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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To ask if the word "sitting" has fallen out of use completely?

151 replies

LaPerduta · 28/07/2022 17:29

See also "lying" and "standing".

I realise there are dialects and that this is Mumsnet, not an academic assignment, but I hardly ever see "sitting" being used when - dare I say it - it should be.

Do I need to move with the times?

OP posts:
OchonAgusOchonOh · 28/07/2022 18:46

LaPerduta · 28/07/2022 18:38

I agree, but it's not as bad as "Fred and myself".

As a speaker of hiberno english, I'm quite partial to the use of "myself" but only when it follows hiberno english grammar rules.

carefullycourageous · 28/07/2022 18:47

pedants annoy me more than shifting language trends 100% agree. Pedant = smallminded IMO, language has always evolved.

Wonmoretime · 28/07/2022 18:49

@BlueThursday I was going to say exactly that.
Invite is a verb.
You send out INVITATIONS. I really hate that.
I am also not a fan of people asking for clarity instead of clarification!!

LaPerduta · 28/07/2022 18:51

Jalisco · 28/07/2022 18:40

I use them all. But language evolves - there are no real rights or wrongs. We talk in the UK about the binmen coming to collect the rubbish. The Americans call it garbage. In strict terms they are correct - we used garbage but changed the word, and they didn't. Starving, as in hungry, didn't used to mean hungry - in middle English it meant dying, because having no food and dying were considered synonymous.

Purity of language is impossible, but I'd also call it undesirable. It was the thing that destroyed some of our traditional languages and dialects. If the Queen wants her English, she can keep it. Diversity of language, and growth of language, are wonderful things.

That's true and I agree in principle. But losing "sitting", "standing" and "lying" makes the language less diverse, not more.

Also, while English is a very irregular language as it borrows so widely, I can't think of a single verb (including very irregular ones like "to be") that doesn't use the "-ing" form for the present participle, so dispensing with those three words is actually causing an unnecessary inconsistency.

OP posts:
FreyaStorm · 28/07/2022 19:02

I’m sat here reading this thread with a nice cup of tea and I totally agree, OP.

LaPerduta · 28/07/2022 19:02

housemaus · 28/07/2022 18:45

The nice thing about language is that it evolves.

As long as a person can be understood, it doesn't actually matter that much - if someone tells me "I was sat on my bed", I'm going to understand precisely where they were and in what position. Job done! 😊

(And pedants annoy me more than shifting language trends. Britain will not fall, the crops won't wither in the fields, people won't be left speaking tongues unintelligibly to one another if we start shifting "I am sitting" to "I'm sat".)

Sometimes precision is lost, though which, imo, isn't a good thing.

"I was sat on my bed" is passive and actually means that someone (or something) placed you on your bed in a sitting position. "I was laid on my bed" similarly means that someone put you down on your bed in a lying position as a single action; it doesn't (or shouldn't) refer to something that was happening for a period of time. By losing that distinction we've lost the ability to distinguish between two totally different ideas.

OP posts:
Alittlenonsensenowandthen · 28/07/2022 19:11

Oooh yes I also get bugged by the increase in the word 'myself'. Used a lot to sound they're using formal language. E.g. any problems email myself or my colleague. drives me crazy. However my education in English was poor and I often doubt myself so don't want to be a pedant!

TokenGinger · 28/07/2022 19:14

BlueThursday · 28/07/2022 17:38

It’s the same as “invitation”

invite has taken over completely

This one drives me bonkers.

"Can you send me an invite for the meeting?"

No. I can either invite you, or send you an invitation.

It appears invite has become an informal noun, as opposed to just a verb, but it makes me itch when I see it!

