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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

DD doesn't want to do Swimming gala or Maths tuition group

67 replies

UndertheCedartree · 18/06/2022 15:21

Background
DD had Covid at Christmas and has since had Long Covid. She has had a lot of time off school and has been doing shorter days. She has just started doing the full day again. As well as the physical symptoms the Long Covid has left her very anxious and depressed. She used to be a glass half full type but now she is always focusing on the negatives, like when I ask about school she always moans about the things she dislikes where as before she would tell me about the positives of that day. She is in Y5.

DD really doesn't like her school swimming lessons. The main reasons being they make them stand around the outside of the outdoor pool and she gets cold and also that she hates being rushed to get dressed. There is a Swimming Gala coming up next week which due to Covid is her first one. She really doesn't want to do it. Mainly I think due to the fear of the unknown.

The second issue is she has been put in a Maths tuition group for DC that are close but not meeting age expected goals. This takes place over the Computing lesson (which only happens once a week) which she loves. She doesn't want to do the tuition group as she doesn't want to miss Computing. The tuition group involves them using a Maths computer programme with a couple of people to facilitate - as far as I am aware they don't actually teach them that is all done by the programme. She was actually quite excited to show me the programme at home and worked on it for a bit. They don't have to do any at home but can if they want.

So what would you do? I just feel like I'm constantly having to speak to her teacher about issues. Do I just keep her off on Swimming Gala day? Or contact her teacher about it? Should I ask to just work on the Maths at home? I'm exhausted with it all and just wish I could have my happy girl back.

OP posts:
Dahlly · 18/06/2022 16:06

And if her anxiety is so bad that she is unable to speak to her own teacher, then I feel that’s the biggest problem to deal with right now, not a swim gala or maths group

Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 18/06/2022 16:07

Clymene · 18/06/2022 15:50

Yep, I'd definitely keep her out of both. You need to be keeping things ticking over, making school a place she wants to be. There's no point in pulling her out of a lesson she enjoys to do supervised work online which you can do perfectly well at home.

Ok, thank you

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 18/06/2022 16:08

Dahlly · 18/06/2022 15:52

Arranging things with school?

Its asking a question, something that’s expected of all pupils of all ages. Kind of the point of school don’t you think?

Show quote history

It's not just asking a question atall. I would need to check exactly what this Maths tuition group is for a start.

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 18/06/2022 16:10

Dahlly · 18/06/2022 16:06

And if her anxiety is so bad that she is unable to speak to her own teacher, then I feel that’s the biggest problem to deal with right now, not a swim gala or maths group

They're not mutually exclusive. Myself and her therapist are dealing with her anxiety but if the swimming gala is exacerbating it we can look at that too.

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 18/06/2022 16:11

daisypond · 18/06/2022 15:58

I would have a meeting with the teacher about the maths. Find out what they do in the extra support group. It might not be as your dd describes.

Yes, I absolutely would want to check.

OP posts:
godmum56 · 18/06/2022 16:15

I would keep her away from th3 swimming gala without a second thought. I think the maths thing needs the options looking at if there are any. I think its essential tgat she keeps feeling positive about school esoecially given that she has long covis and will find it an effort anyway. I do get the importance of learning to swim but don't see a gala as contributing to that.....and I am so grateful that some of the push shove make her get on with it types on here were not my mother!

Instantnoodles · 18/06/2022 16:17

If you're sure that the problem with the gala is preference- rather than health-related, I think that I would send her in and praise her afterwards. Getting through it might be a confidence boost after the scary time of being ill.

If she will do the maths at home and it's not a taught session I'd request that she's put back in the computer lesson. This sounds like the more productive and confidence boosting option.

CoffeeWithCheese · 18/06/2022 16:18

DD1 is the same age and if you ask her about her likes and dislikes she will always always have a massive whinge... you'd think she has the hardest life in the world from the way she goes on and you'd think she was useless at maths when actually she's fairly near top of the class and doing really well at it! Just mentioning that since I know ALL her friends that age are right mardy buggers anyway - it seems to be a 10 year old girl thing.

I'd let the swimming gala ride - but I'd try to work with school in that she goes and does the session as a helper in some kind of role so she doesn't get the idea she can opt in and out of school curriculum stuff. The Maths support... I'd be talking to school that she's really upset she's losing the same lesson that she really enjoys every week - could they look into rotating the slot somewhat (I used to work in a school where they did that with instrument lessons so no one was consistently missing the same thing) or could she do the session time over a playtime or similar? I do have a bit of a pet hate of this idea of taking kids out of the stuff they enjoy to do more of what they're struggling with - yet still expecting them to enjoy school though.

Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 18/06/2022 16:19

Dahlly · 18/06/2022 16:03

Because you are feeding the anxiety, that there must be special arrangements put in place for her to be able to deal with normal, run of the mill school life.
Youll have noticed, that the more arrangements made, the more she has expects .

That’s so strikingly clear with the maths group. Her health doesn’t affect her partaking in that group, but she wishes for a special arrangements made for her and expects you to sort it out for her. Why? There’s no reason other than she just doesn’t want to do it.

My point is that SHE should be asking for these arrangements. Not the arrangements shouldn’t be made. If she is unable to participate in school life fully, then she’s missing out. She can make these small requests that will facilitate her to participate fully. Surely that’s what you want?

Show quote history

Well, actually yes, she has Long Covid so she did/does need special arrangements to access school, hence the reduced timetable, therapist etc. I mean actually the Maths group is a 'special arrangement' as it takes her out of normal lessons. She hasn't expected a special arrangement, she has just told me she doesn't want to do it and why.

And yes she is missing out due to Long Covid and is unable to participate in school fully. But no she can't 'make these small requests' and I wouldn't want her to. For example with Maths if it is something I need to facilitate, I need to be part of that conversation, in my opinion.

OP posts:
Basilbrushgotfat · 18/06/2022 16:20

Let her off the swimming, I don't believe any child should have to do extra cric if they're adamant they don't want to. And, importantly, with long covid she needs time to recover properly - proper convalescence. I agree with pp that it's a time to reduce demands on her.

Given that maths club is because she's behind I think she needs to go. You won't be doing her or her anxiety any favours if she doesnt catch up or if she falls further behind, and I speak as someone who missed huge amounts of schooling due to ill health.

If arrangements can be made that she doesn't have to miss her favourite lesson for it then that's great but I wouldn't drop maths it not. Make sure she's clear that it's a temporary measure and if she can bring her maths back up to where she needs to be then she can resume them. There can't be much more of term left so it might be that maths club (+ maybe tuition over summer) is enough and she can resume normal lessons in September.

oviraptor21 · 18/06/2022 16:25

Dahlly · 18/06/2022 16:06

And if her anxiety is so bad that she is unable to speak to her own teacher, then I feel that’s the biggest problem to deal with right now, not a swim gala or maths group

I can't agree with this.
Hell would have frozen over before I registered any concern with my own school teachers.

She needs a note excusing her from the gala - she is not fit for it yet.
You need a discussion with maths teacher about undertaking the maths catch up in some other way so as not to impact on the subject she loves - at the moment it feels like she is being punished for getting covid when she's already being punished enough by having long covid.

Dahlly · 18/06/2022 16:33

UndertheCedartree · 18/06/2022 16:19

Well, actually yes, she has Long Covid so she did/does need special arrangements to access school, hence the reduced timetable, therapist etc. I mean actually the Maths group is a 'special arrangement' as it takes her out of normal lessons. She hasn't expected a special arrangement, she has just told me she doesn't want to do it and why.

And yes she is missing out due to Long Covid and is unable to participate in school fully. But no she can't 'make these small requests' and I wouldn't want her to. For example with Maths if it is something I need to facilitate, I need to be part of that conversation, in my opinion.

Show quote history

Then you’ve answered your own question then haven’t you? That you won’t make her ask, that you’ll do do it because she is ill and you want to facilitate her needs and help with any arrangements.

this is what you wrote on your OP:

So what would you do? I just feel like I'm constantly having to speak to her teacher about issues. Do I just keep her off on Swimming Gala day? Or contact her teacher about it? Should I ask to just work on the Maths at home? I'm exhausted with it all and just wish I could have my happy girl back.

Turns out you will just constantly have to speak to her teacher. So there’s no point posting on here is there?

Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 18/06/2022 16:37

godmum56 · 18/06/2022 16:15

I would keep her away from th3 swimming gala without a second thought. I think the maths thing needs the options looking at if there are any. I think its essential tgat she keeps feeling positive about school esoecially given that she has long covis and will find it an effort anyway. I do get the importance of learning to swim but don't see a gala as contributing to that.....and I am so grateful that some of the push shove make her get on with it types on here were not my mother!

Thank you, that seems sensible. I'm not even sure what the Gala will involve so I'll find that out as aside from the anxiety it might not be suitable for her physically.

