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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Tradesman chasing for payment

699 replies

CharlesIsQueensHorcrux · 19/06/2022 11:24

Hi - I had a tradesman in last week, finished Friday & invoiced Friday night with email and message. Since then has messaged another five times chasing me! By the way I wasn’t ignoring him I messaged back saying I was out but would deal. Is it me or is he unreasonable to chase me all weekend for an invoice issued on Friday night? I was happy with the work but not sure now I would use him again as I feel a bit ick like there’s a suggestion I wouldn’t pay or something. Aibu?

OP posts:
GCRich · 19/06/2022 15:11

lemmein · 19/06/2022 14:44

People who whatsapp you with an invoice as you;re walking round a supermarket and are nagging you before you've even got through the door back at home are arseholes of the highest order.

This would be true had the OP said he messaged her 5 times within an hour or 2 of sending the invoice, but he didn't - the invoice requested payment within 1 day, it's now Sunday.

Making up scenarios to match your argument is a bit weird really.

I was referring to all the people who always pay "immediately". If people always pay "immediately" then presumably they are happy to be harrassed after 5 minutes.

riesenrad · 19/06/2022 15:11

Because we're fully conscious adults, aware and responsible for every aspect of our lives and finances

Hmmm. On this thread everyone is super-organised and pays invoices before they even receive them. On other threads everyone goes on about how much "life admin" they have and how unrelenting life is. I guess everyone is different but it's always fun when MNers are so inconsistent!

coffeecupsandfairylights · 19/06/2022 15:12

Comefromaway · 19/06/2022 15:08

I expect a professional tradesperson to operate during office hours. It would not even occur to me to check emails over a weekend.

Unfortunately when you're self-employed, you rarely have the luxury of doing paperwork during "office hours". My paperwork is done in the evenings as I'm out doing jobs during the day.

The point is, if a job is finished on a Friday afternoon, then you should have the common decency to pay up on the Friday. It's not like the payment or amount owed is coming as a huge shock to you.

I pay for all the services I use on the day I use them, I don't make them wait until I can be bothered several days later, because that's a shitty way to treat someone who is trying to earn a living.

Comefromaway · 19/06/2022 15:13

All my family including myself and my husband have been and some still are self employed.

brown543 · 19/06/2022 15:13

I might pay an invoice on the date it was issued, otherwise within 2-3 days. I wouldn't expect to be chased repeatedly over a weekend for an invoice issued on Friday.

Personally I think that still qualifies as prompt but clearly we all have different interpretations.

liveforsummer · 19/06/2022 15:14

riesenrad · 19/06/2022 15:11

Because we're fully conscious adults, aware and responsible for every aspect of our lives and finances

Hmmm. On this thread everyone is super-organised and pays invoices before they even receive them. On other threads everyone goes on about how much "life admin" they have and how unrelenting life is. I guess everyone is different but it's always fun when MNers are so inconsistent!

Well life is hectic but if I received an invoice from an individual stating ti pay within a day I'd certainly pay it there and then. If I interpreted that as ok to pay tomorrow however received a reminder before I did so then I'd pay it on the first reminder. I'm far more likely to forget something like my internet bill that has a 30 odd day window and affects no one but my self if I don't remember. It's called prioritising and is a handy attribute to have both in work and personal life

GCRich · 19/06/2022 15:15

coffeecupsandfairylights · 19/06/2022 15:06

I agree tradespeople should provide several options for payment - cash, bank transfer or card, for example.

But even if your online banking app is a bit complicated, it's not a reason not to pay someone. If someone has done a job for you then you should make it a priority to pay them afterwards, even if it's a bit inconvenient for you. It's just a nice thing to do.

Yep, I make it a priority to pay. If I got an invoice on a Friday evening it would lmost certainly be paid the following morning or the Sunday morning. Unless I was being harrassed and then I might put it aside for a while as a matter of principle.

TheDoveFromAboveCooCoo · 19/06/2022 15:15

@GCRich I never suggested how many employees your company has or if you may be related to them or not??

You just said you ran your company payroll. My response was to that statement.

Unfortunately my crystal ball is out of action for the weekend.

GCRich · 19/06/2022 15:16

Branster · 19/06/2022 15:07

Forget about business days, payment terms etc.
He's right to want his money on completion, there and then. Especially in the current climate.
It would be safe to assume his staff wanted paying cash on Friday and he probably gad a fair few late paying customers and not taking any chances.

