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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To call social services on dsis

88 replies

Throwaway6 · 02/08/2022 09:26

I'm going to have to change alot of details so this isn't outing.

Dsis is nearing on 40 along with her partner (not married). Dsis owns the house they live in. We as a family have never liked Dsis partner. I have never got a good feeling about him, he is the human embodiment of man child. He would never look after his own children when he was home, he would be plugged into some sort of device or gaming system. He hardly if ever contributes money wise to the bills whilst my Dsis would slave away with 3 jobs to keep everything going. Whenever we bring this up with Dsis she would always claim otherwise and defend him, why I don't know.

Anywas Dsis has had an alcohol problem for a while now and it's only getting worse. She is going out every weekend and bringing her drinking friends back to her house which I'm sure wakes the kids. She has become high disfunctional. Her house is a mess and is unclean. She says she has no money to do things but she manages to always has money to fund her nights out. The kids (last time I checked) sleep on really old Pillows with no bedding or covers. Dsis priorities are completely all over the place and self serving. If ever me or dm would try to get her to see reason about her drinking she goes into denial or shut down mode and says that she only drinks "once a week or only has a couple". It's gotten so bad that we are pretty sure she has been drunk at 12pm before. We also had to go around hers once when one of her 3 children called (dc must of been only 7 at the time) because she had collapsed on the floor from server alcohol poisoning. Me and dm rushed to her house to attend to her and dc. Dm refused to call an ambulance even though she clearly needed one. It was obvious why she didn't want services involved. This was a couple of years ago now. I know she isn't that bad at the moment and still gets up to her jobs but there is no saying when that may happen again.

But the worst thing of it all is Dsis and her partner argue all the time. Dsis can't stand him and allows him to sleep in her room whilst she sleeps in one of the kids rooms. Her children are 5 7 and 11. They aren't stupid and they know something is up. Dsis has been going off at nights and seeing other men which she has happily announced to us all. It all came to head when her partner suspected it and they had a nasty argument at 4 in the morning which woke the kids. Dsis has now said she has told her partner they are "over" but they do this all the time. Nothing has changed and he is still living there. I'm so so worried about the effects and damage this is all having on the children. SS where called on them once before for having a public display. Dm is reluctant to call SS again because of this. She is worried that the kids will be taken away. It's infuriating because I feel like all my family just Bury their heads in the sand about Dsis and the kids. I feel like dm is more worried about protecting Dsis rather than worrying about what is best for the children. No one is putting them first and god knows what goes on before closed doors. I know they have had physical fights and the children have said that they have witnessed daddy push mummy. I can't just sit by and do nothing. I've grown up with a messed up toxic childhood myself and I know how permanently damaging it is.

Dm said she will talk to Dsis again but I know she won't hear it and nothing will come from it all. So how long do we give her until enough is enough? I know in my heart SS should be called now but if I do that I risk my whole family never talking to me again. And then what if the kids get taken away and put into a home and it turns out worse for them. They aren't in any immediate danger. Dsis will never harm the kids neither would the partner. They get well and go out alot. They have family that love them. Its more their psychology welfare I'm worried about.

OP posts:
CallOnMe · 02/08/2022 10:39

This is neglect and 99% of the time there will be other issues, that you are not aware of.

I agree with this!

You only know part of what goes on and you know she downplays things! It’s got to be worse behind closed doors.

Id be tempted to give the 11 y/o a secret phone and tell them to ring or text you if they’re ever worried about their parents fighting or if mum collapses again.

neverbeenskiing · 02/08/2022 10:40

The school nurses work all year round though.

In my area the School Nursing team runs a skeleton service in the holidays and would most likely give OP the number for Children's Services and tell her to call. They may possibly make the call themselves, but it would be much better for the OP to do it herself as she can answer any questions, requests for more specific detail rather than a School Nurse who has likely never met the children reporting second hand information.

SleepingStandingUp · 02/08/2022 10:43

Throwaway6 · 02/08/2022 09:45

The children do have bedding/mattresses/bed frames but it's just whenever I go over there they don't have any bedding on for whatever reason and their Pillows are really old and stained.