Athenajm80 · 28/07/2022 19:17

I have noticed that "utilise" is replacing "use", or perhaps that is just in the workplaces I have been in. For example one manager would say "we're going to utilise the spare desks for the new staff" For the new staff to dance on, to sleep on? Oh, you mean to work on? Then you aren't utilising the desks, you are simply using them, you total and utter imbecile. He also did the myself thing, and basically all other things people have raised here. I have noticed other managers use utilise instead of use, but none irritate me as much as he did 😁

MatildaJayne · 28/07/2022 19:23

I tend to think of a stuffed ‘Guy’ being stood/propped up or sat/positioned on a chair or a corpse being ‘led’/laid on the bed. Blush

LaPerduta · 28/07/2022 19:31

MatildaJayne · 28/07/2022 19:23

I tend to think of a stuffed ‘Guy’ being stood/propped up or sat/positioned on a chair or a corpse being ‘led’/laid on the bed. Blush

That's a much more succinct and straightforward way of making the point I was trying to make above.

OP posts:
DonateBloodNCheckSmokeAlarms · 28/07/2022 19:31

@TokenGinger @BlueThursday
Re invite/invitation, I don't like "quote" being used as a noun instead of a verb.

schnubbins · 28/07/2022 19:48

"I seen" instead of "I saw" is also used more ,

housemaus · 28/07/2022 19:57

LaPerduta · 28/07/2022 19:02

Sometimes precision is lost, though which, imo, isn't a good thing.

"I was sat on my bed" is passive and actually means that someone (or something) placed you on your bed in a sitting position. "I was laid on my bed" similarly means that someone put you down on your bed in a lying position as a single action; it doesn't (or shouldn't) refer to something that was happening for a period of time. By losing that distinction we've lost the ability to distinguish between two totally different ideas.

You're right, although in this specific context I think needing to refer to being 'sat' (or being stood, etc) happens relatively rarely and with context, you'd be able to work it out.

For example, if I tell you "I was sat on the sofa while we watched Netflix", and then in the next story I tell you "we had a visit from the police because I watch too many crime documentaries and they're suspicious I might be a serial killer - I was sat down and given a right talking to!" it's clear that in the former I was unlikely to have been placed there whereas in the latter, it's likely it was instigated by someone else.

Even without this context, if I wanted to make it clear, assuming I was a person who had no idea of the original meaning of 'sat' and just thought it meant what 'sitting' actually means, I would be able to clarify in a different way - "I was made to sit down" or similar. So although, granted, it's not as neat, we're not losing the ability to explain the concept - we're just doing it differently.

There are linguistic hills I'll die on (or at least get mildly injured on - I try and keep an open mind) but I love the way it changes.

One of the things I'm fascinated by at the moment is seeing the habitual be construction widen in usage - i.e. "She's crying" vs "She be crying". The former suggests she's crying right now, the latter suggests she's always bloody crying. Common in AAVE and apparently (having Googled to check I'd got the name right) in Hibernian English, but I've seen it creep out a bit more via TikTok/social media generally. What a useful, specific construction - technically, using the habitual present in 'standard' English, we could say '"she cries", but by itself it doesn't have quite the same feel and we'd be more likely to say "she cries often" "she's always crying" "she cries a lot". (There's another discussion there about bits of AAVE getting used when it's convenient but dismissed as incorrect the rest of the time, but it's still interesting nonetheless).

Icouldbehappy · 28/07/2022 19:57

Always sitting.
Absolute pedant here!
My DH is very well-educated and intelligent but if he ever says,
“I’ve went..”
one more time, I swear I will divorce him 😂

newbiename · 28/07/2022 20:03

Perple · 28/07/2022 17:30

What do people use instead of sitting??

I use it often. I’m just sitting at my desk. I’ve spent the whole day sitting on my butt watching Netflix…..

Sat

darisdet · 28/07/2022 20:17

LaPerduta · 28/07/2022 17:29

See also "lying" and "standing".

I realise there are dialects and that this is Mumsnet, not an academic assignment, but I hardly ever see "sitting" being used when - dare I say it - it should be.

Do I need to move with the times?

