Trapped gas-can’t do this anymore

[Itneverends77]

Dd is almost 4, she’s had stomach pains since January. We’ve been to the doctors and hospital numerous times, she’s had various blood and urine tests-all negative.
Two eco scans have showed gas and one x ray has shown she’s impacted with poo and air.
We've been disimpacting with 8 sachets a day of Movicol for almost 9 weeks and started pico drops last week. Nothing has changed. Her behaviour has completely changed, she’s currently running around, shouting, tormenting the dog, she jumps around, throws things, sometimes hits me.
She has tummy ache from when she wakes, and on and off all day.
I feel like I’ve lost my little girl, so frustrating and upset to see her in pain everyday and not be able to help her, feeling so exhausted dealing with her behaviour, we can barely attend friends parties or play dates anymore, it’s impacted our life.
She’s due to start school in September, but I don’t see how she can, she’ll disrupt the class and teachers with her behaviour, when it’s not her fault, others would see her a just a *Naughty girl, but she really isn’t.
We’ve tried stomach massages, hot water bottles, gas drops, paracetamol medicine…nothing works.
I feel like the doctor has just sort of come to the end with it and really can’t offer me any more advice now…feeling quite desperate.
Has anyone been through similar, at my wits end

@User478 That’s nice, will show her, she does get down 😔

@endofagain That’s what I asked her, but she said no x rays for little ones if they can help it, but how will they truly know when/if impacted

Ask your doctor if you can give her Silicolgel, you can buy it on Amazon, it coats the digestive tract & grabs any bugs or bad bacteria & washes it out in poo, helps IBS, heartburn, food poisoning, indigestion. Adult dose is a tablespoon 3 times a day so if you gave her 2.5ml to start with & then increase to 5ml. Otherwise have you tried Rennie Deflatine or peppermint oil capsules or even peppermint cordial in either hot water or soda water.

Have you got a poo stool that she can rest her feet on and lean back so she is in the ‘perfect’ position. You can get them from Amazon. Give her the iPad and just get her to sit and relax? No stress. If it happens it happens.

Itneverends77 no I had no idea he was constipated, he was 8 at the time so it wasn't like I was able to monitor what he did when he went to the toilet. He must have been like it for a good couple of weeks because the amount that came out afterwards was enormous & it kept on happening with no warning for a good 3-4 days after. I ended up buying the largest size disposable nappies for him to wear until it slowed down & he could feel it coming. He is autistic & bowel problems are often part of autism, he is 18 now & still sometimes has to take movicol. I found really ripe bananas mashed up with brown sugar or a couple of spoonsful of olive oil helped, he loved ciabatta bread dipped in olive oil & balsamic vinegar so I gave him that if I thought it was coming on.

If you are really worried, take her to A & E.

8 per day isnt the max dose for that age.

My son has dealt with bowel impaction since he was 3.5 and is turning 9 soon. It's an ongoing issue and certainly not a quick fix.

At your daughters age, the advice from the a&e doctor was to increase dosage by 4 sachets per day to a maximum of 16 sachets per day.
He recently had a bad flare up in March and was advised the same.

Remember and dilute the sachets correctly - one sachet to roughly 60ml of water. (So she can have 8 sachets in roughly 500ml of water/squash)
So I would give 8 today, 12 tomorrow, 16 the next day. It will clear the blockage and she will have a huge poo. You then have to continue on a maintenance dose for as long as it takes to retrain the bowel, this can take years and there can be flare ups.
What happens with bowel impaction is that the blockage builds up to be so large that your childs bowel becomes stretched. When they eventually pass this blockage, the bowel is still stretched and so your child wont feel the urge to go until the bowel has reached the maximum capacity again - resulting again in a stool that is too large to pass. So you must lower the dose after blockage has passed back to a maintenance dose of around 4 per day for at least 6m then 2 a day then 1 etc. this allows the bowel to shrink back to a normal size.
if there is ever another flare up, increase dosage by 4 per day until blockage is passed.
The overflow others have mentioned is correct. It is the waste in the digestive system that simply passes round and leaks past the large stool, hence the constant runny poo.