Why didn;t he turn up with a card reader and take payment there and then? And not onlythat he didn;t even give her the invoice there and then IIRC,

GCRich · 19/06/2022 15:18

TheDoveFromAboveCooCoo · 19/06/2022 15:15

@GCRich I never suggested how many employees your company has or if you may be related to them or not??

You just said you ran your company payroll. My response was to that statement.

Unfortunately my crystal ball is out of action for the weekend.

Yes, you made an assumption. I was making the point that as a normal person I am not able to pay myself on time every single time, let alone random tradesmen whose payment details aren't set up on my internet banking.

Mammajay · 19/06/2022 15:18

Most jobs would be paid for when completed.

GCRich · 19/06/2022 15:19

coffeecupsandfairylights · 19/06/2022 15:12

Unfortunately when you're self-employed, you rarely have the luxury of doing paperwork during "office hours". My paperwork is done in the evenings as I'm out doing jobs during the day.

The point is, if a job is finished on a Friday afternoon, then you should have the common decency to pay up on the Friday. It's not like the payment or amount owed is coming as a huge shock to you.

I pay for all the services I use on the day I use them, I don't make them wait until I can be bothered several days later, because that's a shitty way to treat someone who is trying to earn a living.

Stick them on a credit card and get 30 days free credit. I find this useful.

liveforsummer · 19/06/2022 15:19

Yes, you made an assumption. I was making the point that as a normal person I am not able to pay myself on time every single time, let alone random tradesmen whose payment details aren't set up on my internet banking.

But if you had unrelated employees you'd need to find the time to pay them on time. It's scandalous when it happens that employers don't and can have serious impact on the employees and their families lives

GCRich · 19/06/2022 15:20

Mammajay · 19/06/2022 15:18

Most jobs would be paid for when completed.

Yes - a few days or a few weeks after completion, or maybe immediately if the tradesmen invoices on the spot and has card payment facilities on hand, neither of whch apply in this case.

allboysherebutme · 19/06/2022 15:21

I would have paid him while he was packing up his tools if I was happy.
He may need the money, x

MRex · 19/06/2022 15:21

A tradesman who hasn't worked for you before really must be paid on the day, because they don't know if you'll pay or not. When you've used them a few times, I doubt there would be an issue with them waiting a few days. I don't really understand why you didn't just pay though? I like to put it through before they leave ideally, or put it through using phone banking as soon as the invoice arrives.

I had the opposite issue with an electrician of chasing him multiple times to get an invoice, it took him months!

GCRich · 19/06/2022 15:22

liveforsummer · 19/06/2022 15:19

Yes, you made an assumption. I was making the point that as a normal person I am not able to pay myself on time every single time, let alone random tradesmen whose payment details aren't set up on my internet banking.

But if you had unrelated employees you'd need to find the time to pay them on time. It's scandalous when it happens that employers don't and can have serious impact on the employees and their families lives

I agree completely. If I was employing unrelated people I would take my pay-days extremely seriously... but I'd also hope that my employees had financial buffers and understood that delays sometimes happen.

oakleaffy · 19/06/2022 15:26

Absolutely pay when agreed.
Why keep a tradesman waiting?
Some weird power trip on your behalf?
Don’t keep anyone waiting for their money- It’s rude and inconsiderate.

GCRich · 19/06/2022 15:30

Comefromaway · 19/06/2022 14:43

Unless you live in a void with no internet access whatsoever, it's not hard to grab your phone and pay people.

except several of us have detailed that it does take longer than 5 mins with pcs, card readers and all sorts.

Plus people are not wedded to their emails (assuming the invoice was sent by email). I don’t check emails over the weekend.

I see you run do or have been self-employed. Do you find that clients appreciate being chased for money multiple times within 24-48 hours of an invoice being issued, or do you find that you are less likely to get repeat business if you come across as a pain in the arse? Do you find that customers trust you les if they think you're right on the breadline and need cash instantaneously?

If you require payment literally immediately upon issuing an invoice do you make this EXPLICITLY clear at the outset so that the customer can put things into place to enable immediate payment (eg get cash out in advance, or set up payment details in advance?)