Ah, you mean the 'I was sat' thing?

I don't think so! I hope not.

LaPerduta · 28/07/2022 20:19

housemaus · 28/07/2022 19:57

You're right, although in this specific context I think needing to refer to being 'sat' (or being stood, etc) happens relatively rarely and with context, you'd be able to work it out.

For example, if I tell you "I was sat on the sofa while we watched Netflix", and then in the next story I tell you "we had a visit from the police because I watch too many crime documentaries and they're suspicious I might be a serial killer - I was sat down and given a right talking to!" it's clear that in the former I was unlikely to have been placed there whereas in the latter, it's likely it was instigated by someone else.

Even without this context, if I wanted to make it clear, assuming I was a person who had no idea of the original meaning of 'sat' and just thought it meant what 'sitting' actually means, I would be able to clarify in a different way - "I was made to sit down" or similar. So although, granted, it's not as neat, we're not losing the ability to explain the concept - we're just doing it differently.

There are linguistic hills I'll die on (or at least get mildly injured on - I try and keep an open mind) but I love the way it changes.

One of the things I'm fascinated by at the moment is seeing the habitual be construction widen in usage - i.e. "She's crying" vs "She be crying". The former suggests she's crying right now, the latter suggests she's always bloody crying. Common in AAVE and apparently (having Googled to check I'd got the name right) in Hibernian English, but I've seen it creep out a bit more via TikTok/social media generally. What a useful, specific construction - technically, using the habitual present in 'standard' English, we could say '"she cries", but by itself it doesn't have quite the same feel and we'd be more likely to say "she cries often" "she's always crying" "she cries a lot". (There's another discussion there about bits of AAVE getting used when it's convenient but dismissed as incorrect the rest of the time, but it's still interesting nonetheless).

That's very interesting and personally I rather like these sorts of neologistic examples. I'm not averse to interesting and imaginitive developments in language use which enhance/embellish communication and add nuance, but I baulk when it's simply an incorrect conjugation (or similar) that adds absolutely nothing (imo) and just, to my ear, sounds wrong.

OP posts:
Staffy1 · 28/07/2022 20:20

You could do a Mrs Slocombe and say “I was stood standing…”

Flatmountains · 28/07/2022 20:21

Welcome to the English language. Constantly changing, hence such a ginormous vocabulary. Have you seen all of the books needed for the full dictionary?

OchonAgusOchonOh · 28/07/2022 20:24

@housemaus - not to be pedantic or anything but it's Hiberno-English, not Hibernian English.

And yes, we do have a habitual present which has evolved from the fact there is a habitual present in the Irish language. It would be "She does be crying" rather than "she be crying" in Hiberno English.

We do be doing lots of things in Ireland.

Staffy1 · 28/07/2022 20:24

schnubbins · 28/07/2022 19:48

"I seen" instead of "I saw" is also used more ,

My local fb page often has people saying “see” instead of “saw”. Not even “seen”, it’s maddening. For example, “did anyone notice a dodgy man in the high street?” “Yes, I see him this morning outside the pound shop”. I’ve never heard anyone speaking that way, so it’s odd.

MintyGreenDreams · 28/07/2022 20:28

Every young person I see on TV says generally for genuinely and it drives me potty.
"I generally think we have a connection" etc

Luredbyapomegranate · 28/07/2022 20:33

No you don't. Sat instead of sitting is very upsetting indeed.

BitOutOfPractice · 28/07/2022 20:35

LaPerduta · 28/07/2022 18:26

I loathe "I am sat" and "I was sat" (plus obviously "he was sat", etc.) but I was loath to be overtly critical as that seems to invite a pile-on as some posters have dyslexia (which of course I understand) and other posters had to leave school at the age of eight to go and work in the cotton mills or up chimneys and so weren't fortunate enough to have had a good education.

Plus you didn’t want to seem like an insufferably condescending snob? 😀