

Particularly when people are talking about the ridiculous mass refusal to pay that is being called for.

RudsyFarmer · 09/08/2022 13:48

I believe EDF will be building a nucleur power station here. That strikes me as a better use of billions than trying to nationalise utility companies.

Rosehugger · 09/08/2022 13:48

Particularly when people are talking about the ridiculous mass refusal to pay that is being called for

The protest has to start somewhere. We can only stop paying to those we actually owe the money to.

Mfsf · 09/08/2022 13:48

Often is not fit for purpose , they are supposed to be the regulating body that liaisons with government and companies but someone at often is probably getting their pockets full of ££££ as they don’t cap it regulate anything .
£4200 will be a low average , o bet the two cost will be 5k and impossible on the long term to list families .

Riapia · 09/08/2022 13:49

When we’re all sat watching tv in a hoodie and wrapped in blankets thinking how much it’s doing for the climate it’s going to give us a warm glow.
The Greens will be beaming from ear to ear.

nellytheelephant1980 · 09/08/2022 13:50

We are both professionals, DH a teacher and I'm an OT.
Our energy bill is predicted to be £615 a month in January. I feel sick. How is this even a thing?

SleeplessInEngland · 09/08/2022 13:50

Riapia · 09/08/2022 13:49

When we’re all sat watching tv in a hoodie and wrapped in blankets thinking how much it’s doing for the climate it’s going to give us a warm glow.
The Greens will be beaming from ear to ear.

Pipe down, the grown-ups are talking.

FatOaf · 09/08/2022 13:52

I wonder what would happen to prices if the man in the east took up sky diving without a parachute?

There would most likely be a civil war as competing leaders/groups sought to replace him. Last time that happened in Russia, about 10 million people died (mostly of starvation), and I don't think it would do anything to improve the reliability of gas supplies to western Europe. But, given that experience in Iraq and Libya has taught western leaders precisely nothing, it's probably something they're trying to engineer.

dreamingbohemian · 09/08/2022 13:53

ChilliPB · 09/08/2022 13:19

@Anotherusernamethisweek

think what isn’t commonly understood is there are producers and suppliers. The producers are making lots of money - they extract the energy and sell it to suppliers - currently at extremely high rates. The suppliers - the companies that supply energy to your home - are not (many making losses, many more might go bust this year).

The government could put higher taxes on producers and use this to help out customers, for example. But a lot of people are angry at suppliers, or at ofgem, and the problem is actually with producers and the wholesale market.

What do you think would be the best thing to do then?

I mean something has to be done. What is the solution?