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 18/06/2022 16:42

Instantnoodles · 18/06/2022 16:17

If you're sure that the problem with the gala is preference- rather than health-related, I think that I would send her in and praise her afterwards. Getting through it might be a confidence boost after the scary time of being ill.

If she will do the maths at home and it's not a taught session I'd request that she's put back in the computer lesson. This sounds like the more productive and confidence boosting option.

Yes, I'm not actually sure about if the Gala will be suitable physically anyway. I don't think it is just preference, I think it is anxiety related but it may be also due to her struggling with swimming due to her physical fitness If it is a case of something she could manage physically, I think it's a fine line between something that will exacerbate her anxiety or as you say something that could be a confidence booster.

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 18/06/2022 16:43

CoffeeWithCheese · 18/06/2022 16:18

DD1 is the same age and if you ask her about her likes and dislikes she will always always have a massive whinge... you'd think she has the hardest life in the world from the way she goes on and you'd think she was useless at maths when actually she's fairly near top of the class and doing really well at it! Just mentioning that since I know ALL her friends that age are right mardy buggers anyway - it seems to be a 10 year old girl thing.

I'd let the swimming gala ride - but I'd try to work with school in that she goes and does the session as a helper in some kind of role so she doesn't get the idea she can opt in and out of school curriculum stuff. The Maths support... I'd be talking to school that she's really upset she's losing the same lesson that she really enjoys every week - could they look into rotating the slot somewhat (I used to work in a school where they did that with instrument lessons so no one was consistently missing the same thing) or could she do the session time over a playtime or similar? I do have a bit of a pet hate of this idea of taking kids out of the stuff they enjoy to do more of what they're struggling with - yet still expecting them to enjoy school though.

Thanks, that's good advice.

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 18/06/2022 16:48

Basilbrushgotfat · 18/06/2022 16:20

Let her off the swimming, I don't believe any child should have to do extra cric if they're adamant they don't want to. And, importantly, with long covid she needs time to recover properly - proper convalescence. I agree with pp that it's a time to reduce demands on her.

Given that maths club is because she's behind I think she needs to go. You won't be doing her or her anxiety any favours if she doesnt catch up or if she falls further behind, and I speak as someone who missed huge amounts of schooling due to ill health.

If arrangements can be made that she doesn't have to miss her favourite lesson for it then that's great but I wouldn't drop maths it not. Make sure she's clear that it's a temporary measure and if she can bring her maths back up to where she needs to be then she can resume them. There can't be much more of term left so it might be that maths club (+ maybe tuition over summer) is enough and she can resume normal lessons in September.

It's been so hard with the Long Covid as I don't think she was able to have proper convalescence the way I did when I had it as there was the constant pressure to be in school. It may have cleared up by now if that wasn't the case.

I agree to a certain extent with the Maths, I wouldn't want her to not do it. And if it can't be accommodated a different time I would like to ask the question about it being at home. But if her teacher really feels she should attend then I'll follow that.

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 18/06/2022 16:50

oviraptor21 · 18/06/2022 16:25

I can't agree with this.
Hell would have frozen over before I registered any concern with my own school teachers.

She needs a note excusing her from the gala - she is not fit for it yet.
You need a discussion with maths teacher about undertaking the maths catch up in some other way so as not to impact on the subject she loves - at the moment it feels like she is being punished for getting covid when she's already being punished enough by having long covid.

Show quote history

I think it may well feel like that for her. I'm so upset that most likely this is going to have a big impact on her passing the 11+. It just feels so unfair.

OP posts:
Discovereads · 18/06/2022 16:58

Dahlly · 18/06/2022 15:50

So presumably she will have had a note from the doctor that she is fit to return to school and partake in sports, no?

Her dislikes are that she has to stand about and gets cold and doesn’t like having to get dressed quickly. Then all she needs to do is ask to wear a robe and to have 5 extra minutes to get changed. It’s not difficult.

I also don’t see how long covid plays a part in not wanting to go to maths group. That’s just a kid moaning that they don’t get to do what they want to do!

Show quote history

The two don’t go together. I have a DC with CFS (long covid is a type of post-viral CFS) and when she was able to return to school for full days (not every day of the week mind you), she was still unable to do any sports at all. The doctor has said she can do a bit of walking during PE but only if she feels up to it on that day. With any post-viral type of CFS you have to be very careful about fatigue management.

Long covid fatigue also affects cognition. Have you tried doing maths when you are so fatigued your brain won’t work? You can’t focus on anything in front of you, your working memory is shot? And this is a health condition where rest breaks do not make any difference. Which is why many DC going back to school after long covid have to start with part days and work up to full days.