Ive been in your situation. Please try my advice. Hope your daughter feels relief soon.

Jeeez, a doctor recommending a child sees an ostheopath. Holy moly! OP I was talking to sb who had serious problems after a stomach flu when they were a teenager and in the end, after many trips to the hospital and even being admitted more than once, a great doctor found out the meds she'd taken for that flue had killed all the good bacteria so she had chronic diarrhea. All they had to do was assess the gut microbiota.
Can your DD have yoghurts and probiotics? Honestly, the FODMAP sb recommended is a good plan but you need sb to guide you. The tests might not have picked up anything but it could be a bloody intolerance and those, as the doctor should know, likely won't show up because they're not to do with histamines but with the gastric system.
Orange juice could potentially help too but I'd ask for advice on that too.
Sending you hugs! Can I ask where you are OP?

Another possibility, in case you're in a country with poor access to potable water: Helicobacter Pylori.

@Oceanus What’s the issue with osteopaths? 🙈is it a waste of time?

I’m in Portugal.

I’m not understanding the difference between allergies and intolerances? I thought if she’d had all the blood tests and all negative, she doesn’t have a problem with foods? It’s so confusing to know what area to tackle/who to go to/what’s going on

@chubbachub It says on the Eric website etc that for her age, the maximum is 8?
Also, my Dr doesn’t even want her on that many, I’ve taken it into my own hands and followed Eric guidelines

Shut the front door, I'm in Portugal too. No way in hell would a proper doctor here send a child to see an ostheopath (we use them when we hurt our back or ankles, some have hands made of gold). Never ever would that happen and that tells me your doctor is an arse!!! Let me guess, is this you GP? We have great doctors in Portugal but in hospitals! Most GP's are in their whole little group... and I would not say class them as awesome.
You need a good gastro expert. Get the Points card from Continente, then ask to sign up to the Plano Wells (that's like a health insurance but you don't pay anything, you just get discounts in some hospitals, all the appointments are about 45ish euros, depending on the place). When you get the card ask them to make the call to sign up for that card - say you don't speak the language, they should help you. Ask if the card should be in your name or if your DD should get her own, these cards are free.
Whereabouts are you? PM me if you want to. I can check the CV online and then give you a list of experts.
You can see the expert and if they prescribe exams/ medicine, you take those papers back to the GP and you get them to prescribe it again under our NHS, so you don't pay the exams.

@Oceanus God, how weird 😮I speak Portuguese and have that plan 👍 I’m with a private kids gastro doctor 🤷🏻‍♀️When I messaged her today with a few (more!) questions, I asked about an osteopath as my friend had recommended one and she said it can work and some of her patients go to see one. I don’t know, I really don’t want to waste money at this stage

I've read most of the posts of yours but not sure if this is mentioned. When she has problem passing gas have you tried getting her into a downwards dog position but to stick her bum right up by arching her back. I have IBS and when I'm struggling with belly ache I do this and it helps the gas come right out again. I can't recommend anything else the doctors haven't said already but this bit helps me a lot with the gas.

@Watchkeys
What do you eat instead?
Do you have to take supplements / vitamins?

Honestly a Portuguese doctor in Portugal advising you see an ostheopath is ridiculous, that's not how it works here... but it's a cultural thing, it'd be hard to put into words.
Instead of paying for that you should go and see another expert imho. Start with another pediatrician and then see another gastro expert (sb with experience).
On another note you can also see a nutritionist in a private hospital. I paid 40 euros when I went (with the Plano Wells). That way you can get started on the FODMAP diet.
Have you been to a Lusíadas hospital? Most experts have an agreement with Wells.

@RollingBills What effect could the toxins not being able to get out of the system cause?