GCRich · 19/06/2022 15:31

oakleaffy · 19/06/2022 15:26

Absolutely pay when agreed.
Why keep a tradesman waiting?
Some weird power trip on your behalf?
Don’t keep anyone waiting for their money- It’s rude and inconsiderate.

Where did OP say what was agreed?

Pikafuckingwho · 19/06/2022 15:32

Dh is an electrician and he gives 7 day payment terms (unless an emergency call out), our invoicing system gives automatic reminders if it hasn’t been paid after 7 days.

The amount of people who push payment are the same ones who generally don’t offer a cup of tea or let him use the loo (for a wee only obviously)

liveforsummer · 19/06/2022 15:35

I agree completely. If I was employing unrelated people I would take my pay-days extremely seriously... but I'd also hope that my employees had financial buffers and understood that delays sometimes happen.

I'd hope to have a financial buffer too - but I don't. It be in big trouble if I find they paid on time and simply couldn't afford to be understanding

liveforsummer · 19/06/2022 15:36

Sorry *id be in big trouble if I didn't get paid on time.

Not sure what happened there

sunglassesonthetable · 19/06/2022 15:37

*I wouldn't pay on the same day. Absolutely not.

But then I was a QS in the construction industry and I would make them aware my payments expectations at the outset in writing . Paying them on the day allows absolutely no guarantee of them returning if the work isn't up to scratch. Once you've worked on civil, new build, refurb and restoration jobs and had to have people back in time and time again in every area you've worked in, you know that jobs are not always done right first time.

I've more that once had a subby not returning to a job to complete their snagging list items because it wasn't worth the 5 per cent retention held in accordance with the contract. So how do you think you'll get them back to sort out issues when you've paid them same day?

I work with someone who was pressured massively by the company that did his loft conversion to pay the same day, before he'd even got home from work and viewed it. I inspected it for him and found several issues. I knew there would be, I knew their program was unrealistic and they must have rushed and bodged. They had, the floor boarding wasn't even properly supported in one area. This is a well reviewed highly rated firm btw.

Another issue was that they damaged his newly done expensive paint job in his hallway despite assurances they would use protection and fancy videos on their website showing everything being properly sheeted up. I at least managed to stop him paying until they had corrected their own work. However they pressured with phone calls and emails and he caved and paid before they rectified the paintwork.

Yep he's now paying for that himself.

A sustainable business should be able to raise enough credit to deal with a reasonable payment term. I wouldn't employ someone in such financial peril that they had to have cash the same day. Doesn't smack of a stable professional.

Paying in cash? Absolutely not. And why would you? Electronic transfer leaves a proper paper trail. It also helps stops tax evasion and huge amount of that goes on in construction. I've never not paid the VAT on a job by paying in cash and I'm assuming no one else on Mumsnet has given how strongly everyone felt about Rishi Sunaks wife paying more tax on a past thread.

When I had my house remodelled, you can bet my payments were done properly. Interim payments throughout, the full value on completion but only after I'd had time to do a full snagging list and a retention of 5 per cent held. I've never released it as they've never addressed certain issues. I'm about to use some of that money to get the door sorted that's never been right.

Make sure you're fully happy with the work OP. Inspect it as well as you are able to. Take photos of what was done if you don't know what you're looking at. If you think there are any issues don't release the full amount just a percentage. Don't put up with being hassled. Tell them you'll pay them on the next working day. It no wonder there are so many cowboy builders about in England and industry lacks credibility. All the advice on this thread to rush into being someone's cash cow is so far from how professionals in the industry on projects act, it's no wonder people get screwed over so easily.*

☝️
I see most people have just ignored this.

Doesn't fit the narrative of poor trades desperate to be paid to put food on the table.

A lot of the trades I use are super busy. It's a job just getting them round to quote.

And no I can't pay cash on the day. I can only take £250 out of my cash point at a time.

Whilst I have to wait 30 days for my invoices to be paid whatever it says on them.

Someone badgering you all weekend after invoicing on Fri is ridiculous.

I had someone string out a plastering job for weeks. Finished on a Friday and was down wanting cash payment Saturday morning. What do they think? I just have a big pot of cash by my bed.

I'm all for paying promptly but tradesmen seem to have a ridiculous hold on the payment moral high ground.

And I say this as an invoicing sole trader myself.

notacooldad · 19/06/2022 15:37

Giving you the ‘ick’🤣🤣🤣🤣
What the hell are you on about! you haven’t paid!

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