Basilbrushgotfat · 18/06/2022 17:00

@Discovereads indeed. Not to mention that physical exertion has finally been recognised as worsening CFS symptoms, something sufferers have been saying for years.

steppemum · 18/06/2022 17:09

I'm a teacher.
I completely disagree with everythign Dahlly says in this case.
The first reply nailed it, due to long vocid, she has just returned to full days. Pace her, take it easy don't over do it, she needs to pace through the next 6 weeks, then summer holidays and hopefully more back to normal for Sept.

Miss the gala, it would be courtesy to tell school. She won't be there, she isn't well enough. I would be astonished if the school was surprised in this case.

Maths is harder, I would chat to teacher and ask if she can do it at home as she is so keen on computing. Then put in the effort at home to really do it.
I would alos tell dd, if you do xx per day for the next 2 weeks, fine, no maths catch up. If we don't then you will miss computing and go to maths catch up. that way there are clear parameters for all. (I would let school know that is what you are doing too)

Discovereads · 18/06/2022 17:09

@Basilbrushgotfat
Exactly. They’ve stopped the graduated exercise therapy because it made CFS sufferers worse not better. And long covid is a type of CFS.

A lot of people also don’t realise that the chronic fatigue isn’t just physical, it is also mental. It affects everything! My DC even today can be too tired to watch a film. The brain gets to a point and shuts down when you have CFS.

Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 18/06/2022 17:09

Dahlly · 18/06/2022 16:33

Then you’ve answered your own question then haven’t you? That you won’t make her ask, that you’ll do do it because she is ill and you want to facilitate her needs and help with any arrangements.

this is what you wrote on your OP:

So what would you do? I just feel like I'm constantly having to speak to her teacher about issues. Do I just keep her off on Swimming Gala day? Or contact her teacher about it? Should I ask to just work on the Maths at home? I'm exhausted with it all and just wish I could have my happy girl back.

Turns out you will just constantly have to speak to her teacher. So there’s no point posting on here is there?

Show quote history

I can't 'make' her ask. The only person we can truly control is ourselves, of course. But nor would I want to exacerbate her anxiety by attempting to 'make' her.

Well, I can agree there is no point to your replies to my posts. But happily I have been given some great advice, which was the point of my post.

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 18/06/2022 17:12

Discovereads · 18/06/2022 16:58

The two don’t go together. I have a DC with CFS (long covid is a type of post-viral CFS) and when she was able to return to school for full days (not every day of the week mind you), she was still unable to do any sports at all. The doctor has said she can do a bit of walking during PE but only if she feels up to it on that day. With any post-viral type of CFS you have to be very careful about fatigue management.

Long covid fatigue also affects cognition. Have you tried doing maths when you are so fatigued your brain won’t work? You can’t focus on anything in front of you, your working memory is shot? And this is a health condition where rest breaks do not make any difference. Which is why many DC going back to school after long covid have to start with part days and work up to full days.

Show quote history

I'm sorry to hear your DC has CFS. Must be tough.

OP posts:
Basilbrushgotfat · 18/06/2022 17:20

@Discovereads I couldn't agree more. I've suffered with several conditions of which fatigue is a main symptom. It's very, very different from feeling exhausted or wiped out from exhaustion from working too much, burning the candle and both ends, long days, sleepless nights etc. But if you have never experienced it, I think its impossible to imagine.

Discovereads · 18/06/2022 17:22

@UndertheCedartree
I'm sorry to hear your DC has CFS. Must be tough.

Yes it has been. She has had it for 6yrs now since she was 12. She had to take a full year off school because she became bed bound and was very poorly. But she’s turned a corner and it is gradually loosening it’s hold on her. Don’t feel bad about doing the arrangements with the school yourself. Long covid is a type of CFS and so you’re going through similar which a younger DC than mine. It’s better imho to have meetings with the SENCO at the school regularly to hash out their school schedule, accommodations, and so on all at once than have the DC ask random questions of individual teachers.

Don’t be shy about meeting with the school for your DC. They started accommodating when we too were on the wait list for the paediatric CFS consultant doctor and occupational therapist. At my DCs current school the SENCO lead has CFS and she was full of great ideas and support for my DC- so you don’t have to think of everything yourself. Things like a lift key so she wouldn’t have to take the stairs. A quiet room to go to with a pass card to show to teachers if the classroom gets too much. Setting up remote learning so if she’s too tired to go to school she can at least do a few hours work from home.