Toxins that cannot be eliminated can build up and affect the natural PH of the body causing things such as lactic acidosis.

She's had these symptoms a long time now and I would have thought if she were constipated after 6 months of laxatives things should be moving on. Has she lost weight ?
Does she have pain every time she eats?

Does she have tiredness that comes after eating or after being hyper ?
For a three year old to say her heart is beating fast is quite alarming. Has she had cardiac tests?

Is she short/tall for her age.

You sound at your wits end with her, I'm very sorry this must be so hard, but please don't minimise this to Dr's, you must push and give them the worst of her symptoms.
Sometimes you can get used to ill health even with children and it becomes the norm , but this is not normal.

@RollingBills She’s been on the laxative drinks for 9 months, her tummy hurts after eating but also when she wakes in the morning. She’s weighed every time and is still within range, she hasn’t lost weight but hasn’t put lots on.
The dr has checked her heart and had blood tests etc, all negative. I’m not sure if it’s just her being aware of feeling her heart after running around etc.
She does get tired and emotional too, her behaviours difficult and she’s cross a lot. We’ve no idea if it’s the sachets or the constipation or something else.
Ive pushed and pushed the doctor and she’s put us through with tests much more quickly than we would’ve had to normally wait. I feel like she doesn’t know where to go from here so has put us through to a main hospital 2.5 hrs away
I don’t know what to do, if seeing this osteopath is a waste of money or what.
The doctors know in detail what I’ve said about what’s happening with her

@RollingBills Sorry, not 9 months! *9 WEEKS almost

often with sloppy poo you can be constipated, they call it overflow diarrhea. Which means she has a hard chunk stuck and the liquidy stuff is just flowing around it.. it would feel very uncomfortable for her.In very extreme cases a doctor can recommend using a qufora, but would depend on so many factors. Ask your GP for a referral. Your poor daughter deserves to have some relief.. you could also try an Epson salt bath and peppermint oil capsuy help, but not sure if there is an age limit on usage. A pharmacist could help.

Have you watched the poo nurses video?

@endofagain Yes, I watched it a fair bit ago when all this was happening, I’m also on the main Fb group

She’s just so hyper at the moment, it’s so hard, she just never stops. No idea if this is connected or not

How's her sleep? Tiredness because pains waking her can have a big impact on emotional regulation. Sorry if I'm repeating things.

Mesenteric lymphadenitis, also known as mesenteric adenitis, is inflammation (swelling) of the lymph nodes in the abdomen (belly). This is very common in children usually a post viral reaction. My DCs took over 10 months to resolve in total. Its not usually something to worry about in and off itself but it can cause a lot of pain. We were told to treat with Panadol plus ibuprofen as needed up to the daily limit ongoing till the pain resolved. I hope they've given you advice on how to treat the pain? DC used to wake up crying from the pain at night.

Same DC also has ongoing constipation, she has been on movicol for over a year, but only did one week at a high dose. Long term constipation enlarges the bowel, so it's very common for children to need a year or two on movicol/osmalax type medications as the bowel needs time to return to a normal size and without ongoing daily treatment the constipation would return. As PPs have said the very runny poo can be a sign poo is leaking over the top of a blockage. I wouldn't be comfortable with a high dose for that long, but that doesn't mean that's not right for your DD. DCs ongoing dose is 2 sachets of the junior movical, equivalent to one adult dose ongoing. If she's getting more pain and really liquid poos or tiny amounts of poo only we increase it to 3-4 junior sachets per day for a few days.

There are medications that help with trapped gas/wind, some for babies, might be worth looking into or asking the paediatrican what they can advise to relieve her pain and reduce the trapped gas.

Our GP said the pain while eating is because when you start eating the body tries to make space for the new food and it's pushing along the food and gas and trapped poo, hence why eating hurts.

I hope your daughter can get effective treatment soon and her pain reduces. It's so tough seeing them go through this and not know how to help.

DC found a heatpack on her stomach helped a bit at times.