So they have bedding but they aren't given it to use. That isn't actually better.

Teadrinkingmumofone · 02/08/2022 10:44

Throwaway6 · 02/08/2022 09:36

It also breaks my heart to think what these poor kids have been going through and how they have no one to look out for them

They have you to look out for them. Call SS, kick up as much fuss as you can. You will not regret doing your best for these children but you will regret just standing by and watching on.

Throwaway6 · 02/08/2022 10:44

@CallOnMe this is what grates me about the whole situation.. She has the means to kick him out and move on with her life but she would prefer to keep him around for her own selfish beneficial needs rather than cutting him loose so she and the kids can have a space argumentative free home. It's just something I can't wrap my head around at all. She drinks partly because she isn't happy with her home life but then refuses to do anything about it so she can drink. It's a bloody endless loop.

Also as a pp said I am also worried about the men she would be with if her home became open and vacant. One of the men she dated was violent and attacked/stalked her. I couldnt believe she had been still dating him after all these actions and I was furious at her because he could of easily followed her home and become violent to the children. When I expressed this it didn't get through to her though as all she was worried about was how it was affecting her. And unfortunately it's the exact same now with her live in partner. I keep trying to get through to her about the effects it must be having on her poor children but she can't see past herself or her emotions to care

OP posts:
40anxious · 02/08/2022 10:44

Speak to them about your concerns. Are you able to take the kids on temporarily if your sis isnt deemed fit. The poor children 😔

SleepingStandingUp · 02/08/2022 10:47

Throwaway6 · 02/08/2022 09:47

@SleepingStandingUp im not not doing anything. I'm going to see the children today and assess how bad the house is and how they are.

And then continue to do nothing.

You made a ref to the then 7 yo calling for help. Four years ago. He's now 11.

But keep going and looking and thinking about how awful it is and doing nothing. I'm sure that's really helping them.

Throwaway6 · 02/08/2022 10:52

@40anxious no as I said before I'm a single mum myself with no home to offer them. I want to support them though and think I may try to talk to dc11 to see if I can get a guage at how bad things really are. If things are that bad I will call ss. In the mean time I have offered to take them out and look after them as much as possible. I may go buy the children new bedding if their beds are still a state.

OP posts:
Throwaway6 · 02/08/2022 10:54

@SleepingStandingUp if I was doing nothing I wouldn't of even made this thread. I am doing something. But I'm seeing what the appropriate cause of action is first. I don't have much experience in this other than being a mum myself. And as a mum I just can't understand or relate to my dsis and her actions and because of this I will do something. I could never live with myself if I didn't and stood by especially since I've also experienced being in a dysfunctional household and know how bad it is

OP posts:
neverbeenskiing · 02/08/2022 10:56

I may try to talk to dc11 to see if I can get a guage at how bad things really are.

You already know things are bad. If you start questioning a child of this age they will likely play down how bad things are because their instinct will be to protect their Mum. I'm sorry, OP but this just seems like stalling.

40anxious · 02/08/2022 10:59

11 yo will most likely play it down not to get into trouble. If mum or dad finds out 11 yo have said something, they might be in the line of fire next…. I really hope you manage to sort this. I feel for the children caught up in this

Throwaway6 · 02/08/2022 11:06

11yr old is actually quite open and been telling his grandparents alot so I think its worth a shot. He is quite emotionally mature which I guess he has to be sadly. He still shouldn't be subjected to this all. I'm off to dcs House to see how bad it is and help look after them. I will make my final decision regarding ss by today

OP posts:
Hotenoughtoburnasausage · 02/08/2022 11:08

Op in the kindest way you aren't qualified to decided what action would be best. Call a professional who does.

SleepingStandingUp · 02/08/2022 11:09

Ok, let me reframe "doing nothing" into "not doing anything actively constructive" for the YEARS that this is going on.

mynamesnotMa · 02/08/2022 11:14

The children won't be removed without good reason. They need help you have to call then

Throwaway6 · 02/08/2022 11:17

I don't actually want kids removed from dsis I want dsis to get help first and that be last resort.

