Unschooling - thoughts?

[Snickerdoodle1]

Recently got back in touch with an old school friend via Facebook, have mostly shared messages but last week we met properly for coffee and was good to see her again.

I'd never heard of it before but apparently she is 'unschooling' her DS - not the same as home ed as they never sit down and dedicate time to work, they just visit the occasional museum and forest school class but mostly just focus on being happy. They go on a lot of holidays and spend time will their fellow unschooling friends.

Her DS seems cheerful and positive so clearly she's doing something right but when I was discussing with DH later at home he said he thinks it's 'not fair' on someone not to equip them for life and work and adulthood.

Just wondering what other people's thoughts/opinions are on it?

A very large number leave school functionally illiterate and unable to do basic maths.

Which is a failure of schools. I’m not sure what it’s got to do with this discussion.

We unschooled my dc, they went into the schooling system in year 10 to do GCSEs then went onto college.
DC is on a gap year now before going off to uni in September.
It does work for some children, especially those that don’t fit in the the school system, ie SEN children. It’s just a different way of learning for them.

Home educating (not home schooling) encompasses a wide variety of philosophies and approaches to education, including school at home, the classical approach (heavy classical literature focus), Charlotte Mason style, to list a few off the top of my head. A lot of home educators use a mixture of methods, unschooling is typically following the child’s interests rather than having a rigid plan of what to do when.

Because people are holding conventional schooling up as some sort of intellectual panacea when that’s often far from the case.

Unschooled children (having met many of them) seem to be more curious and keen to learn, possibly because they follow their interests often to a very great level.

It hasn’t seemed to hold any back from accessing university or 6th form college, or vocational courses, or apprenticeships, so I’m not sure it’s accurate to say that this will hold them back.

In fact I would go so far as to say that compared to the local secondary school, the unschoolers have a higher rate of success when it comes to moving into higher education and beyond. Obviously this is a relatively small local group who met up and supported each other, and may not be representative of the whole UK population of unschoolers, but it really does seem to work. Not one of us decided to take this path so we could be lazy or neglectful though.

This is using too much that’s outside my sphere of knowledge.

This

I’m not coming from that position.
I’m trying to understand how this is different from the sorts of home education I’ve seen before.

It makes me laugh when they say home educators of any kind are lazy - if I was lazy, surely I’d be glad to palm my kids off for 9-3 and possibly an after school club later? No/very little food to cook, only a couple of hours until bedtime, wouldn’t have to look after the kids for most of the day and week…

I’m not for a minute saying all parents of schooled kids are lazy, just that if someone IS lazy, I’m not sure home education is what they’d choose.

I’ll simplify it - there’s different types of home ed, it’s an umbrella term. Unschooling is what’s used to refer to a child led, loose approach. Most home edders will use a mixture of methods rather than purely one type.

Because people talk as if not putting a child into the school system is 'worse' but statistically it is not worse. Some parents prefer to take control and give their kids a hgher standard of education and an education focused on their child's talents.

The assumption is often that kids who are home educated (whether with a curriculum or unschooled) are somehow impoverished and deprived of opportunities. They are not. They often have greater opportunities and more tailored opportunities. Schools are really very limited in what they can offer.

I have experience of teaching, of home educating and of school educating.

@PurpleDaisies HE usually follows a plan, rather like a curriculum, so topics that might run for a few weeks or so, like a school would, which includes many areas of learning.

Unschooling is letting the child lead what is happening, so following their interests and fitting in relevant learning within that. So a “topic” may last for weeks and weeks if the child finds it interesting.

I also find it amazing that if a child isn’t doing very well at school, people accept maybe the child isn’t talented in that particular area - whereas if a home ed child struggles, it must be because they’re home ed

but say she didn’t pick up much maths for arguments sake - maybe she old be an author, an artist or a musician? Maybe she would compose, maybe she’d write novels

The issue is that it isn't easy to make a living with any of these things, great as they might be, particularly when starting off.

Meanwhile basic qualifications in maths are a requirement for many jobs, including those that you might have to do to support yourself while trying to make it as a writer/musician.

Unless you're from a very rich background, or aren't going to support yourself for whatever reason, basic skills are important.

I can't find any other threads started by OP. Perhaps she name changes regularly.

There have been a few anti home ed threads on MN recently. At the same time, there is a new education bill proposed that will significantly restrict homeschooling.

To give an example, one of my kids is really interested in gardening. Loves it. Outside in all weathers, adores plants, loves growing things. A lot of his education centres on that. We use gardening to teach him pretty much everything. All his “lessons” are done outside if possible, and we relate everything back to it. We will do this for as long as he shows an interest.

And yes, he can count and read to a similar level of his peers. He doesn’t only know how to grow plants, before someone says that.

It’s not easy to make a living in general though - minimum wage jobs and cost of living crisis means even basic normal jobs don’t support you anymore. Anyway, and this is a personal thing, I think it’s more important to encourage children to follow their passions than to fit in, conform and do a dead end job because “that’s what you do”.
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I have also worked in standard normal job in the past and I’ve never been asked to prove my maths qualification. Plus you can sit GCSE maths as an adult anyway - which if you need it for a job, you’re probably more likely to do it well as you have a motivation rather than a kid who hates it and doesn’t want to do it. Learning doesn’t have to only be 5-16 in conventional school

Yes, it’s very interesting isn’t it. There’s also been loads of news articles with an anti home ed stance.

I did this with my two eldest until junior school age (around 7). They weren't impacted educationally but they are a lot more grown up and independent than my younger children who went through the school system from nursery.

Done properly it can be very positive but as parents you need to be committed to providing experiences and opportunities.

I agree this is likely - this topic is designed to goad and make people take an anti-HE position.

Many of my son’s peers who went to school didn’t achieve maths GCSE. Those who have gone on to apprenticeships have the opportunity to take them again, my son has the same opportunity.

My younger son was recently assessed for his English and maths ability before starting college. He was slightly below average for maths (they estimated he’d need a couple of months of tuition to catch up) but way above for English (comprehension, vocabulary etc), following 5 years out of school. It’s amazing how much children pick up when they’re not in an environment that’s hostile towards them.

Its increasingly difficult to access anything without at least level 1 functional skills in english and maths - most apprenticeships and jobs. But this is relevant to school children, homeschooled and unschooled.

@Blueyandbingosmum I have been on MN many years but recently changed username and account because of the data breach issue last week.

And @carefullycourageous I'm not being goady - had genuinely no experience of unschooling before. Shouldn't have posted in AIBU I suppose, would have been better in Chat!

It doesn't sound very conducive to stretching bright kids?

I was extremely good at maths for example. I could do quadratic equations by the time I was 10. That wouldn't have happened if I'd been doing cake baking maths.

It’s amazing how much children pick up when they’re not in an environment that’s hostile towards them

well I'm sure that's true, but the point is that it's not a good option for most people to forgo basic skills.

It’s not easy to make a living in general though - minimum wage jobs and cost of living crisis means even basic normal jobs don’t support you anymore. Anyway, and this is a personal thing, I think it’s more important to encourage children to follow their passions than to fit in, conform and do a dead end job because “that’s what you do”.

Which is why it's important to have a variety of options. Anyone I know who has made it in following their passions has been dependent on supporting themselves in more mundane jobs while they establish themselves