Obviously if that was what was best for dc I would get over it but I feel like there is still hope before it needs to come to do that

OP posts:
CallOnMe · 02/08/2022 11:21

Also as a pp said I am also worried about the men she would be with if her home became open and vacant.*

This is very true and it’s obvious she has very little respect for herself so I can definitely see her jumping straight into another relationship with an even worse man.

Is her current partner the dad to all of the DCs?
If not where are their dad?

It sounds like she has many more issues than him and actually it may be that he’s the one who steps up but I still think he needs SS to help him do that so I would still give them a call.

SparklingLime · 02/08/2022 11:23

You’re increasingly sounding like you want to think you’re in control of the situation and what happens. This is really unhelpful to those kids. You are too close to the situation to be objective and need to refer it to SS and school.

Tara219 · 02/08/2022 11:25

Look, it is incredibly hard to remove chuldren from their families. They get offered all sorts of support and it has to be extremely severe for the child to be removed. The point of social services is to try keep families together, however the longer this goes on, it will probably get much worse.

By calling social services, you are allowing them to get that support now. If they have no bed sheets on the bed, I would bet they turn up to school in clothes that are too small, the child being physically dirty/hair in knot clumps or perhaps overly hungry, all of which would be logged as safeguarding issues by the school. You will likely not be the first to raise safeguarding issues with social services.

PeasOff · 02/08/2022 11:28

@Throwaway6 so if the 11 year old is open and has been telling his grandparents a lot why do you need to ask him more?!

As for making your 'final decision' today surely you already know what needs to be done.

HoppingPavlova · 02/08/2022 11:28

I'm due to see dsis partner today and its going to take everything in power for me to not tell him what I think of him as a parent.

And will you also be telling DSIS what you think of her as a parent?

Ciela · 02/08/2022 11:30

Please phone OP those children need protecting.

I have seen too many cases of children damaged by their home environment. There was one girl then aged 9 who did things like pull down other children’s trousers. Outwardly she came from a perfect home always fed, clean clothes, nice house, plenty of money but she was being neglected. She went to school on her own every day and took herself home to an empty house every night. Her parents bought her an annual bus pass so she spent her weekends entirely on her own visiting museums and art galleries as her parents were too wrapped up in work, organising the house and seeing friends.
She was pulling down other children’s trousers because then he parents would reward her with the attention she craved. The only time they gave her time was when she misbehaved.

The environment your dear nieces and nephews are in is equally damaging and they need that adult to step up and speak for them just like the little girl I knew did.

Sartre · 02/08/2022 11:31

So your sister is an alcoholic who is going out on the lash every weekend, dragging strangers back to the house to carry on the partying and regularly having loud arguments with her partner. The DC are neglected to the extent they have no bedding and they had to telephone a relative for help when Mum was passed out drunk and you’re questioning whether you should inform SS or not? Of course you should.

It doesn’t matter that they didn’t help in the past, you need to try again for their sake. SS very very rarely remove children, only in incredibly serious situations. They will try to help your sister first.

DoNaeWrong · 02/08/2022 11:42

you NEED to report this. you know you do. the basic neglect (bedding etc) is an indicator of bigger issues - who's making sure they eat properly? brushing their teeth?

if she's alcohol dependant and basically AWOL and he does nothing, you NEED to flag it.

and step in if you have the capacity/money and willingness. those poor children

Geranium1984 · 02/08/2022 11:42

I would call social services and raise your concerns with the school. As pp have said, very unlikely the kids will be taken away and it will give an opportunity to help you sister with her alcohol problem and hopefully keep regular monitoring of the family.

If I was in your/your DM position as a close family member I'd also be providing the kids with what they need, clean bedding, clothing etc. And spending as much time as possible there to make sure they are in a clean environment. I dont think I could sit by and watch them go without.